First Mixing job as a "professional"

Too harsh/compressed for me, dude. Hard to listen to even at my usual moderately loud listening volume. I had to turn my speakers down to avoid ear damage. For example, I was just listening to a newish NOFX album (Coaster) through my setup here. That's a professionally mastered punk album. I can crank that thing loud and it doesn't thrash my ears. I had to turn this down from where I was listening to that NOFX album. I can handle loud, but it's gotta be ear pleasing. This hurts. Sorry bro. You gotta rethink your mix and mastering strategies.
 
I can understand the too compressed part, but by harsh do you mean harsh high end? Because I put a lot of effort into low-passing/taming the high end of each instrument in the mix.

As for being overly compressed, they kind of wanted that sound of everything blending/being one sound. I maybe could back off the compression/clipping on the master bus though.
 
FadeToMuffins said:
I can understand the too compressed part, but by harsh do you mean harsh high end? Because I put a lot of effort into low-passing/taming the high end of each instrument in the mix.

As for being overly compressed, they kind of wanted that sound of everything blending/being one sound. I maybe could back off the compression/clipping on the master bus though.
Click to expand...

Harsh like...high mid stack-up + compression + loud = harsh. Please post up a mix with nothing done to it. No mastering, no master bus compression, just the raw pre-master mix. I'd like to hear it to see if it's a problem in your mix, or with your mastering process. (Or you can PM it to me if you want). It's definitely not boomy. It's like the opposite of boomy.
 
(I'm only listening via a laptop on small headphones, so take what I say with a grain of salt but....

Bit much high end for me - some of that's not mix related - I think the drumming suffers a little from the (I thnk - limitations of headphones) constant cymballing going in the second section of the song... bit more decent snare action would make the song work better IMO...and give it a more "dynamic" feel - I wanted to hear the guy go a bit nuts there.... but that's not a mix thing obviously.

Lke Gerg, I instinctively turned it down a notch from what I normally listen at..
 
I actually thought it wasn't as harsh as Greg was hearing until the 1:56 mark hit, then I changed my mind and fully agree with his assessment. It's probably too much 3-5k that's stacking up, but I'm listening through headphones currently.
 
It's too got-dang loud! (Cool song though... and the mixing is, by and large, very pro sounding!)

-Adam.
 
Shiny Rhino said:
I actually thought it wasn't as harsh as Greg was hearing until the 1:56 mark hit, then I changed my mind and fully agree with his assessment. It's probably too much 3-5k that's stacking up,.
Click to expand...

Yup, its way over compressed and harsh.

Its a good idea to post the mix (if you can) before its been crushed and go from there.
 
Just got back from the studio with a copy of the mix with all the master bus plugs turned off. I'll post that in just a second...

I think I'm cool with the loudness/compression level pretty much everywhere except for the end of the song. I agree it gets a bit harsh there. If I could find a way to make that section distort less that would be ideal.

OK, here is a link to the unmastered version. Yeah, I know the snare seems loud... This version isn't quite the same as the first I posted. When I was at the studio I met with the singer and had him record a few overdubs during the chorus. That plus I also did some EQ work on the toms and the snare, which now that I hear I'm not sure I am a fan of.

http://www.lightningmp3.com/live/file.php?id=29157
 
Last edited:
FadeToMuffins said:
Just got back from the studio with a copy of the mix with all the master bus plugs turned off. I'll post that in just a second...

I think I'm cool with the loudness/compression level pretty much everywhere except for the end of the song. I agree it gets a bit harsh there. If I could find a way to make that section distort less that would be ideal.

OK, here is a link to the unmastered version. Yeah, I know the snare seems loud... This version isn't quite the same as the first I posted. When I was at the studio I met with the singer and had him record a few overdubs during the chorus. That plus I also did some EQ work on the toms and the snare, which now that I hear I'm not sure I am a fan of.

http://www.lightningmp3.com/live/file.php?id=29157
Click to expand...
Your mix (in my opinion) is superb! It sounds beautiful.

-Adam.
 
FadeToMuffins said:
Just got back from the studio with a copy of the mix with all the master bus plugs turned off. I'll post that in just a second...

I think I'm cool with the loudness/compression level pretty much everywhere except for the end of the song. I agree it gets a bit harsh there. If I could find a way to make that section distort less that would be ideal.

OK, here is a link to the unmastered version. Yeah, I know the snare seems loud... This version isn't quite the same as the first I posted. When I was at the studio I met with the singer and had him record a few overdubs during the chorus. That plus I also did some EQ work on the toms and the snare, which now that I hear I'm not sure I am a fan of.

http://www.lightningmp3.com/live/file.php?id=29157
Click to expand...

Yeah, see I cranked that mix there and it didn't hurt my ears. It didn't sound great, but it didn't hurt. So, to me at least, it's your mastering process that's killing you. I'm no mastering guru, but here's what I'd try to do with a mix like this: only compress/limit to suit the densest part of the song. The quieter intro shouldn't be as wild as the end part anyway. Pass the mix through a series of compressors/limiters with an EQ check inbetween. Set each compressor/limiter to gently apply compression in steps instead of hitting it hard with just one. Listen as you turn each compressor on. If things start getting hairy, slap a parametric EQ in there and gently tweak. Then keep compressing & EQ'ing as necessary. I guess it will depend on the programming of the plug-ins, but this little trick can work. And remember: you're probably not gonna compete with professional mastering. A few plugs in a DAW aint gonna compare with professional mastering equipment and know-how. It's better to sound good than be ear crushing loud.
 
FadeToMuffins said:
I agree it gets a bit harsh there. If I could find a way to make that section distort less that would be ideal.

http://www.lightningmp3.com/live/file.php?id=29157
Click to expand...

My suggestion would be to dull the instruments in those parts,(they wont sound dull after you master) solo those instruments (loudly) find the meat and likewise what is harsh, lo-pass the meat and roll down anything harsh.

I agree the snare is the foremost sound, where the lead vox should be.

Thanks for posting the mix, overall its a real nice work, and performance, a few more tweaks and your there.

Pete
 
I think a big part of the harshness issue is the singer want's every line of the song to be belted out at his maximum volume. It just never stops. And his voice has a lot of midrange energy. After about a minute I want to turn it off.

Those guitars that come in at about 1:56 are a bit midrangey too.

But my biggest problem is the singer.
 
TripleM said:
I think a big part of the harshness issue is the singer want's every line of the song to be belted out at his maximum volume. It just never stops. And his voice has a lot of midrange energy. After about a minute I want to turn it off.

Those guitars that come in at about 1:56 are a bit midrangey too.

But my biggest problem is the singer.
Click to expand...

Yeah that singer is pretty brutal.
 
Wow... Just listened to the first posted mix, and it's crazy loud. During the middle parts, it seems like I'm hearing some serious, continuous clipping. Lower the volume, dude.
 
I just wanted to thank everyone for taking the time to listen to it and comment. You guys have all been very helpful.

Greg, you pointed out to me a critical step in my "mastering" process that I was forgetting. I never actually was applying any EQ when I mastered - I would clip, compress, clip, compress, clip, compress,..., limit. Once I noticed things getting hairy I did parametric EQ sweeps and notched out frequencies that seemed noisier than the should be, and that alone cleaned things up a lot.

I also noticed that I was depending too much on the mastering process to get the snare to sound how I wanted. I applied some clipping and compression and analog saturation to my drum bus and that alone lowered the peaks on my master fader as well as gave my snare drum that vintage compression "smack" I wanted it to have before I even started work on the master bus.

I'll post a link here in a sec, but yeah, just wanted to say thanks to everyone for commenting and helping me out.
 
I'm curious what you mean by 'applied some clipping and compression'?

Look forward to hearing the updated mix. :)
 
FadeToMuffins said:
I applied some clipping and compression and analog saturation to my drum bus and that alone lowered the peaks on my master fader as well as gave my snare drum that vintage compression "smack" I wanted it to have before I even started work on the master bus.
.
Click to expand...

Yeah wtf is "adding clipping"? :eek: :cursing: :drunk:
 
I have to agree with most folk: the "mastered" version is just loud & dangerously harsh. The mix is fine but the source material, as demonstrated by the unplugged version, needs gentler treatment. The slow build in mastering that Greg explained is the way for you to go as you'll be able to address things as they develop &, as there as no major leaps forward, the progress will...hang on a sec. I can't even concentrate to type with the "mastered" version on. Off now, where was I? Yeah, baby steps mate - until you learn to hear & anticipate you'll need to take baby steps, It's called mastering because it's THE version & the engineered has mastered the problems of the final mix having mastered the skills of a) hearing whilst actually listening and having sufficient depth in the tool box to pull out the right spanner to throw in the works. You'll get there - I don't try anymore because I know my ears aren't good enough.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top