Do I need copyrights for this

[glynb]

That is true, but the copyright application can be made at any time, including years after the material in question was published. It's not the date of registration, but the date of publishing that will determine copyright infringement. The material can be, and usually is, protected by copyright long before it is registered. So- if you steal my unregistered artistic property, and register the copyright in your name, but I can prove I published first, I can take you to court and win. You will also be subject to criminal charges, potentially, after I shake you down in civil court. Registering published material and falsely representing yourself as the author is a Federal offense. Oddly enough, if the material isn't published, it's pretty easy to steal it. So I can steal poems from my brother. He gave it to me, but that is not distribution in a public forum.
It all comes back to- if your material is registered with the copyright office, your chances of receiving justice in any legal action is greatly increased. What your rights are, and whether you can enforce them, are often two different ball games.-Richie

If you stole words from your brother and published them as your own, if your brother could subsequently prove beyond doubt that he wrote them first then you'd still be in trouble regardless of when you falsely published them as your own. of course the chances of him proving to the satisfaction of a court that he wrote them first are doubtful, but in THEORY the fact that you publish at a certain date doesn't mean you have the copyright from that date if someone else can prove they wrote them first.


With regard to this...
"Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U. S. origin."
Interesting. What about the case of a work written elsewhere in the world, published by someone in the USA and it turns out that it was written by someone else who did not register in the States?

Take my case, in the UK. I've done the 'poor mans copyright thing', there is nowhere to register here in the UK. So i send one of my CDs off to the states and find out someone else has ripped off the song words nad melody in the USA. My song isn't registered in the USA, does that mean I have no case?

 

[true-eurt]

From the US Copyright Web Site:

"Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U. S. origin."

So if all you have is the 'poor-man's copyright' (i.e. mail it to yourself), U.S. copyright laws pretty much say you will never even get a chance to present your case to a judge for him/her to rule on...

Geeze...and all that postage....and what about all these extra envelopes..???? Not to mention the safety deposit box..this just gets worse and worser...is that a word??? Thank you BentRabbit

 

[true-eurt]

Wrong-O True-eurt, at least in the U.S. Words, other than titles, or "short phrases" (Example- Go Girl!), which are not copyrightable, are the protected property of the artist from the moment they are "published". Publishing is defined as any distribution of the protected material in a public forum, which includes, but is not limited to- any performance, distribution, or broadcast of recorded or written material. If you make five copies of a song's lyrics, and hand them to 5 total strangers, it's published, and copyright protected.
The hard part will be proving that. While the system you describe of sealing archival material has won in some court cases, it has lost in others. It may depend on whether the judge got laid yesterday. Registering a copyright is just a way of increasing your ability to prove that a piece of material is copyright protected.-Richie

Thanks Richie...I am at the copy machine right now....planning on going to 4-way stop to distribute...what the heck..might as well sing the tunes/play the geetar while I am there..If I get arrested, that will help...Be on record for disturbing the peace with a lethal weapon..Eurts geetar....

 

[true-eurt]

If you stole words from your brother and published them as your own, if your brother could subsequently prove beyond doubt that he wrote them first then you'd still be in trouble regardless of when you falsely published them as your own. of course the chances of him proving to the satisfaction of a court that he wrote them first are doubtful, but in THEORY the fact that you publish at a certain date doesn't mean you have the copyright from that date if someone else can prove they wrote them first.


With regard to this...
"Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U. S. origin."
Interesting. What about the case of a work written elsewhere in the world, published by someone in the USA and it turns out that it was written by someone else who did not register in the States?

Take my case, in the UK. I've done the 'poor mans copyright thing', there is nowhere to register here in the UK. So i send one of my CDs off to the states and find out someone else has ripped off the song words nad melody in the USA. My song isn't registered in the USA, does that mean I have no case?

That is a good question glynb....I want to know that myself.....
And does performing your works in Church count also...especially if it was camcorded? What about this Forum..If I post lyrics to a song are they then considered mine...If I wrote them..

 

[arjoll]

Hi - I've just stumbled across this thread.

I'm not a copyright expert, but one thing that stands out from this thread is that despite the efforts of the recording, motion picture and software industries, copyright law is nowhere near consistent from country to country.

The original post was from London (I'm guessing the UK as small town US posts usually have their state!), and copyright law could be quite different in the detail than US copyright. Its probably similar to other EU countries, and also probably similar in the broad concepts to the US, but small details such as how your work becomes 'copyrighted' could be different.

I am in New Zealand, where our copyright law would almost certainly have derived originally from UK law. There have been a couple of revisions in the last 50 years which most likely reflect the fact that almost all legislation we inherited in the 19th century has long since been updated. There are a couple of unique aspects to copyright law here and it might pay to check if they apply in the UK or if harmonisation with the EU has meant that we now differ:

1. There is no 'fair use' right for recorded works in NZ. All format-shifting (CD to cassette, CD to MP3 or whatever) is a breach of copyright under NZ law. I don't think APRA or anyone else has ever bothered prosecuting small-time format shifting but this is something I warn every client who buys an iPod about.

2. Copyright is inherent in every original work. Sending yourself the work in registered mail is a valid form of giving yourself some evidence that you created the work first, and that the major artist recording your work ripped it off. However, if its you against a big label then you're pretty much stuffed -they will have deeper pockets than you and will just defend themselves until you've run out of money.

3. Bearing in mind #2 it is a very wise move to register yourself and your works with an industry body - in New Zealand and Australia we have APRA. You may think you're 'selling your soul' and that they will control your creative process yada yada. Wrong. You still own the music, they administer it, they collect royalties and (a) if you get airplay they will start paying you royalties and (b) if you get ripped off they will start to go in to bat for you.

This may look NZ-centric and irrelevant, but my main points are:
* Check copyright law in your country - we're all different, and just because it happens in the US it does not mean it happens anywhere else.
* Talk to an industry association, preferably one who is focussed on the artist not the labels. Even talking to a friendly indie label about copyright in your country might be worth it.

Hope this helps!

Cya
Andrew