drum bleeding

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terrible_buddhi

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I am using an 8 mic technique on the drums for this recording session...this is the first time I have been able to use 8 seperate tracks for it. My question is this...

there is going to be bleed through no matter what you do...in fact, I can hear a BUNCH of other drums through the kick mic. When you are EQ'ing the drum tracks...do you try to eliminate the other drums from each other? If so, what EQ are you using (Q2, Q4, Q10, etc?) and how much do you cut?

Thanks!
 
Drum bleed is normal and I would suggest that that is not generally a good use of eq. That much seperation would take gobs of eq. A little to shape the overheads maybe, and shaping for a drum track for it's own sake would be more typical.
Wayne
 
mixsit said:
Drum bleed is normal and I would suggest that that is not generally a good use of eq. That much seperation would take gobs of eq. A little to shape the overheads maybe, and shaping for a drum track for it's own sake would be more typical.
Wayne
Click to expand...

You can use a bit of EQ to attenuate some of the dominant part of leekage. Take a look at the article "mixing the drum kit" at http://www.slackmaster2000.com/info.php

I also used 8 mics there. You can hear the use of the gate as well as EQ to help leakage (audio samples).
 
You may use a gate/expander with a sidechain to improve your separation. In the sidechain path you push your frequencies that enhance the sound you want in the track well, in the controlled channel you have the 'original'.

On digital workstations it may help a lot to give the gate a little more time to react on the low end (that misses the high end 'speed' of your signal, too) by placing it some ms earlier. Already had quite good results on bass guitar and bass drum.

Nevertheless these tracks will always sound a little artificial, so you'll have to tweak a little in the mixdown to have3 a natural sound. Verbs may help.

aXel
 
Also if your using a daw where you can edit the individual tracks and your willing to spend the time, go into your tom tracks (for example) and delete the parts of the track where there are no toms playing. Its a pain in the ass but its like the perfect gate.
 
BuildingStudios said:
Also if your using a daw where you can edit the individual tracks and your willing to spend the time, go into your tom tracks (for example) and delete the parts of the track where there are no toms playing. Its a pain in the ass but its like the perfect gate.
Click to expand...

That is also a perfect recipy for taking all ambiance out of your drum tracks -------- so if you would like to try it, make sure you do it on a copy of the original.

The key, as always, is in microphone placement. Experiment with your placement until you are satisfied you have eliminated phasing problems, and also use your placement to minimise microphone bleed.

In general, start with your kick and overheads, make sure they work together. If your kick mic is inside the kick, place it out of phase (the same for a snare bottem mic). Then add your snare mic (s) to the mix, then the others one-by-one.
Getting good drum sound takes time, as well as a drummer capable of tuning a kit (a rare animal).
 
I agree with you sjoko2, But If your only doing it with tom tracks and im assuming that most people are using overhead mics, I dont think you will loose much ambience.
But of couse It is always preferable to have your placement correct, and have a great drummer with a great sounding kit But that doesnt always happen :)
 
Im finally after a long pause, working on my newest set of drum samples for drumagog. After much debate, and a pretty happy room sound, I decided that this whole sample set will have " all mics on" with the snare trab rattling and bleeding thru each drum

this may well be my LEAST popular set of samples, but I think theres something to this " bleed " stuff

one thing for sure, itll sound like a SET instead of samples this time around
 
Take good notes while your doing all this. I recently did a remit for a band that did 8 tracks of drums and no tracks sheets. I had a difficult time trying to find what was what because of the huge amounts of bleed from the snare into the overheads.
Why are you using 8 tracks by the way? Im just curious about the logic behind it. For me, 8 tracks means the drummer is good, the kit is big and the sound is a compressed tight fast moving rock or metal. In the case gating is going to be your second best friend to mic placement. Another thing you can do, its painful for you and the drummer. If he is a good drummer you can leave out the OH's and do just the kick, snare HH and toms. Then go back and do the rides, crashes as overdubs by themselves without the rest of the kit being played. It can really tighten things up and gating wont be cutting off the tail as the cymbals fade out. Ive done it before by just doing the kick and snare ,no HH or any cymbals maybe the toms if I close mic the shells, Ive even cut hole in the lower head and jammed a mic inside to help isolation. It all depends on the kit, and the player on what it takes to make the drums work.

Peace,
SoMm
 
i personally wouldn't worry about the bleed. if it sounds good, it sounds good.......and even if there's a bunch of bleed when each intstrument is solo'd, it really won't matter much when all the tracks are together....... you'll still get the seperation you want.

but also.........a gate on a snare can be cool.......
and cutting the lows from the overheads can also be cool if it's a real rockin band.........that way you hear more of the up close mics
 
A drum kit is just that: a KIT. A complete package. Too much seperation and you don't have a complete organic sounding kit. All the mics should work together with the others to create one complete sound. A good rule of thumb is to isolate the bass drum as much as possible (use the old "bass drum tunnel" method where you isolate the kick from the rest of the kit). I usually get a good kick sound, a good snare sound and the overall kit I capture with the overheads. The tom mics are used to fill in the toms when necessary. If you focus on getting the best kit sound from your overheads and fill in the rest subtley as needed, you'll be better off. I personally like the bleed (to a point) from other mics and make them all work together. That's just me....
 
the best sounding miced drums are done with 3 mics a kick an a pair of overheads the over heads will capture the kits ambience but lets be honest guys this is home recording so more then likely your drum rooms suck so you keep the overheads as low as you can so you have no "ambience" as in room noise and cuttin out the toms where there is no toms wont hurt if the overheads are loud enough but again its a drum kit to much isolatin is like trying to isolate all the strings of a guitar it just dosent sound natural at all
 
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