Demystifying samplers...

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Qasper

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Hi. I've got every instrument covered except the beats. I want to create ambiant, jumping beats which sound as organic as possible for trip-hop or dnb, not anything too electronic or techno. Drum machines and sound modules tend to sound fake, or so I've read. In fact, everything I've read points in one direction: Samplers.

So here's the Q: Where the hell do you get the samples? Unlike drum machines, I gather samplers don't come with integrated sounds, right? So where do you get 'em? I don't own a CD or vinyl collection and have no clue where I would get the sound files I need to do some Massive Attack-like beats. But I want those beats badly.

So what do I need to do? Buy the sampler and start shopping for a turn-table and 1950's records? Any help would be greaaatly appreciated as I can't seem to find any info anywhere on the web on this particular topic.

Thx.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Qasper:
So what do I need to do? Buy the sampler and start shopping for a turn-table and 1950's records?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Basically, yes. At least of you want 50's type of drums. :p
You can get samples from sample-CD's too. They have the added bonus that you can use them without paying money to the original musician. But wouldn't it be more fun to actually find the beats yourself?

Personally I LOVE drum machines. But then again, I'm not trying to find organic drum beats. I do weird dnb stuff with loads of different snare sounds and schizofrenic bass beats. :)
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Qasper:

So here's the Q: Where the hell do you get the samples? Unlike drum machines, I gather samplers don't come with integrated sounds, right? So where do you get 'em? I don't own a CD or vinyl collection and have no clue where I would get the sound files I need to do some Massive Attack-like beats. But I want those beats badly.

So what do I need to do? Buy the sampler and start shopping for a turn-table and 1950's records? Any help would be greaaatly appreciated as I can't seem to find any info anywhere on the web on this particular topic.
Thx.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Well, do you have any friends that play drums?
Get good quality recordings of Them playing by themselves (go for a good sound quality) and then Sample THAT!

Make your own Loops and Samples that way.
Everybody keeps looking for records to sample. Make your own.

You can also buy Cd's of people just playing for looping/Sampling.

Actually, I myself have thought about making and marketing a Drum sample CD, with sounds and sections for looping.

I personally haven't done any "looping", so I virtually have no experience with that-But I can get some awesome drumsounds on Tape, and I'm considered very inventive, and one of the better drummers where I live.

Tim




[This message has been edited by Tim Brown (edited 07-12-2000).]
 
Hmmm. Not a bad idea at all Tim. Thanks. I happen to know a prodigious drummer around here... I'll have to book the studio time, then.

And what should I sample him with? Any ideas? Akai seems to be the industry leader... But I have no clue how these machines work... Anybody ever find a reference book or webpage that explains the technology?

-Q-
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Qasper:

And what should I sample him with? Any ideas? Akai seems to be the industry leader... But I have no clue how these machines work... Anybody ever find a reference book or webpage that explains the technology?

-Q-<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, you could actually just put it into a Computer as a wav file and edit that way.

Tim
 
Good point. I'm on a VS-1880, so editing is limited, but you're right about just recording it straight up.

But then, what the hell are samplers for? Other than being sound modules that can record snipits of sound to be triggered (like sound modules are triggered), what can they do for me?

And if anybody knows about a good book on it, I'm still interested...
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Qasper:
Good point. I'm on a VS-1880, so editing is limited, but you're right about just recording it straight up.

But then, what the hell are samplers for? Other than being sound modules that can record snipits of sound to be triggered (like sound modules are triggered), what can they do for me?

And if anybody knows about a good book on it, I'm still interested...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


well. For me-it allows me to carry a ful aray of MY OWN SOUNDS. there is the key.
Technically, I could just use a DM5, But I personally do not like their Tom sounds at all, and I find that the snares never sound like what I'm looking for.
I use an 8" Snare.
Plus, the DM5 has no Ochestral sounda at all, and I Use some Orchestral Bells/Symphonic Chimes/Tubular Bells/Church bell soundes (Whew!! everybody calls them something different so, I put them al in there! Hahaha)
So, the key is Sampler allows you to sample and play back the ounds.
The reason I would say edit on a PC, is that you're not trying to watch that little
"window" of a screen while trying to see if it's working rght.

Tim
 
I see...
Hmm...
Still...
I need a book on the subject.
The concept just won't stick to my brain properly. For instance, what's the difference between a 3000$ sampler and a 1000$ sampler? Other than memory, I can't really figure out what would cause the price to triple... And if I'm just going to trigger my own sounds, why the hell not just play them straight up the first time on the VS?

BTW - thanks for being so patient. I'm feeling I should've posted this in the newbies forum...
 
The difference is loads of things. Memory, number of outputs, quality (mainly the number of bits used to sample), how many simoultaneous voices there are, if you can overload samples to smoothly go from one sample to another over the keyboard and velocity rang, how the editing works, what kind of filtering and other effects you can apply, and so on...

A sampler can not only trigger sounds, you can play with them. You can for example sample a dog and play a melodies with barking dogs. (But if you do, I'll personally strangle you. This was done to boredom in stilly euro-disco songs in the early eighties. Don't do it again! :) )
The sampler will also let you pitch-shift the recorded sound, and some samplers can also change the pitch without altering the length of the sample, or vice versa. This means you can record a groove, and change it to fit the beat and pitch of your song, and loop it to use as a groove track on your song, instead of a drum-machine or live drums.
 
ah HA!!
Regebro, you've just filled the gap. Ok. So this being said about samplers - would I be satisfied with a Roland S-770 or the Akai S1000/1100? Or are these mere toys with little of those features you mentioned? (I'm definitely going to want to warp my sound)

And how well does the Gigasampler weigh in? Would it make sense for me to get that program even if I'm limited with my Soundblaster Live and 64megs RAM on a 350mhz PII? (The question is: Do I have enough hardware for the software?)

Keep in mind, I'm VS oriented - I'm therefore biased for the modular and not all-software solution. But if the Giga is as good as I've read, wouldn't it make sense to go for it? What are the pros and cons?
 
About a year ago I was faced with choosing between buying a sampler(around $1000) and buying the DMPro. I wanted to upgrade from my D4 to get newer high quality samples, but I wasn't sure if one unit would satisfy my needs better than the other, or if I should get both. After a month of research, I went with the DMPro.

My reasons for choosing it over a sampler were as follows...
1. The DMPro cost around $800, plus $150 for the memory expansion card, making both units roughly the same price.
2. The DMPro came with tons of built-in sounds, ready to use out of the box, while a sampler, IMO, requires quite a bit of work before it could be used to make music.
3. The DMPro has 6 outputs, which is fairly consistent with the 4-8 available on most samplers.
4. The DMPro has built in FX, which is usually an option on samplers for more $$.
5. The blank memory card can be loaded with custom samples from a computer, adding much of the flexibility associated with samplers.
6. The memory cards can also hold sequences, which most samplers can also do.

The only obvious drawbacks to me are that the DMPro can only use up to an 8MB memory card, which is quite smaller than most samplers can handle, samplers have much more in-depth editing features, and samplers can actually record the sounds directly from mics or CDs, not needing to be loaded from a computer.

Overall, I am extremely happy with my purchase. It did take quite a long time to learn how to use the in-depth editing of the unit, but after going through the manual MANY times, I have it down pretty good and can make my own samples for it without too much pain.

If you are looking for something that just does drums/perc and simple bass/synth stuff, I definitely recommend checking the DMPro out before purchasing a sampler.
 
Thanks for the tip amiller... I'll look into it... At this point, my head is still spinning from all the options...
 
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