fill up whole spectrum

[djclueveli]

when it comes to mixing, is it best to fill up the whole spectrum? if so can u explain this to me. what if you don't have that many sounds in the mix? do you just eq the hell out of each sound with lows and highs so it can fill up the whole spectrum?

 

[danny.guitar]

what if you don't have that many sounds in the mix? do you just eq the hell out of each sound with lows and highs so it can fill up the whole spectrum?

Yeah if you want everything to sound like shit.

When you hear a good song are you thinking "wow this is a good song" or are you thinking "pretty good song but is it filling up the whole spectrum?"

I just don't see why you would want to do that. If it sounds good it is good. If it's lacking something, add to it or take away the opposite, if it's too overpowering lower it. This goes for bass, mids and treble.

 

[elementary]

If you're recording a rock band there'll usually be too much sound floating around and some selective EQ cuts will help clear up the mix and create space.
Try cutting everything but kick and bass in the lowest frequencies to give them more space.
Try and picture each instruments place in the mix (very very roughly kick/bass-low end, guitars/snare/vocals-midrange and cymbals etc-high end) and put them together like a jig saw.
If you jump in boosting like crazy you'll very quickly end up with a fight for room in the mix, and a crap sounding recording.

Above all, experiment and reference music you like constantly and you'll find something that works.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

when it comes to mixing, is it best to fill up the whole spectrum? if so can u explain this to me. what if you don't have that many sounds in the mix? do you just eq the hell out of each sound with lows and highs so it can fill up the whole spectrum?

How well the spectrum can or cannot be "filled" depends mostly upon the instrument selection, the arrangement, and the tracking. Trying to get a mix track to go somewhere in the spectrum that it was not designed or created to go is usually a mistake.

From the mixing perspective, it's probably more productive to think of it not as trying to "fill the spectrum" as it is "giving each track it's own space". But it's usually best to emphasize timbres that the instrument already has and to use those to select it's place in the spectral dimension, not to try and bend and shape it to try and give it a timbre it is not ready for just because there's a "hole" in the spectrum somewhere else. For example if you have two guitars that are either different models or run through different mics or amps, etc., chances are when compared to each other, one guitar will sound a bit fuller and the other a bit brighter. Use that to your advantage using differential EQ and such to emphasize that leading characteristic in each guitar.

And when you have two tracks that are sonically very similar and can't be pushed too far apart via EQ, that's OK; work wth that then. Don't force them apart spectrally, rather mix in the pan directions next to define them. If they are doubled parts, you might stack them to really give fullness, or do the opposite and split them wide left and right for dramatic effect. If they are not doubled parts, but just very similar sounding spectrally, then some panning to balance them out on the stage may be in order (e.g. one 40% left and one 40% right, or something like that.)

G.

 

[cello_pudding]

^ that's exactly what i was going to say.

let the note choice and instruments do their own thing.

But remember, you don't want everything filled all the time, and you don't want too many things occupying the same frequency space.

maybe that harmonica IS crapping up the lead guitar. just make them play at different times or change the parts all together. don't take all the high's out of the harmonica just to make the guitar shine through that crappy sounding ear-irritating harmonica.

like...if you don't have a low end instrument, boosting the 80-100hz region of a vocal isn't going to fill out your mix.

whatever the instruments do naturally will be the best solution to getting a well balanced mix

 

[djclueveli]

thanks to everyone who gave me some feedback. and thank you to Glen for givin that detailed explanation and cello for the follow up.

 

[djclueveli]

i'm having problems with the piano guitar and vocals. i left the vocals in the middle the piano on the left and the guitar on the right. but it seems like theres a big whole in the spectrum and i dont what to add any more instruments cause i like the song the way it is. does anyone still use the delay trick to get stereo sound? does it make sense to do the delay trick to make a sound wider and then pan it or was it just meant to be left in the middle with a wider sound?

 

[djclueveli]

i'm also using hypersonic which is a vst instrument so i don't know if its sounds r not up to par or what.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

i'm having problems with the piano guitar and vocals. i left the vocals in the middle the piano on the left and the guitar on the right. but it seems like theres a big whole in the spectrum and i dont what to add any more instruments cause i like the song the way it is. does anyone still use the delay trick to get stereo sound? does it make sense to do the delay trick to make a sound wider and then pan it or was it just meant to be left in the middle with a wider sound?

Yeah, you got three very midrange instruments there, for sure. Not that there's anything wrong with that! .

Without hearing just what you got, one can't super specific, but I'd probably attack it this way:

Assuming you have the vocals sounding good, I'd probably leave them alone, at least for starters. Then compare the piano to the guitar. Ask yourself three questions: 1) Does the piano spend more energy on the left hand than the guitar does on the lower strings or vice versa, 2) Which of those two instruments sounds warmer/fuller in general versus which one sounds brighter/crisper in general, and 3) What is the relationship between the two instruments in the arrangement?

The answers to 1) and 2) should guide you as to how you might EQ each one to give them a little more individual personality. The lower/fuller track might get some subtractive EQ on the high end and the higher/brighter one might get some subtractive EQ on the low end. Maybe.

As far as #3 and the arrangement, the question is do both instruments have to be playing at fairly similar levels at the same time? I've done mixes that have had two acoustic guitars, two electrics, a piano and an organ (plus other instruments and vocals) all going at the same time, and it just winds up a mess because the arangement was not planned; each track was treated as if it were a lead track almost. That doesn't usually work very well.

In such cases, often times less is more. Vary the levels of each track with automation to showcase one track over another as the music or the performance calls for it, and don't be afraid to mute entire phrases or measures of one track or another here or there.

As afr as the setreo delay stuff, I'd leave that alone until the very end of the process, if at all. That won't help much fill holes or clean up mud. If the mix has a big spare tire around the middle of the spectrum now, widening the stereo won't help that and could only introduce holes in the pan space to go with the holes in the spectrum. IMHO, get the instruments behaving well together first, and only after that decide whether spacial tricks will give it that extra edge or push it over the edge (Hint: with only three instrument/vocal tracks, you probably don't need to space them into seperate zip codes .)

G.

 

[djclueveli]

THANKS! is it also best to take off all the effects of the instrument that was already on the vst instrument by default? cause most of hypersonic pianos strings and guitars all have reverb on it already so is it better to take those off and get the eq right first and add effects later?

 

[Fishmed]

Trying to get a mix track to go somewhere in the spectrum that it was not designed or created to go is usually a mistake.

+1...So true!

I have seen many times where a band will not take the time to step out and hear what their band dynamics really sound like. Their instruments might sound good on their own, but when they are combined together it be comes a sonic mess for those who listen to their music.

Many times when these kinds of bands enter the studio (usually for the first time) they try to get their song to sound like something that it isn't. I assume because they are so used to hearing the music from the stage they never realize what they sound like out front.

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On a side note, I think this is where a good third party producer is important. Someone who can work with the band before coming into the studio to fix the sonic issues of the band's sound and help with the arrangements to achieve those sounds.