Digi-001

  • Thread starter Thread starter mjames
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I have thought long and hard about this digi 001 myself. The biggest thing that turns me off to it is the cost of the plugins. I don't know if you have checked them out, but they are quite expensive. I think going with something else that allows greater flexibility in this area would be much better.

Just my 2 cents

Joe
 
As I said, if you can spend more money theres better stuff around.

I didnt buy the 001 because of their promo video, I bought it because it gave me the right tools at the right price. If I was to buy another soundcard It wouldnt likely be a delta 1010 as that wouldnt be a big step up, but more likely I'd look at rme's stuff.

the digi 001 is 24/48. while 24/96 to some has its advantages those extra frequencies cannot be directed by microphones, reproduced by speakers, or heard by the human ear. Maybe some people have heard differences, but it may just be the difference it 2 unique designs.

Now, since I own the 001 and not the delta 1010 I couldnt compare their a/d converters.But, I beleive many studio's do use digidesigns 888/24 converters with their systems.Really what no "serious" studio would do is use either a 001 or delta 1010. neither one of those is high end pro audio.

The main criticisms of the 001 are that its made around pro tools, and not as flexable as other cards with different drivers.but you can still use logic audio on it just fine.

But if your editing audio pro tools is great.Vegas is also really good.Either of those is better then cakewalk or logic for audio editing, but not for midi.

On 001 and theres lots of plugs in rtas for mac, from bombfactory, to mcdsp, to waves, to duy and on and on.

I'm trying to give good information here, not take out a grudge on a manufacturer who's high end systems I cant afford.

If I had my purchase to do again I'd get a motu system and use digital performer.The delta 1010 is a great unit that has gotten rave reviews from reputable sources like sound on sound. The digi 001 when It came out got great reviews as well, and generally is put down by people that dont own their systems.

You now know the weaknesses of the 001.Pesonally Id get the delta to run cubase,vegas, or logic.Id get the 001 for pro tools, and you can also run logic on it. And Id get the motu 2408 for dp.It depends on how you like to work.Also theres the motu 828 their version of the 001.Youve got to decide how you want to work.

I would suggest that the motu 2408 is the most expandable.It has 24 channels of digital i/o just waiting for a/d converters such as the ones by rme or apogee.
The 2408 is just as expandable as the mixtreme or rme's cards. plus it would be great to use it with the exemplay digital performer software.
Id reccomend cubase 5.0 on mac, but on p.c. there have been big stability issues.

http://www.motunation.com
 
Jim if your going to be using samplers and synths, plus programming drums your eventually going to use midi.

If all you need is a few i/o channels the rme hammerfall is there for you.

If you git a mac Id sasy you cant go wrong with either pro tools, dp, or cubase.On pc theres nothing thats really stable.there are things that are almost stable, but even then the system is plug and pray
 
hi robert,

I read your post and I agree with you on some issues.

Neither the digi-001 or the delta 1010 can be considered pro.

Also theres a lot of plugins for Rtas.

But I would like to differ on some issues:
the delta 1010's converters are better than digidesign's 888/20, which was used in some studios before the advent of the 888/24

also, the delta 1010 compares favorably with both the motu2408 and the rme cards in the aspect of sound quality and I suspect is even better than the RME audio cards.

I am not knocking the digi-001 . What I am saying is that it is not worth it to buy a digi-001 and then have to buy a a/d converter and/or outboard preamps, because that makes it more expensive than the alternatives.

I have friends who do their work on tape and get good results. I have a friend who uses a fostex 16 bit machine and gets great results. In the final analysis, it is the amount of utility that one derives out of anything that counts and also how much performance one can squeeze out of any box.


peace.
 
Robert Jaybird and Cyan Jaguar,

Thanks for your inputs. Cyan, one key issue for me is this is my first jump into hard disk recording. The last time I did serious recording was around 1985--all analogue and a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away. The reason I am strongly inclined to go with Protools LE is the user friendliness with mixing and editing. That is paramount. Hence, I wouldn't really mind putting RME or Apogee in front of the Digi 001 at a later date if desired.

I'm bright but have limited time and energy to fight with a system's steep learning curve reportedly indiginous to Logic and Cubase. I haven't heard much about Digital Performer's ease or difficutly of use but have read MOTU's customer support is an oxymoron, i.e, pathetic.

I'm on the fence about PC or Mac but:
  • Mac
  • all Mac users have no complaints
  • more stable platform
  • more plug-ins for Mac
  • platform new to me and one more thing to learn and break into
  • arguably less horsepower bang-for-buck compared to PC but that isn't a significant issue for me; I don't mind spending extra $(US) for years of great recording
  • PC
  • some PC users love it; some are less thrilled but the PC camp is not as united as the Mac camp
  • less stable platform. Not so bad when I get bumped with MS Word or AOL but I could see it being infuriating during a hard-worked mix or track recording
  • fewer plug-ins but enough for me
  • I've worked on PCs for 5 years but not in super great depth
 
a probably dumb question: Cyan-- you're running that on PC?

and also.. would you consider Rosetta in front of LE/digi001 "pro".. just in terms of sound, that is (forgetting effects, tracks and anything else.)?

-jk
 
Jim S

I was in the same spot (almost) about six months ago. I first decided which platform to use. Although I had always used a PC for everything, when it came to music, it seemed clear to me that I did not want to spend time working out computer bugs and conflicts but rather to record music. So, I went with a MAC. I like it very much. It is a breeze to use. I understand from what I read on the web that most studios use a MAC platform.

Next I was down to which hardware/software combination. I was told to use the same company for hardware and software to avoid conflicts and the inability of the hardware to accomodate all functions available in the software. So, with that, I essentially had two options: Digi 001 + PTLE or MOTU 2408 and Digital Performer. I chose the latter because of many things:

1. No artificial track limitations;
2. Digital performer is a professional grade software, used by many sudios to do midi and audio tracking, even if they end up editing in Protools, whereas PTLE is not;
3. MOTU's line is expandable whereas the Digi 001 is a dead end;
4. Many more plug ins with MOTU than with Digi;
5. Much more powerful midi implementation; and
6. The price is almost the same.

I am very happy with my setup.

I also got Digi's video, which almost swayed me. But I got some sound advice from a friend and had a knowledgeable salesperson at Guitar Center (is that an oxymoron?) to demo Digital Performer for me. I was sold.

Have you seen Digital Performer in action? If not, have it demo'ed. I also would suggest you e-mail or call MOTU's sales - customer support. They have been very helpful to me.

Hope this helps

Albert
 
The aardvark Q10 looks like a viable option if you ask me. Although, it has a 48khz tops sample rate.
I wonder how the sound quality compares to a system w/external mixer recording at 96khz rates.
 
hi Jerry Kahn,


Yes, I am running on a pc. while the delta 1010 is invisible to the system( I have not had one problem with it), vegas pro is a bit less so. I have only one problem with vegas. when you click on it the first time, it has an error in kernel and closes, but when you run it the second time, it runs fine. Well, that problem and the fact that the track optimised plugins are a joke.

Forgetting track count and the 44.1 k limitation and anything else, the rosetta in front of digi001 should be pro- if it sounds anywhere as good as the high end converters that apogee offers.

Reason I say this is : my opinion of pro is good sound into the computer, with a good editor that provides transparent algorythms. And protools provides mostly transparent algorythms. The rosetta can take care of the sound area.

As I said though, good sound is subjective. Before I got into recording, I heard cds that my friends did with inexpensive keyboards, and radioshack cables and 16 bit converters and plugins, and 20 dollar mics, and they sounded off the hook. My setup is more advanced, but I don't think my sound is there yet. Its just a subjective thing.

did you know: it was the digi-001 video that made me buy an akg c414 mic. I really loved the way it sounded through those pres.

Jim s: I agree with you. Protools is the master at editting and audio, and for that reason, the digi-001 is a good buy.

I also have to say that I have not been able to match the quality of the sound that they had on the digi-001 demo, so there are a lot of things that factor into a pro sounding final mix.

peace y'all
 
I think the video is quite misleading. There are plugins and additional software they use that does not come standard with the digi001 system. They do not specify which ones come with the system and which ones do not. It makes it very hard to determine whether or not the basic system will suite your needs. As I stated in my previous post, the plugins for this software are very expensive.

One thing that really turned me off to the system was, in the video, the software they are using to mix down to that can then be transfered to cd was a cool looking program. But the problem is that it is not included. Another problem is that the program only work on a mac. they do not have a windows version.
 
Digital Peformer--haven't heard much at all about it, neither good nor bad. I haven't seen Digital Performer either. That's part of the problem with choosing these products: it's hard to see and try these systems out because very few stores have them set up on a computer. I'm not into MIDI (maybe someday but not now). I'll call Guitar Center but the majority of salespeople at the big music chain stores are commission-minded and an insult to most mammals walking on two legs.

PT LE 5has it's pros and cons. However, few knock it's userfriendliness and shallow learning curve. That may seem short sighted but after a day at work or on the weekends the shallow learning curve yields greater creative efficiency & less stress. I've got other things to learn to: reviewing old material and keeping up with new developments in my professional field as well as other interests, hobbies, and facets of music: practicing my instruments, composing, etc.

Plug-ins' cost isn't a major factor for me. Maybe I'm naive but I can't see myself using that many plug-ins. Some claim the PT RTAS and audio-suite plug-ins are limited but there are more now than I could imagine using. How many reverb and time modulation delay plug-ins do I need? One each. It's not the number of ingredients that count (tracks, plug-ins, mics, guitars, MIDI modules, etc) but how mix and cook with them.

Mac now seems to be the platform I'll choose albeit I was previously leaning toward PC Win. I was at a Digiworld Conference in Miami today. All swore by and recommended Mac unless I was particularly limited to PC. Sure it's sponsored by Mac but see my previous post in this thread. The day really helped me get an idea of what some plug-ins can and can't do. I tried many products by Digidesign, Bombfactory, Koblo, Antares, Amp Farm, etc.

Video for Digi001 is on a Mac and does use the MasterList CD mastering software is only for Mac at this time. I'm sure it's not as easy as they show: everything was rehearsed, they know the system, etc. But it is seductive.
 
Jim S

If you are interested in having Digital Performer demo'd you can e-mail MOTU's customer support people and they will hook you up with a reseller that has it set up for a demo in your area. They hooked me up with a dealer in San Diego, but my local GC guy used it personally so he could demo it to me. Also, I would check out the Digidesign BBS for discussions about DP v. PT (just do a search --you'll get lots of hits), and would also look at the unofficial site for MOTU and look at the list archives for questions and answers from the various discussions:

http://www.unicornation.com/

My two cents.

Albert
 
Jim,
plug ins are important.Things like the bombfactory classic compressers, and mcdsp filterbank are very useful.Its beyond spacey effects to the basic tools needed to get a good sound.For reverb though, the plug ins arent up to the job. Just the idea that a $500 dollar suite of plugs cab do the job of $40,000 of hardware is hard to beat.

Also masterlist c.d. is kind of a joke.Get t-racks instead.
Not that masterlist is bad, but your payin more for less if you dig.Also if you use plug ins like the ones from waves to do master type processing then all youd need is apples i tunes to burn cd's and mp3's.Id say get the waves native gold bundle and t-racks.But, also check out the duy everpack, bombfactories compressers, and the mcdsp filterbank.

Well. at least check out t-racks. I dont know anybody that uses masterlist personally.
 
Robert and all,

Thanks enormously for your input,esp. regarding mastering CDs. I have read nothing but flattering posts acroos the 'net regardng T-Racks for mastering.

I will get some RTAS and audiosuite (not TDM) plugs-in. Over the course of several years I don't think their cost difference is an issue for me. I anticipate starting out with Bomb Factory Sansamp and Classic Compressors, the Digidesign Sample Cell hardware, and maybe a pitch correcting program in addition to a CD mastering/burning program. Adaptec Jam for Mac anybody?

I think PT LE 5.1 ships with reverb, chorus, and flange in addition to the ubiquitous EQ, comp, and delay. I'll double check when I finally get my act together: first week of March is my deadline to finish 'researching' and then go for it. One could spend years getting opinions and researching it and there is no right answer. There definitely are some wrong answers and that's what I want to avoid to the best of my ability.

Keep the hits coming. All of this is terrific. I'm sure this is helping others now and in the future when they search these forums.
 
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