Different mic options for sax.

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73TypeLT LS1

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I am looking for a good home recording mic. I play Soprano to Bari sax and plan on getting a flute in the near future.
Is there a mic that will give me the flexibility to record all the above instruments? Prefer to keep it under $250.
 
My preference is to use a dynamic a foot or so up and out from the bell.
An SM-57 will do but if you've got the money, go for a Sennheiser MD-421 or an Electrovioce RE-20.

Then put a large-diameter condenser five or six feet out at head-height.

Mix till sweet.

Remember that the sound of a sax comes from the ENTIRE body of the instrument, not just the bell.
 
Well I have to be honest. For flute the only mics I like tend to be large diaphragm condensers that are a little bright. Sax is more flexible, there are some good dynamics that are inexpensive, but they really sound bad on flute.

Since you're looking for one mic that will be killer for all these instruments, I think it will pay to step up a bit, like the Shure KSM44 or the AT4050. If those aren't affordable, try the KSM27 or AT4040. The latter two are $300.

I have the KSM27 and it's really nice on my bamboo cane flutes.
 
Make sure the sax itself sounds good!
I used an SM-57 on a 1950's sax last week on jazz and and latin tunes, and it sounded fantastic!
 
The CAD M179, the patterns will let you work the room a bit and let the horn open up.
 
TimOBrien said:
Remember that the sound of a sax comes from the ENTIRE body of the instrument, not just the bell.
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That is more true with the clarinet family. You will see plenty of mics designed to go on the bell of the sax and they work fine. However, if you put one of those on the bell of my bass clarinet, you will really only hear the keys closest to the bell.

I hear that an sm57 sounds good through an amazing pre-amp, but outside of that scenario, why the hell would you put one on a sax for a quality recording? Talk about shit. As someone who plays lots of the reed family, not having to use an sm57 is the reason why I got good mics to record sax and clarinet. Someone who would use a sm57 for specifically recording a sax is probably not a sax player. Sure it would work, but it sure wouldn't give the horn its fair shake. I gaurentee you that even the crappiest chinese condensor would be better at recording a sax or flute over an sm57. Putting a sm57 on a horn is fine for a club or concert, but not hi fidelity recording applications.

Your best bet from my experience would be some sort of large diaphram condensor, with plenty of lean towards one of the tube variety. However, I picked up a Beyer M500 and that is now my reed mic of choice, especially in a live context where other instruments are playing. You can get one on ebay for $200-300.
 
I find that dynamic mics dont work very well for horns up close. They need to be a few feet back which can actually be difficult to do with an SM57 or MD421. Same goes with condensors if they are loud players. I put a AKG C414 EB on a sax a while ago and got excellent results. I had it just a few inches away from the bell and pointed a litte upwards toward the keys. This was also for a jazz setting so it might not be what your looking for. But imagine something like SP B1 would give a similiar sound to the C414. V67 if your looking for something alittle darker.

Danny
 
sax mic

I had old friend over who played sax on one of my jazz songs and we ended-up using a studio project C-1 we set the mic stright up on mic stand 3 to 4 feet while played a Alto and then a Sorprono, it worked out really nice, and this mic is in your price range, my two cents.
 
I like ribbons. I prefer the AEA R84 but I wonder how one of the low cost ribbons would work in this app.
 
What you need is a Sennheiser MD441, or a ribbon mic. A Beyer M160, 260 or 500 will please you.

The 441 is a great dynamic mic, sounds good on almost anything, even violin and certainly flute.

The ribbons are very special, very smooth sounding mics, special indeed. :D
(fragile as well)
 
I'm on a similar wavelength to Han...........a Sennheiser MD-441 or a ribbon mic, but depending on what sound I needed at the time I may try anything from an Oktava 012 to a LD tube mic.

You occasionally see old Shure 330 series ribbons on eBay and these have a great reputation for horns, etc. The only thing with using a ribbon mic is that you really should run it through a decent preamp which has plenty of gain available as by themsleves they normally aren't high outputing mics.

:cool:
 
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I recently use a Beyer M-260 from back in the 60's and ran it through an API 512b and it sounded wonderful with a 414 as a room mic (also through another API) Came out with a nice big lush sound on sax. I highly recommend the ribbons just to give it a smooth sound. I had originally tried the 414 in front but thought it to be too clear of a sound.
 
Hello guys, first post here so I hope I'm not asking a question asked too often before. :) Just to resurrect this thread tho, I have recently bought a Rode NTK2 wanting the smoother tube sound esp for tenor sax. It works a treat for the sop and tenor sax in Omni and Cardioid mode and in between having a totally variable polar pattern. You get quite different characters of tone that way. Very pleased with the results.

Anyway what I want to ask is how to record the flute a little better then I am at the moment. U see I just play the sax a little distance away a foot or so with the mic just above the height of the bell and sounds great. But when recording the flute with a popper stopper perhaps a little closer, being lower in volume, I have to cut quite dramatically 1.5-4 khz otherwise the sound is rather breathy and fizzy - not at all warm as would prefer especially for a slow soft classical piece.

Now perhaps the recording space is not ideal so I tried close mic-ing over a more ambient setup. More omni patterns seems to give the roundest tone this way, but still the post eq-ing must be dramatic.

Do you guys think it necessary to record a flute from a distance? What height should the mic be preferably compared with the flute itself? Which part of the flute should be in line with the mic if close mic-ing? The mouthpiece or more of the body?

Now I am saving up for a decent preamp so perhaps increasing the gain on my soundcard is not ideal as it seems quite noisy, so this may be a factor for any suggestion you might make. (M-Audio Firewire 410 btw).

Incidentally I have found the FAQ section incredibly helpful when choosing a mic. Good forum going on here. :)
 
Someone here made a really nice recording of sax using an MXL V67G. Its a large dia. condensor mic.
I agree about the SM57; not something I would use for sax.
Being a sax player myself, I do tend to like LD condensors, but the MD441 works nicely too - but that may be a bit out of your price range.

The only ribbon I have is the RCA 77DX. That mike is so sensitive to the way a room sounds, so unless you really have a great room, I'd stay away from those type of ribbons.

Get a V67G. Hook it up to a decent pre-amp, hit record and play that sax!
If you don't like it, then we can talk about some better, more expensive LD Condensors. But for a hundred bucks, it'd be hard to go wrong.
 
Very good points Michael, and sincere. But I thought you were a pianist? did'nt know you played sax too!! How's the studio comin?
 
I record a lot of tenor sax, and tried dozens of different mics.

Dynamic mics will always give you a very boxy and "tinny" sound. The MD441 is certainly the best dynamic mic for sax, but condensors in general will give you a much better sound. I'd only recommend a dynamic mic (including the 441) if you go for a very aggressive sax sound, growling and similar things. For a smooth sax sound, a dynamic is the wrong mic.

A sax can really shine with a small diaphragm condenser. Sax is one of the best applications for SDCs! I tried many LDCs (e.g.: AT 4047 -- sounds really bad, Gefell M930 -- sounds too smooth and doesn't have enough edge), but SDC in general can give you far better results. My absolut favorite sax mic is the Neumann KM184. That mic does an amazing job on a sax: it gives you a very full sound in the lower register, and the slightly hyped high frequencies will make your upper register very crisp & clear.

Mic placement is the key to a good sax recording. As has been said earlier, the entire body of a sax produces the tones and overtones. My mic placement of choice is pointing a SDC at the lower register, slightly offaxis to the right (from the player). Micing the bell is pretty much the worst you can do: you'll hear a lot of breathing noise, and even the saliber vibrating on the reed. Yuk! ;)
 
saxopholus said:
I have recently bought a Rode NTK2 wanting the smoother tube sound esp for tenor sax.
Click to expand...
I heard a few very good tenor sax CDs recorded with an NT2. Seems to be a good match.
 
mikey@thecave said:
i was gunna say SP C#1 But someone beat me to it :)
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Are you serious? C1? much too bright and thin. My favorite LDC sax mic is a Neumann M149, but you can't get that baby for $250 :D

A while back I recorded an alto sax solo with a MD441 and that sounds very good. An MXL V69 or V77 may sound good as well, a little bright, so you have to cut some higs, but both MXL (tube) mics have a warm sound.
 
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