P
phlopip
New member
or is it just me that finds it immensely hard?
p_wats
New member
Don't worry. It takes time. I used to spend weeks tweaking things with mixes--trying them on all kinds of different stereo systems and forcing my girlfriend to listen to several million slightly-different mixes before I got it "right" (still debatable).
Do you have decent monitors, or at least multiple stereos you can try it on? Don't forget the age-old "car test" (a car's engine cuts out a lot of frequencies, so if it sounds good there you're doing well).
I'm far from a pro, so I'm sure others will have better advice, but hang in there!
Do you have decent monitors, or at least multiple stereos you can try it on? Don't forget the age-old "car test" (a car's engine cuts out a lot of frequencies, so if it sounds good there you're doing well).
I'm far from a pro, so I'm sure others will have better advice, but hang in there!
D_Vincent
New member
Its extreamly hard
Ive read it takes 10,000 hours or 6 years to get really good at something...Mixing is no different than trying to learn an instrument for the first time.
Ive been mixing for 3 years...in 3 more years I may actually get good at it.
Mind you though some things come more naturally to people as well...for instance I learned guitar very quickly however mixing not so much...some people may have a natural gift for mixing right out of the gate however overall it will take time to learn.
When learning an instrument you will buy chord books or perhaps use online tab to learn...I think mixing is the same way...you have to find good info on how to mix...you cant just pull it out of the air from nowhere (however there are exceptions and some people have a natural ear for it)
--------------------
Eventually you will get better at mixing however you have to acquire some knowledge along the way.
-------------
My mixing started to improve once I stopped using presets on plugins...My # 1 tip is to not use presests.
# 2 tip is to find some type of saturation plugin when mixing tracks...I usually put a saturation plug and compression plug on the master bus then mix my individual tracks through that
example
Guitar track
Plugins in this order
Saturation,Comp,EQ,(Gate if needed)...then I render down to WAV (mute the master comp and saturation before rendering because you dont want to add it twice to the guitar track)...delete track after rendering and bring in the treated guitar track WAV file.
Then I "send" a split harmonizer and sometimes a flanger to the treated guitar track...I also send a hall reverb and sometimes a delay (mostly send delay on lead guitar tracks.
I use "Hall" reverb on guitar and use "Plate" reverb on things like drums and vocals however I also send a delay or 2 to the vocals before I even add reverb...I may add a touch of reverb...I also send a split harmonizer and flanger to vocal track.
---------------
Hear is a free split hamonizer/pitch shifter.
Dont use presets.
Right now the settings I use for pitch shifter/detuner
-12 cents 14 ms delay 1000% mix (EDIT) changed to 100%
+12 cents 19 ms delay 100% mix
--------------
you can also try -9 cents + 9 cents or maybe adust mix...find a setting you like.
----------------
download free plugin here
http://www.brothersoft.com/split-harmonizer-download-295423.html
Ive read it takes 10,000 hours or 6 years to get really good at something...Mixing is no different than trying to learn an instrument for the first time.
Ive been mixing for 3 years...in 3 more years I may actually get good at it.
Mind you though some things come more naturally to people as well...for instance I learned guitar very quickly however mixing not so much...some people may have a natural gift for mixing right out of the gate however overall it will take time to learn.
When learning an instrument you will buy chord books or perhaps use online tab to learn...I think mixing is the same way...you have to find good info on how to mix...you cant just pull it out of the air from nowhere (however there are exceptions and some people have a natural ear for it)
--------------------
Eventually you will get better at mixing however you have to acquire some knowledge along the way.
-------------
My mixing started to improve once I stopped using presets on plugins...My # 1 tip is to not use presests.
# 2 tip is to find some type of saturation plugin when mixing tracks...I usually put a saturation plug and compression plug on the master bus then mix my individual tracks through that
example
Guitar track
Plugins in this order
Saturation,Comp,EQ,(Gate if needed)...then I render down to WAV (mute the master comp and saturation before rendering because you dont want to add it twice to the guitar track)...delete track after rendering and bring in the treated guitar track WAV file.
Then I "send" a split harmonizer and sometimes a flanger to the treated guitar track...I also send a hall reverb and sometimes a delay (mostly send delay on lead guitar tracks.
I use "Hall" reverb on guitar and use "Plate" reverb on things like drums and vocals however I also send a delay or 2 to the vocals before I even add reverb...I may add a touch of reverb...I also send a split harmonizer and flanger to vocal track.
---------------
Hear is a free split hamonizer/pitch shifter.
Dont use presets.
Right now the settings I use for pitch shifter/detuner
-12 cents 14 ms delay 1000% mix (EDIT) changed to 100%
+12 cents 19 ms delay 100% mix
--------------
you can also try -9 cents + 9 cents or maybe adust mix...find a setting you like.
----------------
download free plugin here
http://www.brothersoft.com/split-harmonizer-download-295423.html
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Dogbreath
Im an ex-spurt
Yeah...mixing just takes time to learn the ropes.
No shortcuts.
A big part of my struggles at first was simply my room.
It sucked.
I had no treatment anywhere...bass buildup everywhere and I was gettin frustrated that my mixes sounded like shit when I'd put my freshly burned CD in other playback systems even though they sounded good in my room.
Translation was really hit n miss.
After treating the room, it's still just ongoing learning. Developing that critical ear, learning what frequencies of instruments play well with others and what freqs don't. Where to cut...how much to cut...etc ad nauseum...
Just hang in there dude...you'll get it.
No shortcuts.
A big part of my struggles at first was simply my room.
It sucked.
I had no treatment anywhere...bass buildup everywhere and I was gettin frustrated that my mixes sounded like shit when I'd put my freshly burned CD in other playback systems even though they sounded good in my room.
Translation was really hit n miss.
After treating the room, it's still just ongoing learning. Developing that critical ear, learning what frequencies of instruments play well with others and what freqs don't. Where to cut...how much to cut...etc ad nauseum...
Just hang in there dude...you'll get it.
BentRabbit
New member
Heck, I'm STILL struggling
tlennon1
Member
Mixing is an art form and an applied science (engineering) and it does take time to learn. Training your ears to hearing things a regular listerner doesn't have to pay attention to and knowing about gain staging and using plugins and outboard gear to get good results. Hang in.
Dogbreath
Im an ex-spurt
J
Joza
New member
Unless that plugin works very differently from all the others I know, those -12 cents and 14ms have absolutely no meaning because you are using 0% of the affected signal.Some good advices there, like don't use presets, but I would like to emphasize that every mix needs different things. For example that "saturation plugin" might work in some song, but it is absolutely not a thing that you need in every song. Heck, I don't even know what it actually is! (Probably some kind of distortion/harmonizer plugin)
suprstar
It aint ez being green
Your mixes will sound better and better the more you do. I've had a few ppl say that about mine anyway, that's how I think it ought to be.
D_Vincent
New member
Some good advices there, like don't use presets, but I would like to emphasize that every mix needs different things. For example that "saturation plugin" might work in some song, but it is absolutely not a thing that you need in every song. Heck, I don't even know what it actually is! (Probably some kind of distortion/harmonizer plugin)
---------------
I learn something new all the time.
I only started using that 0% setting recently because i read it somewhere...I used to use the same settings but have the mix 50% on each.
Im still struggling to find the right settings as well so im always open to new info.
Thanks
Massive Master
www.massivemastering.com
I know people (with less-than-stellar monitoring chains in poorly or untreated spaces) that have been at this for decades - and suck. Badly.
And I know people (who wisely invested in good monitoring chains and low end management) who started cranking out great sounding mixes in less than a year.
...and everything in between.
No doubt - Listening skills don't develop overnight. But they'll only develop as well as your monitoring chain will allow them to develop.
And I know people (who wisely invested in good monitoring chains and low end management) who started cranking out great sounding mixes in less than a year.
...and everything in between.
No doubt - Listening skills don't develop overnight. But they'll only develop as well as your monitoring chain will allow them to develop.
D_Vincent
New member
Im forever learning new mixing tips or tricks.
Ive started using the bus technique recently.
here is an image of it.
Basically it goes like this.
Create a drum bus,guitar bus,vocal bus effects bus ect and have all your guitars on the guitar bus...all vocals on vocal bus ect.
Then route those buses into frontend and backend.
Leave effects buss on its own
Image here...click image to enlarge
http://yfrog.com/5dmixingbusp
Ive started using the bus technique recently.
here is an image of it.
Basically it goes like this.
Create a drum bus,guitar bus,vocal bus effects bus ect and have all your guitars on the guitar bus...all vocals on vocal bus ect.
Then route those buses into frontend and backend.
Leave effects buss on its own
Image here...click image to enlarge
http://yfrog.com/5dmixingbusp
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R
rfahey86
New member
The hardest thing for me at first was using compression. Once I learned what it was I used it way too much. Now I realized I only have to use about a quarter of the compression I was using to make my mixes sound much better. Sometimes less is more.
Dogbreath
Im an ex-spurt
yeah, compression is one of the harder ones, I think. But just twiddling knobs was my best teacher. Crank em all up or down and see what they do to that track. Then back em off til it sounds right.
Any more, I just turn everything up to eleven and let er rip.
Any more, I just turn everything up to eleven and let er rip.
ez_willis
.
wow. no shit? i'm struggling, too. my room isn't treated in any way.
R
rfahey86
New member
I don't have a treated room either, but I've learned to mix at lower volume levels for the most part and my mixes are getting much better.
philbagg
Just Killing Time
Where I started:
Where I am now:
Don't worry dude... Put your head down and you're cool
Where I am now:
Don't worry dude... Put your head down and you're cool
Armistice
Son of Yoda
Where I started:
Where I am now:
Don't worry dude... Put your head down and you're cool
Can't help but notice a slight difference in style in the two pieces there Philby...
Nice marimba work at 3.50
kcearl
I see deaf people
my second mix was pretty good...I thought id cracked it...how wrong i was
I find guitars, when theres a few different tracks, difficult to get a hold of but getting better...synths/keys are pretty easy
Ive read quit a bit and watched tutorials...they have definitely helped but I find the MP3 clinic here a real help as well
One thing for the OP, in a recent mix contest amongst a few members here the winner mixed in an untreated room with a pair of behringer ms16 computer speakers and three effects, nothing else...it was a well tracked song but still it just shows...a decent pair of ears, a well tracked song, and some knowledge outweighs any room treatment or expensive monitors for most of us hobbiests
I find guitars, when theres a few different tracks, difficult to get a hold of but getting better...synths/keys are pretty easy
Ive read quit a bit and watched tutorials...they have definitely helped but I find the MP3 clinic here a real help as well
One thing for the OP, in a recent mix contest amongst a few members here the winner mixed in an untreated room with a pair of behringer ms16 computer speakers and three effects, nothing else...it was a well tracked song but still it just shows...a decent pair of ears, a well tracked song, and some knowledge outweighs any room treatment or expensive monitors for most of us hobbiests
grimtraveller
If only for a moment.....
I always live....and I always die.
I've come to the conclusion that I have OK ears, but neither great ears nor engineers' ears. I might do if I was doing this every day and had some producer breathing down my neck and a sympathetic main engineer about and a bitchy, awkward artist that demanded greatness as their bottom line.
But I've found with a little discipline it can be done and it's surprizing how clearly you can hear some things at low volume that are rather obscured when louder.
One thing I will say - I think most of us may well find that we are overly harsh in our opinion of our own stuff. Ez Willis talks of struggling with mixes in an untreated room. But a few months back, in another thread, he threw together a rough mix he did for a friend of his and it sounded fantastic, at least to my ears. And I saw a couple of days ago, Rami saying he didn't feel confident with his mixes. And I'm sitting there thinking "Blimey !" because I think they're neat.
You're never alone. Not here. Not when it comes to mixing !
I think I'm a bit like this except that my mixes don't suck badly. They just suck !
I've come to the conclusion that I have OK ears, but neither great ears nor engineers' ears. I might do if I was doing this every day and had some producer breathing down my neck and a sympathetic main engineer about and a bitchy, awkward artist that demanded greatness as their bottom line.
It's up and down for me. Truth is, I quite like my mixes and maybe it's because I hear others' that are so clear and uncluttered that I think mine are crummy, even though I like most of them.my second mix was pretty good...I thought id cracked it...how wrong i was
This is such an encouragement. One doesn't always want to advocate this for fear of being publically slaughtered and I'd not advocate against things that others have found to be helpful/crucial. But there are more important things like the basics.
Funnilly enough, I've found this recently. Many times I've tried to mix at low levels and the urge to turn up everything is overwhelming !
But I've found with a little discipline it can be done and it's surprizing how clearly you can hear some things at low volume that are rather obscured when louder.One thing I will say - I think most of us may well find that we are overly harsh in our opinion of our own stuff. Ez Willis talks of struggling with mixes in an untreated room. But a few months back, in another thread, he threw together a rough mix he did for a friend of his and it sounded fantastic, at least to my ears. And I saw a couple of days ago, Rami saying he didn't feel confident with his mixes. And I'm sitting there thinking "Blimey !" because I think they're neat.
