Drum recording. PLEASE GIVE FEEDBACK.

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Jason Chinchen

Made of rubber...
We are gearing up to record a 5 song EP for promotion and fun. The style is acoustic rock/adult contemporary...
I was hoping some of you would give me feedback on this drum track. Wondering about the mix and sounds of individual drums. This is pretty straight without any EQ or plugins. ( The kick has been eq-ed)
This was recorded at our tracking studio with the new mackie 1640i and Sonar 8.
Two AT 4041overheads for cymbals.
Sure Beta 52 on the kick.
snare(beta 56)
Two toms(misc)

"Drum Check"

http://www.reverbnation.com/artist/...b=profile&subnav=profile_songs#/jasonchinchen

Thanks!!
 
Frankly...and you did ask...
it sounds horrible.

The toms are poorly tuned...way too loose and single headed? Maybe not.
The bass drum is over-muffled, and lacks breath.
The snare drum...the snares are a little tight, and it only sounds decent the few times you played it with authority. Also over muffled.

The cymbals...are...wtf? The hats and ride don't sound bad at all, but those "crashes" have to go.

Really man...it's not good. I don't want you to be offended and take this as an attack. I'm trying to be nice. It's just ya know...really bad. I'd rather not lie to you.
 
Yea, u-huh. Just like the sound of the custom acoustic guitar I built and record with affects the sound..no newbee here, just dealing with someone elses kit. ;)

We are adding a bottom mic to the snare next session, also I had mentioned that the toms sound loose to me, but Im not a drummer so what do I know....:mad:

So the kit sucks, Im more interested in how the shitty kit is mixed since that is what I have to work with and Im new to mixing. Testing my intuitions with this thread...

Keep it coming!
 
Yes, I'm a drummer...and an amateur engineer. It's difficult to evaluate the mix because the "ingredients" if you will, all leave such a bad after taste.
First impressions.. the snare and bass are well balanced, but the toms are a little low. From the sound of the toms, that's probably best. The hats are a bit hot for my taste, and the crashes are way too low...also probably a good thing.

The toms are too loose, you're right.
I don't know that a second mic on the snare is going to do much... I mean, not with the snares as tight as they are.

Honestly...the most important element to a good drum sound, is well-tuned drums. I know that seems obvious, and I don't mean it to be insulting...it's just so easy for non-drummers to forget what well-tuned(open and resonant) drums sound like.

The music for which you're tracking drums, is an ideal canvas for big, lush, organic sounding drums. I would if possible, retune the kit with fresh heads, and minimal muffling. Allow them to resonate, ring and squeak. It'll sound nice once the rest of the tracks are layered on top.

Right now, the kit sounds cold and choked...and we don't want to talk about those crashes.
 
To me the hihats were not bad at all. The kick was a bit too wide harmonically, meaning I'd probably do whatever it took to get the bass drum to record with a little less bass. I try to record it so there's no need for eq and eq when I have to only (and almost never boost).

But the kick and hihat weren't far off, the snare sounded like I'd want to put it through a compressor to get a good pop out of it.

The toms need work. If the kit doesn't sound right with one good mic in front forget it you're only complicating things with more mics.

I'd shoot for 4 mics - overheads, snare and kick (more accurately FOK, front of kick). Think simple and build on what you know for sure.

The cymbals other than the hihats sounded soft but from what I heard they might not be the, er, "ideal" ones so you might want to bury them in the mix.

But overall I don't seem to think it's all that horrible like some of the other people here did. Very often drums at sound checks sound kinda stupid. And it's really hard to judge things out of a song.

BTW the link worked fine for me using Mac OS 10.4.11 w/Firefox but on Safari I ran into bullshit.
 
Thanks for the perspective and listening!.. I didnt think the mix was bad...and Im no expert on the drum sounds, but I know what sounds good to me, and We will get as close as we can with what we have.
 
I think you're missing the point most are trying to make. The sound of the kit is 95% of the "MIX". You can't keep saying "I know the drums sound like shit. But how's the mix?". They can't be seperated. So the answer is "The mix is horribly shitty because of the drum sound".
 
No, Im def. not missing the point,......I just dont have another kit, so that is what we are going to record with and so that is what Im going to mix and so that is what Im asking you for input on......thanks!
 
Jason Chinchen said:
No, Im def. not missing the point,......I just dont have another kit, so that is what we are going to record with and so that is what Im going to mix and so that is what Im asking you for input on......thanks!
Click to expand...

You still don't get it.:rolleyes:


Here's a hint. BUY NEW HEADS AND TUNE THE DRUMS PROPERLY.
 
Jason Chinchen said:
Acctually Reverb Nation is a great site for sharing and promotion, not that Im using it much...heh..
Click to expand...

I hope you got it that on my Mac, when I try your song from Firefox there's no problem, but when I used Safari there was mega-bullshit and I didn't bother to procede. So just be aware that what you experience on your computer might be different than the next guy! :eek:

You know I've got pretty nice drums & cymbals, but I haven't seen a set yet I couldn't get something useable out of. You can make an enormous difference by just spending some time tweaking the tuning, messing around with different types of muffling, some tape, some felt, a wallet on the snare, whatever it takes to get that set happening.

Also, and I know a lot of people will be against it, but for regular keeping time I almost always play with my left hand (the one that hits 2 and 4 on the snare) stick turned around so that the butt end hits the head. It gives you a way fatter, lower snare sound. I like the snare to be kinda low so it's below the singer in pitch and doesn't compete. I didn't invent this it's 100% Hal Blaine.

It's frustrating for sure but I'd spend a little time using a musical ear and I'll bet that set could sound way better. :)

BTW, I use calf heads now but when I used plastic I really thought that the snare head sounded killer for about 4 days and then only good after that, so if you're doing some recording you might want to spring for a Remo Ambassador white coated (my choice), it would do wonders for the sound.
 
Jason Chinchen said:
Ignore button is where? :laughings:
Click to expand...

Some people just don't want to hear the truth. Idiots.

I'm going to repeat it just to annoy you: Your mix is horribly shitty because the drums sound terrible.

Once you get that through your skull, you'll understand why insisting on asking about the mix when you're already received the answer is beyond ignorant.

Good luck with your EP. :laughings::laughings::laughings:
 
Hey Dinty, thanks for the useful info! Ill try to get our drummer to spend a little time on it. Money is an issue right now, so the kit is pretty much what we have to go with. The other option is borrow a kit, but for this project Im happy with the best we can do with what we have approach. For one thing thats how you learn to make the most of what you have...this is HOME recording after all. Not to say I dont take the final outcome seriously but realistically we are going to be just fine.
 
Jason - I'm following with interest, but have no advice (total drum newb). I have at least one cymbal that sounds somewhat like your crashes. I called my drummer and hit it, and he nearly puked through my cell phone. Mine's probably trashier sounding. Personally, I haven't developed the ear for when cymbals are good or bad - at least when I hear them alone. Do folks dislike this sound because it stands out in a mix in a bad way?
 
..or because it sounds like the difference between a $50 chinese guitar and a custom made OM....

Or at least thats what Im gathering.
 
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