First time tracking a Rap/Hip-Hop artist this Sunday...

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Steve Henningsgard

Steve Henningsgard

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Any advice? I'm used to working with rock/metal bands, but the studio I'm interning at has an artist coming in this Sunday that they need me to track. I'd imagine he'll probably bring a buddy or two to track as well if I'm not totally mistaken, and I've been told he likes to work fast.

Since rap is such a different vocal style from singing/screaming, I'm not sure what to expect as far as dynamics (pretty straight-forward? uber-dynamic?), and thus I'm not sure how hard I'll want to compress on the way in.

Never mind the fact that I'm a suburban nerdy metal guy (which may or may not make any difference: I honestly don't know)

Any advice on what to expect?
 
Track it the way you would any other vocal. Start with a condenser and compress lightly on the way in. You'll probably be given a beat to import into your DAW and from there you may track one or two main vocals accompanied by one or two stacks including adlibs.

If he likes to work fast practice flying a hook around to get up to speed. Most of them don't know what the BPM for there beats are so chances are you're going to have to eyeball it.

Good Luck
 
Usually you should expect a LOT of "advice" from them, seems like many many of the rappers I come in contact with think they know what they doing and try and "explain" it to the producer of how it's done... Ignore them as you are an engineer and know way more in production than many of them can. :confused::eek:

As far as mixing goes, though it may be different, follow the same guidelines as any other music. I personally usually mix both rock & rap on a regular note. Show him how fast you can work. Before he can say cut, start over, you already having him live.

steve.h said:
Any advice? I'm used to working with rock/metal bands, but the studio I'm interning at has an artist coming in this Sunday that they need me to track. I'd imagine he'll probably bring a buddy or two to track as well if I'm not totally mistaken, and I've been told he likes to work fast.

Since rap is such a different vocal style from singing/screaming, I'm not sure what to expect as far as dynamics (pretty straight-forward? uber-dynamic?), and thus I'm not sure how hard I'll want to compress on the way in.

Never mind the fact that I'm a suburban nerdy metal guy (which may or may not make any difference: I honestly don't know)

Any advice on what to expect?
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bigwillz24 said:
Track it the way you would any other vocal. Start with a condenser and compress lightly on the way in. You'll probably be given a beat to import into your DAW and from there you may track one or two main vocals accompanied by one or two stacks including adlibs.

If he likes to work fast practice flying a hook around to get up to speed. Most of them don't know what the BPM for there beats are so chances are you're going to have to eyeball it.

Good Luck
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So would it be a good bet they'll wanna throw up a click on their beat? Or that it'll help me making edits/moving hooks around (a la grid mode?) I've only recently switched to Pro Tools from Sonar, so I'm not quite as fast as I was in Sonar, but I'm getting close. Do you think they'll want multiple takes to choose from? Thanks for the info!

Mindset said:
Usually you should expect a LOT of "advice" from them, seems like many many of the rappers I come in contact with think they know what they doing and try and "explain" it to the producer of how it's done... Ignore them as you are an engineer and know way more in production than many of them can. :confused::eek:

As far as mixing goes, though it may be different, follow the same guidelines as any other music. I personally usually mix both rock & rap on a regular note. Show him how fast you can work. Before he can say cut, start over, you already having him live.
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As always, thanks for the good advice :D I've apparently got to spread some green around before comin' back to you, but rest assured it's comin' (although at this point I'm not sure anyone would notice the jump haha). In general, my style has been to let the client figure out that I know what's up for himself, vs. trying to prove it to him or outright tell him: you think that'll work with him shooting over his 'advice' every couple of minutes?


Thanks for the help guys!
 
steve.h said:
So would it be a good bet they'll wanna throw up a click on their beat?
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They won't!


steve.h said:
Or that it'll help me making edits/moving hooks around (a la grid mode?)
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Yep that will help you out tremedously if you can find the BPM quick enough. Flying hooks and shit around should be a breeze.

steve.h said:
I've only recently switched to Pro Tools from Sonar, so I'm not quite as fast as I was in Sonar, but I'm getting close.
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Yeah I'm faster with cubase but had to learn my way around protools.

steve.h said:
Do you think they'll want multiple takes to choose from?
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That depends on the client and how much money they have for studio time. :D

The multiple takes are all used in the mix. But let the artist decide what route he/she wants to take. Like after he/she finishes his/her first take pop in on the talkback and ask him/her how he feels about the take, whether or not he/she wants to hear it back, if he/she wants to double or stack it etc...

I think if you comunicate with them they'll get you where you want to go.

steve.h said:
Thanks for the info
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np

Will
 
steve.h said:
Any advice? I'm used to working with rock/metal bands, but the studio I'm interning at has an artist coming in this Sunday that they need me to track. I'd imagine he'll probably bring a buddy or two to track as well if I'm not totally mistaken, and I've been told he likes to work fast.

Since rap is such a different vocal style from singing/screaming, I'm not sure what to expect as far as dynamics (pretty straight-forward? uber-dynamic?), and thus I'm not sure how hard I'll want to compress on the way in.

Never mind the fact that I'm a suburban nerdy metal guy (which may or may not make any difference: I honestly don't know)

Any advice on what to expect?
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1. Not to be racist or anything but 1st if your caucasian stand your ground at all times, and do not be intimidated by nonsense.

2. Keep the number of dudes around super minimal and have them focused at all times man, cause these rap junkies nowadays are to arrogant for some ass reason.

3. Now far as tracking, going in i dont really much comp goin in honestly and i wouldnt advise either.

4. The 1176 would be your best friend depending on the aggression of the artist so I always ask for reference material ahead of time.

5. 99.9% they walk in with 2 track mp3 or audio cd soo...... don't kill yourself.

6. Remember your in the control seat but its ok to give in constructive criticism but like i said if their numbskulls let them destroy their own product if they wont accept it.

7. Yes im ahole but I have to keep a good name for whatever im working on with whomever and respect n humbleness is what I deserve from anyone because I will tell someone in a heartbeat take your behind home fruityloops and run your cracks all day but thats just me.

8. Back to the program, keep the reverb light but delay is another good thingy.

9. Again the 1176 on drums and lead vox and thats it!

Peace, don't take anything I said personal just telling you from a lifetime of experience.
 
.?. What does him being white (or any other color for that matter) have anything to do with him recording?
 
You WILL get a lot of arrogant numbskulls in there.

My approach to it is
Match his speed. If you can keep up with him, he'll show respect towards you for it (because he'll feel like you're trying to work with him and not against him). Try the mix completely dry after a couple of takes. Try to work with the one he likes best and then add the extra seasoning to spice up the track.

Rap and rock really isn't much different as far as vocals go. Both have presence in their vocals....if you have ever recorded pop songs before, it's very similar. I do know that you can get more presence with rap vocals by adding nice reverb (just not too much), doubling tracks, and panning efficiently. I know it's been said before but you're probably better off if you can track the bpm of the beat. If he brings material of work he's done with the studio before, I'd suggest listening at least to a verse to get acquainted to mixes that he's comfortable with.

You already got quite a bit of good advice here, most of it from people who rap and produce tracks and mixing.
 
bigwillz24 said:
.?. What does him being white (or any other color for that matter) have anything to do with him recording?
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im half n half and the reaction is diff when my family is in the studio an those dickheads roll through I have to go show my ass. But besides that I gave him some jewels.
 
bigwillz24 said:
.?. What does him being white (or any other color for that matter) have anything to do with him recording?
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I think the difference is that brothas been known to try to Suge Knight a white dude when they on him...especially when they outnumber the white dude.
 
Fieva said:
I think the difference is that brothas been known to try to Suge Knight a white dude when they on him...especially when they outnumber the white dude.
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that sounds gay

sorry for the ignorance but whats a suge knight
 
For some reason, a lot of rappers believe they are/will be the biggest thing to ever hit the rap game and that their album will change the way rap is done. Not saying your client will be this way, but be aware that he/she definately could be.

As for dynamics, SOME of this will depend on the skill of the artist. Usually you'll know right away if he/she is garbage.

Ametures usually have VERY poor mic technique. A lot of them read their lyrics from paper (and sound exactly like they're reading). These are just some worst case scenarios so I'm not telling you to expect these things....just know that they CAN happen so be prepared.

I've recorded guys so bad that I often found myself saying things like "Are you speaking toward the mic?" or (during punch-ins) "You have to say that line in the same tone you did the previous one" as well as "No...if you don't shout it I can't make it sound like you're shouting with a *shout button*" or even "You don't have to add the delay effect yourself...I can do it in the mix"...:D

On the other hand I've worked with some great artists who knew how to "work the mic", had great dynamics, great lyrics and even better delivery.
 
Trell Blaze said:
I've recorded guys so bad that I often found myself saying things like "Are you speaking toward the mic?" or (during punch-ins) "You have to say that line in the same tone you did the previous one" as well as "No...if you don't shout it I can't make it sound like you're shouting with a *shout button*" or even "You don't have to add the delay effect yourself...I can do it in the mix"...:D
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:D Man that's spot on!
 
bigwillz24 said:
:D Man that's spot on!
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I'm sure you have more experience with that than I do. How do you adress these kinds of problems without pratically saying "You're an idiot with no talent...".

If Steve has to deal with that sort of thing, it would do him a lot of good to at least know how to be PC about it...
 
Trell Blaze said:
I'm sure you have more experience with that than I do. How do you adress these kinds of problems without pratically saying "You're an idiot with no talent...".

If Steve has to deal with that sort of thing, it would do him a lot of good to at least know how to be PC about it...
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This is where good people skills comes into play. And it is also more of a producer role than a engineer IMO.

Everyone has there own way of dealing with these type situations. Mine is to work the artist into trusting me with his/her baby (that song is always there baby). Be calm and assertive and make the artists feel like you actually give a crap more often than not yeilds a positive performance.

Sometimes being blunt works but you got to be careful with this one. Like for mic technique... I'll tell the artist something like man it looks like your sucking a dick all close up on that mic like that kinda laugh afterwards to play it off as a joke. Offensive but works. :p

For the paper readers I try to get them to imagine they are actors or the person they are writing about is the microphone. If there mad, in love whatever... it works. After a couple of runs if we have time I'll have them give it a go without the paper by that time it's either good from memory or bad.

And last but not least (I actually feel like this is the hardest and most imprtant) make them feel as if they accomplished something by the time they leave your studio. Make them feel good about there work. Even if you think it's the crappiest shit you ever heard.
 
bigwillz24 said:
And last but not least (I actually feel like this is the hardest and most imprtant) make them feel as if they accomplished something by the time they leave your studio. Make them feel good about there work. Even if you think it's the crappiest shit you ever heard.
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I agree. That requires good acting skills in some cases.

I think Steve will be ok...:D
 
steve.h said:
Haha, what do you mean by that exactly?
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I mean with all the advise you've gotten, I expect the session to go without disaster...:)

Besides, from reading your posts, you seem to know what you're doing anyway...
 
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