Do you know the note names on the fretboard?

[XLR]

Do you know about Tommy Teldesco's book

He used to have a column in Guitar Player mag where he told stories about his studio experiences. Haven't seen his book yet, but I will.

Tim

 

[timmerman]

He used to have a column in Guitar Player mag where he told stories about his studio experiences. Haven't seen his book yet, but I will.

Tim

That is right, and some of the material which you found in the columns are in the book as well.

Do you still read Guitar Player these days?

Eddie

 

[XLR]

Do you still read Guitar Player these days?

Once in a while. The main thing I find interesting about it is, if you scan all the full page ads it's like a psychographic analysis of the guitar market.

Relating to the thread topic, I think that Guitar Player has tried many times in its instructional columns to help its readers learn the note names on the fingerboard. So while I find some of their content repetitive, I've got to credit them for that.

Tim

 

[timmerman]

Once in a while. The main thing I find interesting about it is, if you scan all the full page ads it's like a psychographic analysis of the guitar market.

Relating to the thread topic, I think that Guitar Player has tried many times in its instructional columns to help its readers learn the note names on the fingerboard. So while I find some of their content repetitive, I've got to credit them for that.

Tim

Yes I can see your point, and the thing with the repetition is perhaps an age thing, if you have played for a while and read certain mags, you will find occassionaly that things do come back, but heh, for some it may be the first time when they read about that Hendrix-or the History of Fender Guitars story.

I also agree looking at the ads you can see the norms and values of today, and just how we live and......................and that has not been any different at any times. When I look at some of the Guitar Players from the early eighties I can "read" the feel of those days in it as well. That is great isn't it? Perhaps these days things are a little more saturated, there is so much more of anything than there was before..................

But we may get off topic here...............

Eddie

 

[XLR]

Despite how I've talked about fingerboard knowledge in this thread I'm thinking for a moment that this whole thing about being educated and academic might be just a little misdirected. I played once with an old Italian mandolin player who was incredible. We were playing nylon string guitar/mandolin duets and I stopped to ask him something about his picking technique. He thought for a moment, answered, then we started playing again... but he couldn't. Afterwards he told me he was all tied up from messing with his musical process by consciously thinking about it. I mean, he could read fluently, and played like a monster, but his technique wasn't a conscious thing, just automatic. If I could be so lucky! Yeah, technique is a different animal than fingerboard knowlege, but who knows what's really the best approach to all this? Guess it depends on the particular characteristcs of the player.

Tim

 

[timmerman]

There really isn't a right and wrong approach with playing eh? It is just communication, you use whatever works in order to communicate the ideas you have.

Technique in a way is a tool as well, it just enables you to execute certain ideas. It is helpful to have a working knowledge of all the different styles out there, but you certainly do not need it to make a valid musical statement.

Sometimes you can be too tied up in technique. I myself like study and practise and it cannnot harm you, but I can also see the point of people who are not like that. A lot of it has to do with social background and habits as well. In general I love studying anything, you know, politics, history, just anything, but again, not all of us like these things, and really none of this matters when you want to become a great player.

Need to go now, would love to carry on, but probably tomorrow a bit more.............

Cheers,

Eddie

 

[XLR]

Guess it depends on the particular characteristics of the player.

I believe that most people benefit from knowing the names of the pitches on the fingerboard, and being able to read fluently too, but people are different... I think the whole thing is best approached with a little sensitivity to how different people think and feel music.

Thinking of someone like say, Bix Beiderbecke, the great cornet player from the '20s... He had a major problem with reading music, maybe from some kind of a visual learning disorder, but was skilled enough otherwise to perform amazingly in band settings where reading was considered essential. Didn't he play with the Paul Whiteman Orchestra to pay the bills? If I remember the story right, he'd have another player run through his part for him once, and he'd keep it all in his head. Of course his real value was when he'd stand up and take his improvised solos.

Tim

 

[timmerman]

I believe that most people benefit from knowing the names of the pitches on the fingerboard, and being able to read fluently too, but people are different... I think the whole thing is best approached with a little sensitivity to how different people think and feel music.

Tim

Heh Tim, Tomorrow came quickly eh, been able to get some more time to be here, anyway, yes I agree with you on this.

What about Django, well guess he knew how to hit the right notes, even when he had to miss a few fingers, and his technique after the accident became even better, just goes to show where there is a will there is..................

Eddie

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

What about Django,

OH, now your talking about my favorite player...I'm a slut for gypsy jazz Say, can anyone tell me what kind of guitar the player in the Hot Club of San Francisco uses. It sounds amazingly like the early Django recordings.. love that ..hmmm..how do you describe it? Crisptness? The tonal quality is unlike any guitar I've ever tried, and I've tried hundreds in my life
fitZ

 

[sweetnubs]

I like Django. I like Grant Green. I'm not even a guitar player and I know all the notes instantly with no need to calculate. I'm not a drummer and I can tune drums better than most drummers. I can even tune a piano. (I used to work for a piano resotoration business when I was a teenager.) What's wrong with musicians these days?

 

[Henri Devill]

OH, now your talking about my favorite player...I'm a slut for gypsy jazz Say, can anyone tell me what kind of guitar the player in the Hot Club of San Francisco uses. It sounds amazingly like the early Django recordings.. love that ..hmmm..how do you describe it? Crisptness? The tonal quality is unlike any guitar I've ever tried, and I've tried hundreds in my life
fitZ

I read he used a "Mecaffari"{sp?} it was a D hole acoustic with a mustach bridge{a very thin bridge design} I belive

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Hey Don, thanks a million. I've seen them but didn't know the name. Love the sound though.
fitZ

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

What's wrong with musicians these days?

Nothing. The problem is assuming they are.
fitZ

 

[timmerman]

What's wrong with musicians these days?

Life in general, but it has always been like that and will always stay like that, difference is.................today we can read and talk about it.................the WHOLE day.................................

Sometimes you have to decide to forget what you have ever heard or what you know and pretend to be that child again: enthousiastic about ANYTHING and EVERYTHING, so in case of dissappointments, there is still enough positiveness left to lift you spirit.


................heh forget that I mentioned that, the day is far too good at the moment, sunshine and...............good day really

Eddie

 

[Gear_Junky]

Would someone please kindly explain about the "60-chord system"? Did a search on google and didn't find anything. Maybe drop a link?

Thanks!

P.S. Not every guitar player is a musician, some just do it as leisure, not having enough time to study to be a musician. But it doesn't mean we're not learning

 

[Dracon]

Would someone please kindly explain about the "60-chord system"? Did a search on google and didn't find anything. Maybe drop a link?

I don't know about the 60 chord system but there is a simple learn 72 chords in 15 minutes system that I learned.

On a 6 string -

Say take the E - chord (at Fret 0)

S
E|0-------
B|0-------
G|2-------
D|4-------
A|3-------
E|0-------

Then you move down to the next Fret and use your 1st finger to bar at the string keeping the other fingers in position, continue moving down to the 12 fret.

Now you do the same with Em (same finger position except without the 2nd finger)

S
E|0-------
B|0-------
G|0-------
D|4-------
A|3-------
E|0-------

And you repeat the process with the E7 (without the 4th finger).
S
E|0-------
B|0-------
G|2-------
D|0-------
A|3-------
E|0-------

(You have just learned 32 Chords) now do the same with say the A Chord

E|0----|--------
B|-----|4-------
G|-----|3-------
D|-----|3-------
A|0----|--------
E|-----|X-------

The Am Chord

E|0----|--------
B|2----|--------
G|-----|4-------
D|-----|3-------
A|0----|--------
E|-----|X-------

The A7 Chord

E|0----|--------
B|-----|4-------
G|0----|--------
D|-----|3-------
A|0----|--------
E|-----|X-------

Viola! You have just learned 72 Chords! Congratulations.

I know what you are thinking "wait how do I know what each of these chords are?". Easy, the string closer to your face (shown at the bottom on these drawings) is the Chord (When you bar the strings down the string you play closesest to you is the root note of the Chord meaning the chord name) and the position of the fingers tells you if it's Major, minor or 7.

I suppose the 60 Chord system is similar to this one.

 

[XLR]

What's wrong with musicians these days?

Jeez, lighten up. Nothing's wrong with musicians these days.

IMO musicians that are oriented towards musical literacy have always been at odds with musicians that learn by rote and play by ear. In fact, I think there's a whole set of weird dynamics that go on with that. Is one way better than the other? Sure, but only in light of what sphere of music you're going to be playing in. A folk guitarist in Appalachia has different needs than a jazz guitarist majoring in music at college. I mean, I've got a conservatory degree but that doesn't make me a better musician than a delta blues player who doesn't use notation at all. And the degree doesn't help me much if he asks me to sit in for a set.

People who sound good - expressive, great tone, in tune, in the pocket - do so for reasons other than knowing the pitch names at any fret, or being able to sightread sixteenth notes at 140 bpm on the metronome.

I think it's better to know, than not know, the fretboard well in pitch names, notation, harmony, voice leading... But only if it doesn't interfere with your music making. Depends on the person and the style.

Tim

 

[Dracon]

I like Django. I like Grant Green. I'm not even a guitar player and I know all the notes instantly with no need to calculate. I'm not a drummer and I can tune drums better than most drummers. I can even tune a piano. (I used to work for a piano resotoration business when I was a teenager.) What's wrong with musicians these days?

I don't know that being able to know the notes instantly has anything to do with being a musician. Being able to tell the difference between E or A without any reference is great for a recording engineer, is great for a piano tuner, but not really necessary to play the piano, guitar, and certainly not the drum either.

Being able to read music, kinda helps, knowing which key is which on the piano or which string or chord is what on the guitar helps. Being able to tell an E from an F without any reference (meaning one note played and someone asking what note that is) is not going to help me to play my guitar any better.

Besides, we are all different and if we weren't it be very boring. Be happy that you have the capability you have and use it to your advantage.

 

[Gear_Junky]

Re: 60-Chord System ???

I don't know about the 60 chord system but there is a simple learn 72 chords in 15 minutes system that I learned.


Thank you, Dracon! But I'd say that this "system" is pretty much inherent in any fretboard strummed instrument. I was thinking more along the lines of the CAGED system.

I know all these chords and how to name them and I've learned the various 7th, suspended and 6th chords etc.

The 2 bass strings are no problem at all - that's how I learned the notes on them - by learning the various moveable chords of CAGED and also by playing bass. But the other 4 strings just never came along, so I thought maybe the "60 chord system" is something new.

Surely, anyone can figure out "alphabetically" which note each fret is, but the key to using it musically is to know instantly which note, without referencing, or if referencing, doing the closest note very quickly, like I do on bass - I know certain shapes on adjacent strings and 1 or 2 strings over - I know my octaves, 5th's and 3rd's.

But to me the 4 high guitar strings, especially with B string being 1 fret lower than "anticipated" throws me off. I guess it's only learned by rote memorization and application.

 

[Dracon]

IThank you, Dracon! But I'd say that this "system" is pretty much inherent in any fretboard strummed instrument. I was thinking more along the lines of the CAGED system.

Well, sorry to have wasted your time then.

I do know that I don't know anything about any 60 Chord system of any kind, CAGED or un-CAGED.