Drum newb shopping for a first kit

JDOD said:
Congratulations Tad, there's definitely a video here in your experiments with recording a real kit.
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As much as I hate unboxing videos, I'm seriously considering taping the whole experience. At least I could be a target of ridicule while people watch a total drum newbie try to assemble his first kit. It'd be a lot of time-lapse and quotes like "where the fuck is this supposed to go?!?" and "what the hell is this thing?!?"

Hell, I might just take a pair of drumsticks and whack on the shipping boxes :D
 
Tadpui said:
As much as I hate unboxing videos, I'm seriously considering taping the whole experience. At least I could be a target of ridicule while people watch a total drum newbie try to assemble his first kit. It'd be a lot of time-lapse and quotes like "where the fuck is this supposed to go?!?" and "what the hell is this thing?!?"

Hell, I might just take a pair of drumsticks and whack on the shipping boxes :D
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Yeah, it would be good to do and very educational/helpful to someone who wants to learn it.

If Greg or RAMI did it, they'd just be like "Look this is where I have my mics - aren't I great!" and noobs wouldn't be able to replicate it. A video of you going through the process, working it out and then A/Bing your before and after when you make adjustments would be really helpful.

I struggled like fuck to get tones I liked recorded from my amp - in hindsight, documenting the process would have been really helpful for others.
 
I'd recommend you put the kit where you want it first. Obviously, right? There's a recording reason though. Since space is limited for you, you don't have the luxury of finding the sweet spot in the room. Put them where they'll do their job and not screw up everything else in your room. Then you trial-and-error an overhead setup that works best for that spot. This is important because an overhead method that works for your chosen spot might suck if you move the drums to a different part of the room. You might decide you like X-Y the best for your spot, but move the drums 10 feet and then spaced pair might be best. There's no way to tell unless you try, but moving the kit around is a hassle in a space limited environment. So put them together, tune them up, pick a spot, hopefully not facing a corner, and get started on overheads only. Watch for phase, watch for comb filtering, and when you get a good overheads-only sound, then you can start spot miking.
 
Greg_L said:
pick a spot, hopefully not facing a corner
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Why wouldn't you want to be facing a corner? Just thinking, in a smallish space, they're bound to be in the corner of the room anyway and if you stick your seat in the corner you end up Houdining your way between the floor tom and the ride to get behind the kit or moving the hi-hat out of the way. If you have the drums facing the corner, the seat is then in the room, which makes it easier to get from your computer to your kit when you're recording. Is sticking them facing the corner so detrimental to the sound that the trade off of the convenience isn't worth it?
 
JDOD said:
Is sticking them facing the corner so detrimental to the sound that the trade off of the convenience isn't worth it?
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Yeah, it can be. A corner is a terrible spot for drums. Cymbal wash and toms bouncing through the corners back into the mics? Not ideal. Facing out into the biggest part of the room is usually better. But you do what you gotta do. My own drums sort of face a corner, but they aren't in a corner. I've also got a ton of broadband absorption, clouds, and bass trapping in my drum room.
 
Congrats on the kit! I have 10, 12 and 14 toms and enjoy them, my 14" tom is pretty low and sounds great.

As far as my overheads go they are not on tracks, just mounts screwed to my clouds. A track actually would have been a better idea as I now want to experiment with a spaced pair which means leaving holes in cloud frames. Only I would notice the holes anyways haha.

IMG_4144_zpsj9el4c2b.jpg


IMG_4146_zpsu72eutaw.jpg


IMG_4147_zpsezorwxiu.jpg
 
Greg_L said:
Well it's badass anyway. What did you use for the base mount?
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Thanks, man! I used pretty much the same thing Jimmy posted, but I think mine are male threads. I dont remember exactly. I can look in my Amazon history if you want to exactly.
 
liv_rong said:
Thanks, man! I used pretty much the same thing Jimmy posted, but I think mine are male threads. I dont remember exactly. I can look in my Amazon history if you want to exactly.
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Yeah if you don't mind gimme some specifics and close up pics. I'd like to do this myself. Did you have to hack up some mic stands?
 
Wow liv_rong, those are awesome! Also, great looking room and panels. I need a few more panels, myself. They're not a feel-good purchase, but they're definitely sound-good purchase.

In other news, all of my gear arrived today. I spent about 3 hours getting it all assembled and set up. Had to do major rearranging in my room as well, so that was part of it. I tried to tune them as well, but holy crap i suck at that. they sound pretty nasty right now. I'm gonna cheat and buy a drum dial on my way home from work tomorrow. I just don't know what I'm listening for... after decades of tuning stringed instruments, there are way too many overtones on a drum for my ears and brain to process it.

I also picked up the Acrolite. I freaking love it. It just cracks, and is loud as hell. Actually the only other thing on the kit that is even close to as loud is the 21" sweet ride. That thing is a beast. Gonna take some practice to reign that thing in when I play.
 
jimmys69 said:
Atlas Sound AD-12BE | Sweetwater.com

Add to that any boom arm. I also have extendable ones so I can place overhead mics anywhere.
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That's what I'd need. Something that allows the vertical part of a mic stand to still be there. I need to come down off the ceiling more than just the boom part will allow.

Tadpui said:
In other news, all of my gear arrived today. I spent about 3 hours getting it all assembled and set up. Had to do major rearranging in my room as well, so that was part of it. I tried to tune them as well, but holy crap i suck at that. they sound pretty nasty right now. I'm gonna cheat and buy a drum dial on my way home from work tomorrow. I just don't know what I'm listening for... after decades of tuning stringed instruments, there are way too many overtones on a drum for my ears and brain to process it.

I also picked up the Acrolite. I freaking love it. It just cracks, and is loud as hell. Actually the only other thing on the kit that is even close to as loud is the 21" sweet ride. That thing is a beast. Gonna take some practice to reign that thing in when I play.
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Cool man! Nothing wrong with a drum dial. They help. Tuning is an art in and of itself. First thing is to make sure the lugs are clean and lubricated. A little dab of vaseline on the lug bolts will do. The drum dial will get you 90% there. Then it's just fine tuning. It can help to lightly dampen the center of the drum head when tuning with your finger or a piece of moongel. On larger drums it cuts the rampant overtones so you can hear more of the fundamental pitch. An easy way to tune by ear is to listen for "warble". You know how when you tune a guitar via harmonics, you tune and listen for the warbley wah wah wah sound to stop? Same with a drum head. When you hit an out of tune head, it'll go bomwowowowowowow. That's out of tune. Tap around the head equidistant from each lug and get them all the same pitch. Be careful not to just go round tightening and tightening while chasing the tuning. It's okay to tune pitch down, but always go past the spot you want and come back up to it. Tune up, not down. It just takes practice and a careful ear. Tuning drums is about a billion times harder than a guitar.

And I'd recommend you avoid trying to tune the drums to specific intervals. That's advanced stuff and not many drums like being forced to a pitch they're not happy with. High end shells can take it, more modest stuff won't. Focus on getting each drum to it's own happy spot and the intervals will take care of themselves. No one will ever, EVER, fucking know that your kit is not tuned to a musical scale. Obviously no two drums should sound the same, so if you get that, you did something wrong.
 
Well I definitely don't want a gooseneck, but yeah I bet I could make something. My wheels are turning now that I've had 5 cups of coffee. The flushmount is good, I'd definitely want that. I'd need to configure some vertical part, then attach the standard boom arm. Basically a standard everyday boom stand mounted to the ceiling is what I need. I have an idea to make tracks using drawer slides mounted to a 1x4 that mounts to the ceiling. Mount mic stands to the flushmount base, mount the base to the drawer slides. Bam. Sliding ceiling mount overhead stands. Probably a lot easier said than done.
 
That's not bad. Looks stupid but I bet it'd do the job if it stays put. My worry is the noise of drums vibrating those springs. It would suck to have spring noise vibrate into the mics.
 
Thanks for the tips! I seriously spent over an hour of the setup time trying to tune each drum, and I couldn't even get close. They're all boingy and producing like 12 different notes each.

I'm really impressed with the zildjian A cymbals though. They sound like real cymbals! The 21" ride is pretty intense compared to the rest of them. I might have the wing nut too tight on the crash, it may be choking it a bit. And I had to sit and watch a YouTube video to figure out how to assemble the hihat/felt sandwich for the first time :)
 
Lol @ felt sandwich.

Just real quick..for toms I'd say remove the heads and start with the reso head only. Get that tuned clean and clear to it's loudest lowest natural pitch. Then flip it, install the batter head, and do the same to the batter with the reso head on some carpet or a towel so it doesn't influence the batter tuning at all. You can tell when you find it's fundamental pitch. The drum will boom. Then you can fine tune it.
 
Sometimes, if you knock on the shell, the shell will be at the pitch the head will want to be. (However, probably an octave down)
 
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