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  • Thread starter Thread starter 7string
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7string said:
Ok... suppose I dump the two extra acoustic's (although I do like the fuller sound of multiple acoustic's) what would you do with the remaining? Pan left/right? Leave it up the middle? Just looking for ideas.

7
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If the tracks are played from the same guitar, pan them hard from each other, unless they sound good blended (mine generally don't, I tend to play them a bit different to give each guitar it's own voice in the mix).
 
7, the second one is much better. But there is a frequency goin' on in there that makes it hard on the ears. I know you said EQ is your Achilles heel but imho the song needs some. The hi hat is a bit harsh, I like the snare ok, I think the lead vocal could be thinned out a little. But I liked the song. You're good.
Good Luck.
 
I would use the least processed a.guitar track-copy it-pan 9:00 and 3:00- slide one of those tracks over 1 or 2 ms to give it a bit of separation and maybe EQ one of them a bit to make it sound a little different from the other.
 
7string said:
Ok... suppose I dump the two extra acoustic's (although I do like the fuller sound of multiple acoustic's) what would you do with the remaining? Pan left/right? Leave it up the middle? Just looking for ideas.

7
Click to expand...

Either double the acoustic track exactly and pan each hard r/l, or use a capo for the 2nd part, playing a slightly different chord configuration (this will minimize phasing issues if the track is listened to in mono). Again, pan hard, or almost all the way. I EQ both tracks essentially the same and usually cut most of the lows off my acoustic tracks for a full band mix (up to 200-250Hz). I don't like to boost any upper range EQ, as it can really make them sound thin and harsh. You may want that "clicky" pick sounding strum that is so prevalent in alot of pop/country music. There is virtually no bass on those types of tracks, just enough upper mids to give the "impression" of an acoustic guitar.

The key, I think, is to make sure each instrument/voice has a specific place in the mix in terms of frequency range, panning, and depth. Here's a good article on making frequency cuts/boosts:
http://www.digitalprosound.com/2002/03_mar/tutorials/mixing_excerpt1.htm


The 2 songs in my sig were both done with doubled guitars panned left and right. I'm still learning about all this, too, so they aren't perfect, but should give you an idea of what I'm talking about.
 
Rokket said:
If the tracks are played from the same guitar, pan them hard from each other, unless they sound good blended (mine generally don't, I tend to play them a bit different to give each guitar it's own voice in the mix).
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Yes the tracks are played from the same guitars. Read on...
 
Rockr56 said:
7, the second one is much better. But there is a frequency goin' on in there that makes it hard on the ears. I know you said EQ is your Achilles heel but imho the song needs some. The hi hat is a bit harsh, I like the snare ok, I think the lead vocal could be thinned out a little. But I liked the song. You're good.
Good Luck.
Click to expand...

And the Achille's Heel part comes in trying to find WHERE... ;)

Thanks for the compliment!
 
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Rockr56 said:
I would use the least processed a.guitar track-copy it-pan 9:00 and 3:00- slide one of those tracks over 1 or 2 ms to give it a bit of separation and maybe EQ one of them a bit to make it sound a little different from the other.
Click to expand...

The guitars were triple tracked and each was EQ'd a bit different. The middle freq's were straight up. The lower freq's were panned hard left and brought up just to where they started to color the sound and then backed off a bit. The higher freq's were panned hard right and brought up just enough to where they started to color the sound and then backed off a bit.
 
scrubs said:
Either double the acoustic track exactly and pan each hard r/l, or use a capo for the 2nd part, playing a slightly different chord configuration (this will minimize phasing issues if the track is listened to in mono). Again, pan hard, or almost all the way. I EQ both tracks essentially the same and usually cut most of the lows off my acoustic tracks for a full band mix (up to 200-250Hz). I don't like to boost any upper range EQ, as it can really make them sound thin and harsh. You may want that "clicky" pick sounding strum that is so prevalent in alot of pop/country music. There is virtually no bass on those types of tracks, just enough upper mids to give the "impression" of an acoustic guitar.

The key, I think, is to make sure each instrument/voice has a specific place in the mix in terms of frequency range, panning, and depth. Here's a good article on making frequency cuts/boosts:
http://www.digitalprosound.com/2002/03_mar/tutorials/mixing_excerpt1.htm


The 2 songs in my sig were both done with doubled guitars panned left and right. I'm still learning about all this, too, so they aren't perfect, but should give you an idea of what I'm talking about.
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I've thought about the capo and know that this is a favorite trick in Nashville, but at this point I'd have to go cut down a tree and fashion one, which would irritate all the tree huggers as well as the animals that use them. ;)

I don't want to give the impression of an acoustic guitar. I want it heard. I was told of this triple tracking trick that I mentioned in an earlier post years ago by an engineer who worked on a Bob Seger album (forget which - 9 Tonight maybe?) and he even mentioned doing one track with a capo. The intent is to give the acoustic guitar a much wider spread. Guess I missed on that too.

I listened to the two songs earlier this morning before court. I liked them! Oh, and I own the Mixing Engineers Handbook.
 
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7string said:
I've thought about the capo and know that this is a favorite trick in Nashville, but at this point I'd have to go cut down a tree and fashion one, which would irritate all the tree huggers as well as the animals that use them. ;)

I don't want to give the impression of an acoustic guitar. I want heard. I was told of this triple tracking trick that I mentioned in an earlier post years ago by an engineer who worked on a Bob Seger album (forget which - 9 Tonight maybe?) and he even mentioned doing one track with a capo. The intent is to give the acoustic guitar a much wider spread. Guess I missed on that too.

I listened to the two songs earlier this morning before court. I liked them!
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It may be a case of over kill, but I would have to try this trick with triple tracking my guitar to see if I could do it. So the idea is that each of the 3 tracks is eq'd differently? Then doubled and panned hard? Or are you playing it 6 different times? I'm sorry if I am frustrating you, I'm just trying to figure out what is going on so that I can help.
 
Rokket said:
It may be a case of over kill, but I would have to try this trick with triple tracking my guitar to see if I could do it. So the idea is that each of the 3 tracks is eq'd differently? Then doubled and panned hard? Or are you playing it 6 different times? I'm sorry if I am frustrating you, I'm just trying to figure out what is going on so that I can help.
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I play them three times only. Then apply the EQ and panning trick. You're not frustrating me. You're HELPING me. There's a difference. Except when it came to my ex-wife. Her helping me was frustrating me. ;)
 
Ok, remix #2. This is what I did based on feedback on the first two mixes.

Cut some of the highs on the cymbals.
Thinned out the bass guitar even more.
Backed off on the panned hard left (mid-freq) acoustic guitar.
Raised the center acoustic guitar level and panned it 25% left.
Backed off on the panned hard right (high-freq) acoustic guitar.
Left the twin hook guitars alone.
Left the twin solo guitars alone.
Raised the lead vocal a bit.
Dumped the left backup vocal.
Adjusted the center (third) backup vocal and right (fifth) backup vocal to try to find a balance.
Re-EQ'd the tail vocal at the end and panned it farther right (25 to 30%)

 
I think the vocals are way too loud and the backing track sounds as if it is another room.

You're getting there though. Most importantly, how does it souund to you?
 
It's a lot better. A lot of the mud has been cleaned up, but yeah, the lead vocal is a tad too loud. I would try to bring up the lead and bring down the vocal so that they match and get a real smooth transition to the interlude. It's sounding better all the time, and I really like the timbre of your voice.
 
Thanks to both of you! I agree but somebody said the vocal needed to be up a bit more. Originally I wanted it to sit lower. It would bring out the acoustic guitars a bit more. And I'm having a hard time bringing out the quieter parts of the lead vocal going into and during the chorus.
 
much better.

ride is still bright to me but not painfull.
i'd rethink how i tracked acu's in the future.

much, much better though.
 
giraffe said:
much better.

ride is still bright to me but not painfull.
i'd rethink how i tracked acu's in the future.

much, much better though.
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Thanks for the response! I've got a lot on my mind right now with this fight to keep my mother out of a nursing home. So forgive me if this is easy: What's acu's?

I'll go in and search for the hi-hat and ride freqs and pull them down a bit more. I need to find some EQ suggestions for a drum machine track. Since everything is on one track it's much harder. With mine, though, I don't put the crashes on while tracking. I add them later on separate tracks.

Thanks again.
 
giraffe said:
oops...
clean electric :p
still my point is the same
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Thanks! I've been working mostly on getting a good clean, clear FULL bass guitar tone with the EQ. But my inexperience is a huge hindrance. But I can actually hear a difference for the better with each tip that I try. Thanks again!
 
@ 7string
This is getting better!
No need for me to try to remix this - your getting there.
Still a tad too much verb on the vocals?
Try to pan the backing vocals a tad more to the left(guitar trills side).
I would use more verb or effects on the solo guitar, but I know a lot of people would disagree with me on that.
Keep it up.
 
Emusic said:
@ 7string
This is getting better!
No need for me to try to remix this - your getting there.
Still a tad too much verb on the vocals?
Try to pan the backing vocals a tad more to the left(guitar trills side).
I would use more verb or effects on the solo guitar, but I know a lot of people would disagree with me on that.
Keep it up.
Click to expand...

Ya mean I zipped all these tracks up for nothing?!?!?!?! ;) I only have a delay on the lead vocals. And the backups are panned left, center and right, about 25 to the sides. I'll try a touch of verb on the solo guitars and see what happens. Maybe it will help them blend. Thanks!
 
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