...feeling like one of the masses.

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Bass Freak

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hey thanks for clickin the link




i just need to rant somewhere



i was, to my knowledge, the first person in my school to buy a bass. let alone play one for a school band. and after ohh, 6 months things started going down hill

4 or 5 people after that, and one of my friends, who plays guitar/vocals for a group i play jam with, just said he bought one.

now it might not seem like a big deal, but i started playing bass because no one else does, or did, do it. and then when i invite them to play, they spew out the most disguisting thing ever. no structure, no chord progressions, no general idea of music. just....spew-music


then they hack other peoples songs and try to pass it off as somewhat non-spew-music.


ah it just angers me




anyone have any clue where im commin from?





freak
 
our turf

brotha -

Do you mean to say, what was once a guitar player is now a bass player, and he tries to "play" and mangles our beloved instrument? Or do you mean when you go to jam with a guitar player, he mangles a bunch of chords, calls it art, and expects you to find a good bassline?

Either situation is frustrating for us bass players. We probably don't need to say it, but for all you guitar players out there, no matter how well you solo on your axe, you're NOT bass players. Don't do it. You all need to be up front, in the spotlight, hogging the chicks while WE do the work. And man, I hate it when I go to jam with a guitar player and all I get is an atonal cacophonic sludge some dude holds dearly as his "art." If you want cacophony, come up with it in relation to MY bassline.
 
Ok, I will keep this short. Why don't you kiddies grow up a little. First off, a bass is only a subset of a guitar. If you can play guitar, you can play a bass with no problem. Next, it's not your bassline, it the song's bassline. Last, the bass is probably the easiest insturment to play in a group.

As a guitar and bass teacher, I can tell you from personal experience, the hardest thing to teach you kids is simply how to keep a beat and how to play with others. Remember, it's a group, not a bunch of individuals figuring that everyone needs to play the way they do. If you want to play in a group, then adapt and quit crying about it.

Oh, can you kiddies start using the proper sentence structure also. At least start capitalizing the first word in a sentence. If you didn't pay enough attention in second grade where they taught you this, how can we expect you to learn to follow a simple bassline.
 
sniff... my first flame.

juststartingout... ah, my first flame. gorgeous. as for the "playing with others," i can and do that regularly at my pick-up gigs and sit-ins and whatever situation i am faced with. as for the "easiest" instrument, i don't think there is any need to create some sort of technical hierarchy for how hard a particular instrument is... bass is as difficult as any other. you may want to reconsider you attitude towards your bass students; rather than look down on them for the choice of a so-called "subset" instrument, embrace their desire to be masters of time, support, and harmony. my contention is that bass playing is more about time and support than guitar playing. the attitude that a guitarist, who in my experience is more interested in melody than time, can just "pick up a bass" and start playing supportive and creative lines is insulting to bass players. i think that bass freak's original thread was a complaint about this attitude, and i, out of frustration and lack of sleep, cathartically joined him.

as for capitalization, i am no capitalist.

and it is spelled "instrument," not "insturment"...

thank you for my first flame.
 
juststartingout said:
Ok, I will keep this short. Why don't you kiddies grow up a little. First off, a bass is only a subset of a guitar. If you can play guitar, you can play a bass with no problem. Next, it's not your bassline, it the song's bassline. Last, the bass is probably the easiest insturment to play in a group.
Click to expand...

Whatever.Playing bass, or any other instrument, is only as simple as your creative limitations.If you choose to be lazy and thump roots every song and play simple parts, that says something about your playing ability, not the instrument you're playing.

This is a guitar forum, not an English grammar forum, get over it.By the way, I'm a guitarist that appreciates a kick ass bassist.I'm glad my teachers weren't so closed-minded.
 
Great thread - or it would be if it hadn't been done so many times before.

I play bass in our band, which I also "lead" (because the others tell me I do) and write most of the songs for. My view is quite simple - the bass is there to make the other musicians feel good, the other musicians are there to make the singer feel good, and the singer is there to make the audience feel good.

Of course I'm simplifying, but to say this:

"If you can play guitar, you can play a bass with no problem. Next, it's not your bassline, it the song's bassline. Last, the bass is probably the easiest insturment to play in a group."

is just the most utter bullshit I've ever heard. Our guitarist can no more match my feel on bass than I can his (exquisite) breaks when he plays call and response to the singer. Absolute respect of musical equals, doing different jobs.

I'm glad not to be a student of yours, juststartingout.
 
The most subtle way to reflect how important bass is to the structure of a piece, is to not play it for a measure or two. One can instantly turn a "Godzilla`s revenge" guitar solo into something that sounds like "Peter Pan and the Anemic Pixies on Acid".


Grinder:
"Whatever.Playing bass, or any other instrument, is only as simple as your creative limitations.If you choose to be lazy and thump roots every song and play simple parts, that says something about your playing ability, not the instrument you're playing."

That is a crock. The requirement of a bassist, is play according to the neccesity of the instrument's position in piece to achieve the desired effect, not according to how much you are capable of playing in the piece.
 
I hope juststartingout was sarcasticly flaming bass players in general. If not, he must be one sorry teacher.

It seems like alot of bass players used to be guitar players. I think that's where the stereotypes get started ("oh the bass is just a simple instrument"). Those ex-guitar players tend to play the bass like a guitar rather than using the bass for it's intended role in the musical group. Thus, the basslines are simple root notes doubling the guitar chords.

Anyway, go watch Flea play bass and tell me that it's a simple or easy instrument to play. :rolleyes:
 
like Garry said... this has been said before. But I guess as long as the "bass is no big deal" argument still festers in the minds of less-than-informed guitar players, then we must strive to patiently re-educate those people.
 
Spot on octa, but those less well informed guitar players are not gonna be good band members. We had such a good rehearsal earlier tonight because bass and drums laid down a great bed for singer and guitarist to writhe around on (well, seperately - don't stretch that metaphor too far) but they knew they were fitting into our groove and loved us for it.

Scottg - I guess some bass playing does still go like that, (like U2 - I could cry when I hear the unplayed basslines in some of their stuff) but I think juststartingout must be a total idiot and is not worth responding to. Although I did before:rolleyes:
 
Toki987 said:
[BThat is a crock. The requirement of a bassist, is play according to the neccesity of the instrument's position in piece to achieve the desired effect, not according to how much you are capable of playing in the piece. [/B]
Click to expand...

That is true but, in my eyes, choosing to do the minimal requirements all the time, is lazy.For example, Dusty Hill is good at what he does.He does the minimum of what is expected of him, all the time.I take that back, most of the time.WTF?It's boring.Talk about money for nothin' and the chicks for free.I've played with some great bassists, that are always thinking on their feet.Always offering up variations, no matter how simple and still keeping the groove.That isn't easy to do and gets a big thumbs up from me.
 
juststartingout said:
Ok, I will keep this short. Why don't you kiddies grow up a little. First off, a bass is only a subset of a guitar. If you can play guitar, you can play a bass with no problem. Next, it's not your bassline, it the song's bassline. Last, the bass is probably the easiest insturment to play in a group.

As a guitar and bass teacher, I can tell you from personal experience, the hardest thing to teach you kids is simply how to keep a beat and how to play with others. Remember, it's a group, not a bunch of individuals figuring that everyone needs to play the way they do. If you want to play in a group, then adapt and quit crying about it.

Oh, can you kiddies start using the proper sentence structure also. At least start capitalizing the first word in a sentence. If you didn't pay enough attention in second grade where they taught you this, how can we expect you to learn to follow a simple bassline.
Click to expand...

Are you looking to get flamed?

I'll just say this:

"Guitar players with your attitude about bass=lame bass players."

Oh and BTW, you do not teach kids bass, you teach them to be guitar players trying to play bass....

clif
 
Just to set the record straight here, I did not bust on bass players. There is no unimportant intrument in a band. I actually have a lot of respect for anyone who plays an instrument including a bass. I was busting on one person crying because he was not the only bass player in school.
Bass Freak said:
now it might not seem like a big deal, but i started playing bass because no one else does, or did, do it.
Click to expand...

And a second person because he feel that guitar players cannot play a bass.
octa b nuova said:
We probably don't need to say it, but for all you guitar players out there, no matter how well you solo on your axe, you're NOT bass players. Don't do it.
Click to expand...


It was also about kids wanting the group to play with them, with there stuff and they can't even identify the key they are playing in (but it sounds cool).

octa b nuova said:
If you want cacophony, come up with it in relation to MY bassline.
Click to expand...

So you people that can play bass, it was not directed at you. It was about the kiddies out there that want to be part of a group and play music, but don't understand what it takes and don't want to take the time to figure it out. Remember, this thread started out with 2 posts basically saying that guitar players are idiots and can't play with me. I felt it apropriate to respond.
 
"Originally posted by octa b nuova
We probably don't need to say it, but for all you guitar players out there, no matter how well you solo on your axe, you're NOT bass players. Don't do it. "

im sorry bro, but that's just bull too. i started out on bass, and then 2 months later picked up guitar, and learned both at the same time....now, im not concetied whatsoever, but i know what i'm doing when it comes to both...i can do some cool solos on guitar, but i'm also a bass player, both at heart...while i can write kickass chromatic bass lines and all of that, i can also "solo well" on my axe
 
grinder said:
That is true but, in my eyes, choosing to do the minimal requirements all the time, is lazy.For example, Dusty Hill is good at what he does.He does the minimum of what is expected of him, all the time.I take that back, most of the time.WTF?It's boring.Talk about money for nothin' and the chicks for free.I've played with some great bassists, that are always thinking on their feet.Always offering up variations, no matter how simple and still keeping the groove.That isn't easy to do and gets a big thumbs up from me.
Click to expand...

Well Said!!
 
Bass Freak said:
hey thanks for clickin the link




i just need to rant somewhere



i was, to my knowledge, the first person in my school to buy a bass. let alone play one for a school band. and after ohh, 6 months things started going down hill

4 or 5 people after that, and one of my friends, who plays guitar/vocals for a group i play jam with, just said he bought one.

now it might not seem like a big deal, but i started playing bass because no one else does, or did, do it. and then when i invite them to play, they spew out the most disguisting thing ever. no structure, no chord progressions, no general idea of music. just....spew-music


then they hack other peoples songs and try to pass it off as somewhat non-spew-music.


ah it just angers me




anyone have any clue where im commin from?





freak
Click to expand...

Ah yes. I understand. No one cared about me playing bass in high school (especially girls.)

Just remember that if the bass playing thing is a fad, then they will get bored with it and move on to the next "instrument" of the month." I have a few friends who are like that.

Another thing you can do BassFreak is to just practice and become a bad-ass bassist so that all of your frineds will want to give up bass since they cannot compete with your chops.


Or...........go out and get a 5 or6 string fretless then you will retain your title as "the-original-different-no-one-else-is-like-me eccentric-bassist."

DO they have good amps? Probably not. If you get a huge loud cabinet and head then you will get the gigs becuase all they have is the little 15 watt combo amp that comes with the "bass starter kit at Guitar center".


I am being serious.


clif


clif
 
thanks guys...thanks




im not just a bass player, i own two basses and three 6 string guitars. thats just how it worked out. now i play bass better than ill ever play a 6-string, thats just how it is. i dont go up to the guitar players and start wankin on something and say "that was awsome, im soooo good"


clif, im waiting for the fad thing to be over. and im working on getting a 200w yorkville from one of my friends. hes my bass hero.

octa, you hit the nail on the head. thats pretty much whats going on.


juststartingout: nope, wasnt crying. i could care less how many bass players there were in the school. its just, they dont practice, they dont learn, they dont strive to become better. they just, hack.



thanks guys, reading this made my day.



freak
 
juststartingout said:
First off, a bass is only a subset of a guitar. If you can play guitar, you can play a bass with no problem.
Click to expand...

I know I'm throwing a punch way after the bell here, but that statement is absolutely wrong! While it's true the notes are in the same place, guitar and bass fill completely different roles and require completely different approaches.
A guitar is a harmonic instrument; the bass is primarily a rythm instrument that is inextricably linked to the drums, particularly the kick drum. It is literally the bridge between the rythmic and harmonic content of a song.
A guitar player may be able to find his way around a bass "no problem", but that is far from being a true bass player.


As a guitar and bass teacher, I can tell you from personal experience, the hardest thing to teach you kids is simply how to keep a beat and how to play with others.
Click to expand...

As a teacher myself, I can readily agree with that! (except for the condescending choice of words...)


Aaron
www.aaroncheney.com
 
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