Demo blues/rock song

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dabluesman

dabluesman

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download from here: http://guitarlibrary.com/index.php?page=mp3_view&mp3_id=34

It is my first one done on my rebuilt computer since the motherboard blew a month or so ago. I didnt tweak the EQ's or anything, I just recorded straight in from my DI boxes, sent the tracks through mix down, and saved as a 256k mp3. Its not too bad considering I didnt "tweak" anything. I'm tring to listen to it on different sound systems to see if the sound quality of the recording is up to par because I dont have any monitors yet to get an accurate responce during the recording and mixing process. Anyway, I hope someone out there likes it. The song is just a blues/rock jam I mixed with my drum machine, bass, and guitar. Some of the riffs are a little messy, I just kept the first take of each track to get it finished quickly. This is more or less a demo, once I get all the bugs worked out of this new system I'll be able to spend more time being picky about my playing. Oh well, enjoy!
 
quality of this mp3?

After listening to this a few times, I think the guitar is too loud and on some speaker systems I cant even hear the bass. But besides that, what do ya'll think about the sound quality? Any suggestions are appreciated and any good comments on my playing are very welcome :D
 
Well... since you asked...... (twice!).... ;)

If you're going for a demo/rough sketch/concept of a song you will take further, then you've succeeded - and there's little point in a full-scale critique. If this isn't a sketchpad version then we have a problem -- some points of which I've outlined below..... ;)

Guitar tone -- too much gain for an acceptable blues tone (although this is a subjective opinion). It sounds overcompressed and there's no sense of space around it. And what... no solo?? Blues cannot live on rhythm alone! :)

Drums -- no punch, not very realistic -- they sound... well, like a drum machine. You need to work on varying the parts here and there to add some dynamics.

Bass -- well... you need to get the drums in place, then we can talk about it...

Overall - the biggest thing missing from it was the sense of space surrounding the instruments. That HAS to happen before you worry about how loud the parts are in the mix. Music happens in environements that contain a natural reverberation (to varying degrees). When you record tracks bone dry (DI) - you need to artificially create the space surrounding the instruments when mixing... otherwise, it just doesn't sound realistic. Now I know you said you did this quick and dirty, but it doesn't make sense to critique it in that context, since you're removing what would normally be a naturally-occurring element of the sound!

On the good side - you got a nice little rhythm happening - you just need to dress it up!!! :)

I'd like to hear your next rev of this tune...

Peace....
Bruce Valeriani
Blue Bear Sound
 
Thanks! Thats the kind of opinion/suggestions I'm looking for. I agree with you about the drum machine needing to be more varied. Do you think that maybe making the guitar's reverb more pronounced would help with the spacious problem? I see what you mean about it having to much drive too. Either I stepped on the wrong button on my pedal or I was going for more of a ZZ Top sound.. The .wav doesnt sound as dirty though. What are some things that I could do to give my instruments more of a sense of spaciousness? And could you even hear the bass guitar on your speakers? Thanks again, you've been a big help!
 
Sense of space.... that's really the key to creating a well-recorded sound. I was going to start describing how to get that sense of space, but instead let me recommend you check out a video... MIX Magazine's "Shaping Your Sound" series - the Reverb/Delays video. I saw these years ago (but they're still available) and although a bit dated (especially the clothes) the information they provide is solid.

Check out http://www.musicbooksplus.com/books/fl003.htm.

Bruce Valeriani
Blue Bear Sound
 
Aww c'mon...........

.........BV, talk a little about creating that sense of space (one could alternatively say, how to make virtual reality sound like actual reality). I have a feeling that what you have to say is worth hearing.............
 
Awww jeez guys.... this is huge topic!!!! :)

Well... bottom line - you want to create or capture the ambience of anything you're trying to record. For acoustic instruments, you may want to capture the room they're being played in (assuming it's a nice sounding room!) Techniques for doing this are as diverse as the number of cheap condensers available now, and I think many people in this forum do the DI thing anyways - so I won't get into the mic'ing procedures....

But let's talk about creating ambience given the scenario of having recorded dry DI tracks....... (and I may over-simplify in certain cases 'cos there's a lot to this topic!)

When you hear a sound you are really hearing a combination of the original sound, plus any reflections bouncing off the ambient surroundings that sound is being produced in (the reflections are commonly known as reverberation.)

The direct sound hits your ears first, but then the reflections hit your ears milliseconds (mS) later depending on your proximity to walls/floors/etc. Sound travels about 1 foot per mS. On our DI'd track, we simply have a dry sound without any ambient effect - a very unnatural-sounding source and need to use reverb to artificially restore that ambient effect.

In creating a realistic ambience for the sound, you want to try and approximate what the sound would actually be heard in a given acoustical space (say a 10 by 10 ft room). In this situation, a sound source at the end of the room (say a mic'd guitar amp) will produce a sound at the mic consisting of the direct amp sound, plus reverberation delayed (for the time it takes for the sound to hit the walls) by about 20 mS (10ft there and 10ft back). This is known as pre-delay.

Given this, to properly mimic this ambience using our DI'd track, you need to first choose a realistic reverb sound (the reverb pattern representing the ambience of a 10 by 10 room or whatever environment you wish) PLUS "pre-delaying" that signal sent to the reverb by the time required to position the source within the room. (The 20 mS in the above example). To get this pre-delay, normally you'd patch a delay unit before the reverb (unless your reverb unit is one of the few units with a predelay built-in).

That's the first step - recreating a realistic ambient environment. Sometimes, that's all you need, but often, to add a lush quality to the reverb, you need to experiment with layering 2 or more different types of reverb together on one or more combinations of tracks. (This is where the "taste", "subtlety", and "skill" come into play!) In addition, you may need to tailor the reverb sound using an EQ patched before the pre-delay and the reverb - to thicken thin sounds, boost the low end on the EQ; to thin-out a dense, muddy track cut the low-end on the EQ and boost the highs (slightly!).

SO to summarize... it's really not just a question of slapping reverb on a track - to create a realistic ambience, you need to understand what is happening to the sound as it travels in a given space, then attempt to recreate that space thru the combination of delay and reverb(s), along with some tailoring of the density of the sound. Bear in mind I've simplified greatly to try and give you a sense of the theory... I really do recommend that video - it goes into much deeper detail than I can type here!

Hope this is somewhat clear and helpful.............

Bruce Valeriani
Blue Bear Sound
 
Thanks for letting us drag that out of you ;) I understand what your getting at, though I'm not very sure on how I am going to be able to go about incorporating that into my recordings. I guess its like anything else, I'll have to fork over the cash for more equipment. However I do have a Digitech RP-10 effects unit that has some good reverbs with ms and room size settings. I usualy use just a touch of it on my guitar tracks to give it a fuller sound. I've never used it for "simulating a room" though, but that'll be something I can experiment with. Thanks for the advice, I'll try to use it in the re-mix :)
 
Hey... I gave you guys fair warning about how big a subject it was!!! :)

Bruce
 
Very interesting stuff. Thanks.

Using these types of techniques, it seems, might be less important if I am recording an acoustic guitar and voices through a microphone in a room. Then, I need to be mostly concerned about the acoustics of the room, regarding the sense of "space". Yes?
 
Yes... but then you need to concern yourself with proper mic'ing techniques to capture the room sound. And of course, you must have a good sounding room to start with!

I didn't get into describing ambient mic techniques because that's REALLY a broad area... (encompassing how-to-get/what-makes-for a good-sounding room, close/ambient mic placement, types of mics, etc... you get the idea...)

Bruce Valeriani
Blue Bear Sound
 
Dablues,

Hey ok your getting the hang of it. What type of amp are you using? I'm assuming you're using one. The tube sound is where it's at for blues. Let your amp do the work. I'm from Austin,Tx. and play blues myself. Most players here play Fenders like the Super Reverb, Twin Reverb and better yet some of the vintage fender amps, often very expensive. Overdrive your amp for the guts but don't let it get to sounding like a fuzz box. Distortion but not fuzz. That is for lead areas, but for rhythym which is what I heard on your mp3. a cleaner sound would be better in my opinion. And definately real drums are a must for real blues. Of course it's ok to work out stuff with a drum machine but for the real guts and soul of blues it's gotta be real.

Check out my post of an mp3 my band did live here in Austin.
The post subject reads something like " A good storage space for my mp3's"

Good luck,
Rusty K
 
Much better blues mix. The bass is a little boomie however everything sounds much better.

Rusty K
 
I like the guitar tone A LOT better... and it has a better presence. You managed to get a much more bluesy tone, but maybe overdid it too much with compression.

I think still you need do something more dynamic with the drums, in terms of the sound and the patterns. And for more convincing blues, go with a nice and solid, smooth, deep bass sound.

Still a nice job though!

Bruce

PS - think about adding a lead guitar solo for some counterpoint and dynamic build-up about 3/4 thru the song!
;)
 
downloaded both...difference between night and day...great suggestions, Bruce, I learned something.........dabluesman, sweet tune, too....gibs
 
Thanks! I guess I'm just now getting the hang of it. Now its time to come up with some new stuff and work on those drum tracks a bit.
 
Wow, what an improvement through non drastic means. The guitar sounds like it has just the right amount of grit now.
The reverb makes it sound more like a tube amp. Or maybe it's the new fender. :)

Still having a little trouble hearing the bass, but I am not listening through the greatest headphones in the world

-Jett Rocker
 
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