First drum recordings

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stethedrumgeek

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Hello all

recently I made this recording (
)

It's just a test so I can get to grips with the equipment and I was just messing about at the time, so please dont judge it musically. I set the rough levels in cubase.

I recorded using 2 Oktava mc 012's as overheads, spaced about a foot apart, two feet above cymbals, sm 57 on snare and akg d112 on the kick, off centre halfway in, although I think I should have had it much closer to the batter head, it also picked up quite a bit of bleed. The kit was in the middle of bedroom 12' x 12' with a middle to heigh ceiling.

I know the snare is buzzing all the way through, which I think I can solve with a little dampening on the underside... plus theres a bit of ring from the snare, which I can damp ontop. However, although I like the sound and feel of the snare, it doesnt seem to have the right amount of balls to it, infact, it has no balls.

Could this be a tuning issue? Or more to do with mic placement? Or both?

Another thing I'm not sure about is the level of the toms in relation to the cymbals- are the cymbals too loud? I only have overheads to pick the toms up. I've read many tutorials on miking a kit up with tom mics to beef it up, but not just with overheads.

I know a lot of the process is due to experimentation, which I plan to do over the next few weeks. I also have a room twice the size of the room I recorded the tests in, will this give a fuller sound in the OH's?

I've messed around with EQ and compression, but to be honest, I want to try and get a sound I'm happy with before I move onto that stage (and its learning curve), when I record some songs for real. But I'd be interested to hear any comments about that too?

Any comments are appreciated, but please bear in mind this is my first drum tracking and excuse my lack of knowledge.

For matter of reference, my favourite drum sound is in Room Temperature Lounge by Don Caballero, bit obscure but its a big airy sound.

Cheers!
Stephen
 
Personally, i like the snare, but thats just me.

The bass drum seems to be lacking. It needs to be a lot louder, so try moving the mic closer to the batter.
 
I like the crash/ride recording and the toms. Kick is too thin IMHO. Snare I aint sure if I like that way.
Keep it up. Must be some job to mic up/record a drumset. Glad I'm totally lost on drums. Then I dont have to bother :)
 
I usually put a mic inside the bass drum about 3 inches away from the head right in the middle, and sometimes one mic getting the Pantera-ish clicky sound from the beaters. I don't put resonant heads on my toms and put overtone rings on my toms for a more controlled sound, especially when mic'd from the bottom of the toms. I use hydraulic heads on my toms and bass drum and a dry snare head. I individually mic every tom. The snare I also individually mic and have the bottom head very tight and the springs very tight to reduce the buzz as much as possible (although I use a piccolo so I can do that, if you have a standard or marching snare I would say get a staccato pad thing because I think those help?). I usually have 2 condensers for overheads, one almost directly over my hi-hat and 1 almost directly over my ride. If you have a nicely tuned drumset to the ear before recording it pays off a lot in your recordings. Try putting a mic inside your bass drum if you can and maybe using an EQ to get rid of the extremely low frequencies and turn up the normal lows and maybe turn down some low/mids so you get more of a thud bass drum and less of a pff. I think you need to turn up the bass drum, leave the snare, turn down the high hat, and maybe turn down the toms a little. I think it could use a little bit of compression also, but don't get carried away. You have the right idea so far though. If you personally like the sound of something compared to your favorite recording, leave it, but if you post more I can help you figure out volume issues and so-forth. Keep drumming. Peace
 
hi!

first impressions (if i was handed this to mix...)
1- snare sounds good to me, at least a good starting point
2- cymbals sound awful (mostly the cymbals themselves, and to some degree the miking tecnique) sounds like $5 cymbals...sorry
3- toms sound good from what i heard
4- Kick certainly needs help (sounds like the first step is to re-tune it!)
 
Thanks for all the response

I had another go today in a different room... not much difference. Went to tune the bass drum, not a great difference. All the cymbals are pretty crappy, one has a huge crack in it, so i think it's time for a new crash and hats.

I've managed to get rid of any buzz on the snare, but I like some ring in the snare too... bit of a trade off.

I'm at a bit of a loss with the cymbals, because if it is the micing technique then my toms sound OK but I'm relying on the OH's for the cymbals and the toms, so if one sounds good, the other probably wont... which isnt much use. Apart from close micing my toms (which I cant do) any suggestions on OH technique?

Paranoid- any tips on tuning the BD? Higher or lower tension on the batter would you say? Do I need less dampening inside?

Cheers, I appreciate all the feedback!
 
Are you using a felt beater? Wood will help. And yes, take as much of the muffling out as you can and tune the head low. You might want to leave a blanket or something in the drum to keep the reflections down.
 
Hi Farview

Yeah, I'm using two felt beaters, I'll see if I can give wood or plastic a try, I took most of the muffling out and it sounds better to my ears. I'll buy a new head tommorrow, as this one is the yamaha head i got with the kit, maybe a remo black dot or something like that? Something with more attack. I'll enquire about different beaters too.

Tah!

Stephen
 
People stopped using black dots 15 years ago. I use Evans EMAD heads now. I used to use Remo powerstroke heads. I you use a round wood or plastic beater, be sure to get a kevlar patch to put on the head to keep from putting a hole in it.
 
WOW, do they still sell black dots? (Joke)
I agree, go with the Evans, the Remo Powerstrokes are nice also, I have found I prefer the Evans. I luv the sound of wood beaters, give them a try.
 
haha... I have a black dot on my snare, I only bought it two years ago!
I'll give them both a try, right now I've got the small felt beaters that came with the iron cobra, I like the weight of them so I'll be interested to see if it throws me off my doubles completely.

Thanks for all the help!
 
PS: Tried the 'recorderman' method after reading about it in another thread and things seem to sound quite a bit nicer, except my cymbals still sound like a bunch of coppers on a china plate. I'd recommend it, everything sounds more balanced.
 
stethedrumgeek said:
haha... I have a black dot on my snare, I only bought it two years ago!
I'll give them both a try, right now I've got the small felt beaters that came with the iron cobra, I like the weight of them so I'll be interested to see if it throws me off my doubles completely.

Thanks for all the help!
Click to expand...
Did you have to special order the black dot? You might want to get that head off of your snare too. I use an Evans Genera HD Dry most of the time. If I need more high end, I switch to a Remo clear emperor. You have been watching too much VH-1 Classic. The Black Dots were designed to be good on toms that didn't have a bottom head. They were the thing to have in 1978 but most people moved on to pinstripes in the 80's (where I seem stuck sometimes)
Tama makes beaters just like your felt ones, only they have a piece of wood insted of the felt. The weight is no different. The big wooden beaters do weigh a lot more than the iron cobras.
 
Hi again Farview

I've used the Evans Genera heads on snare before, although not mine, at gigs and theyre OK. I like the tight sound of the black dot on the snare, but it doesnt give much and buzz rolls are a bit of a nightmare, completely unforgiving, but it doesnt take a lot of dampening. They do give a good crack when tuned high in their defense.

Special ordering them, nope, just bought it in a shop down the road. Theyre still about? http://www.massmusic.net/shop/?shop=1&cat=781
I'll give a coated evans head a try like you said, although they always seemed to throw out some nasty overtones, it's probably that I was just playing cheap-o heads.

As for the VH-1 classic! I can only get terrestrial TV (thank god) and I was born in 84!
 
If you use the hd dry heads, you need to line the vents up with the lugs. That will keep it from ringing (assuming they are tuned well) If you put the vents between the lugs, it will ring a lot. It gives you some control over how much ring you want.
 
StudioMxpx >
The actual sound, sounds good to me but I'm no expert. Something sounds a bit off with the cymbals, maybe its the way they were played? I think maybe a metronome would help a bit too, timing is a bit rough. I like the sound though.
 
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