Epi Valve Junior - COMBO Metal Samples

[TelePaul]

Hey guys,

Heres a metal track I asked my buddy to play at the end of our session today; it was all improvd and I didn't mix it, it's just to capture the sound of the amp. It's the Junior with a couple of Boss pedals.

http://glasshouserecordings.bebo.com

 

[TelePaul]

Is it shit and everyones afraid to tell me??

 

[TragikRemix]

nope its cool.

whats the deal with the drums? oh nevermind, metal drums...

i like the sound alot of the guitar. what pedals did you use? is that the $100 epi amp? im gonna have to get one.. that thing is killer.

 

[TelePaul]

nope its cool.

whats the deal with the drums? oh nevermind, metal drums...

i like the sound alot of the guitar. what pedals did you use? is that the $100 epi amp? im gonna have to get one.. that thing is killer.

Oh the drums were just a shitty loop I threw in afterwards to give the thng some perspective.

The pedals were a noise-gate (obvisouly with the single coiled guitar), and an SD1 as a booster feeding the DS 2 distortion. Theres also some delay thrown in but I'm not sure if it was on for the whole thing. It was micd with a sennheiser e816 s.

 

[amra]

If you were using the DS-2 for distortion, then what we are hearing is the DS-2, not the VJ's distortion. That's what it sounds like to me, a Boss DS-2 or a modded DS-1 type distortion sound. I don't hear any of the VJ's tone at all....


Not being critical mind you, just want to understand what we are hearing....

 

[32-20-Blues]

If you were using the DS-2 for distortion, then what we are hearing is the DS-2, not the VJ's distortion. That's what it sounds like to me, a Boss DS-2 or a modded DS-1 type distortion sound. I don't hear any of the VJ's tone at all....


Not being critical mind you, just want to understand what we are hearing....

Having said that, the amp and speaker obviously still colour the processed output from the pedal; the same pedal/guitar set-up through a different amp would sound completely different.

 

[amra]

I don't really agree with that, it would sound SLIGHTLY different....

You could take a low end 35 watt crate amp, set to comlpetely clean and a little tube amp set to completely clean, and use the same pedal and get pretty much the same sound. Any noticable difference would be attributable more to the speaker and the design of the cab than the differences in clean channels.

 

[TragikRemix]

yeah but I know what those pedals sound like, so the sound thru that amp can be understood. also, i would be able to recreate that sound if i wanted to, so i stand by it, i think it's cool and that amp might be worth it.

 

[32-20-Blues]

I don't really agree with that, it would sound SLIGHTLY different....

You could take a low end 35 watt crate amp, set to comlpetely clean and a little tube amp set to completely clean, and use the same pedal and get pretty much the same sound. Any noticable difference would be attributable more to the speaker and the design of the cab than the differences in clean channels.

Sorry man, I call bullshit. A 35 watt solid state and a five watt tube amp will sound vastly different with the same pedal chain. Try it.

 

[jonnyc]

I don't really agree with that, it would sound SLIGHTLY different....

You could take a low end 35 watt crate amp, set to comlpetely clean and a little tube amp set to completely clean, and use the same pedal and get pretty much the same sound. Any noticable difference would be attributable more to the speaker and the design of the cab than the differences in clean channels.

What? So you don't take into account at all the amp's circuitry let alone the fact the a lot of amps have very different clean tones? Let me ask you this, why do all the famous guitar players who use pedals use anything more than say a Roland JC120 or even something like a Line 6 spider? I mean according you the amp doesn't matter and I haven't found that to be true at all.

 

[32-20-Blues]

What? So you don't take into account at all the amp's circuitry let alone the fact the a lot of amps have very different clean tones? Let me ask you this, why do all the famous guitar players who use pedals use anything more than say a Roland JC120 or even something like a Line 6 spider? I mean according you the amp doesn't matter and I haven't found that to be true at all.

Bingo .

 

[amra]

If you are using a pedal as the sole source of distortion then it is going to sound more or less the same through every amp, except for the difference in speakers. You guys can think whatever you want. Go try it and then come back and argue the point.

Most famous guitar players don't use pedals for distortion that's what good amps are for.

 

[TelePaul]

I don't really agree with that, it would sound SLIGHTLY different....

You could take a low end 35 watt crate amp, set to comlpetely clean and a little tube amp set to completely clean, and use the same pedal and get pretty much the same sound. .

That's just not true Amra. The DS 2 has 4 controls; only of them changes 'tone'. The rest is down to the amp.

Any noticable difference would be attributable more to the speaker and the design of the cab than the differences in clean channels.

That sounds like you're saying speaker and cabinet design are an irrelevant basis for comparison.

 

[TelePaul]

If you are using a pedal as the sole source of distortion then it is going to sound more or less the same through every amp, except for the difference in speakers. You guys can think whatever you want. Go try it and then come back and argue the point.

I have more than one amp dude.

Most famous guitar players don't use pedals for distortion that's what good amps are for.

That's just plain wrong. Famous DS 2 users:

dave navarro
john frusciante
kurt cobain

Famous DS 1 users:

Joe Satriani
Steve Vai
Robert Smith
Miki Berenyi

Famous TS808/TS9 users:

Stevie Ray Vaughan
Tom Petty
Mike McCready
Ross Childress
Stone Gossard
Munki

Fnaous Arbiter Fuzz Face users:

Jimi Hendrix
Eric Clapton
Eric Johnson

 

[32-20-Blues]

Most famous guitar players don't use pedals for distortion that's what good amps are for.

Once more, I call bullshit. A tube amp's break-up is generally more subtle than the distortion used in many genres. For example, if you believe you can get the distortion required for heavy-metal out of simply pushing a valve amp into overdrive, you're just wrong.

 

[amra]

Look guys, all I am trying to say is that if someone likes this clip, they should go buy a Boss DS-2. That's what they sound like. That's not what the epi VJ sounds like.

 

[amra]

Once more, I call bullshit. A tube amp's break-up is generally more subtle than the distortion used in many genres. For example, if you believe you can get the distortion required for heavy-metal out of simply pushing a valve amp into overdrive, you're just wrong.

Dude you are smoking crack.

That's EXACTLY how you get the distortion required for heavy metal. Holy shit. Where is everyone that is sane? Where is metalhead and the other guys who know how to get good tone?

 

[32-20-Blues]

Look guys, all I am trying to say is that if someone likes this clip, they should go buy a Boss DS-2. That's what they sound like. That's not what the epi VJ sounds like.

No shit.

However, the title of the thread was "Epi Valve Junior - COMBO Metal Samples", therefore anybody reading it would assume that the amp was being used in conjunction with effects.

Furthermore, the fact that a pedal is used was clearly mentioned in the original post, making your proviso above irrelevant.

 

[TelePaul]

Dude you are smoking crack.

That's EXACTLY how you get the distortion required for heavy metal. Holy shit. Where is everyone that is sane? Where is metalhead and the other guys who know how to get good tone?

I think you should look at the list of users of distortion pedals, then tell me serious players derive tone solely from the amp.

 

[32-20-Blues]

Dude you are smoking crack.

That's EXACTLY how you get the distortion required for heavy metal. Holy shit. Where is everyone that is sane? Where is metalhead and the other guys who know how to get good tone?

A tube amp cranked into break-up is how you get a blues tone. Metal requires (often but not always) an overdrive of some description in front of it.

Seriously, get your head out of your ass and try to think of some famous guitarists who consistently go straight into a valve amp.

I'll even help you (because I'm feeling charitable)...Rory Gallagher, no pedals, straight into amp. But he was blues.

Metal? Nope, most of 'em use an overdrive/distortion before the amp.