deessssssssssssser

  • Thread starter Thread starter LI Slim
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LI Slim

LI Slim

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I recently got a deesser plug in (db audioware), and I now wonder how I ever recorded vocals without it. I would always want to use a little more compression but didn't like the result if I went over about 2.5 to 1. In my latest song I went to 3.5 and used the deesser and everyone's telling me it's my best vocal by far. Of course, now I'm about to overdo it. Any advice as to guidelines for using a deesser without abusing it?
 
If you can "hear" it working, it's too obvious - if it sounds natural, then you've got it right!

Bruce
 
Bruce, if I "hear" it, what am I hearing? Sort of a flatness?
 
First off understand that if you are over compessing, chances are that you are enlarging the problem.

If you can, try to solve the problem first by using a pop filter and angiling the mic. Then check to see if your attack on the compressor isnt to slow.

You'll need to find the correct freq.
You should have the ability to sweep for it and choose the problimatic freq.
Then carefully adjust the Threshold so that you only turn down the Freq of the sibilance but leave the rest of the vocals alone.

Dont forget to De-ess before the reverb !.

You will know when you are overdoing it when you hear that you are effecting the color of the vocals beyond the annoying sibilance.
 
Well, I don't need it at all unless I'm compressing.

Typically, I'm attacking at about 20 ms. Too slow?

So the deesser should precede the 'verb in the chain?
 
LI Slim said:
Well, I don't need it at all unless I'm compressing.

Typically, I'm attacking at about 20 ms. Too slow?
Click to expand...


Try a 3-5ms setting.


So the deesser should precede the 'verb in the chain?
Click to expand...

Generaly yes. Imagine a plate reverb or any bright reverb for that matter comming after the problimatic sibilance.....it would only make things worse.
 
if your song becomes your thong , then you are definitely overdoing it.

Do you record with a pop filter. It also filters out the sibilant esses
 
I don't know. I've always been partial to thongs.


What I like about the deesser is not just that it filters out sibilants but that it filters out the other unwanted sounds that get emphasized when one compresses; it gets rid of the harshness.
 
Aww, what the heck Slim! Leave the vocals alone! What I thought
was "siblance" was my cheap-@ss headphones!.
The vocals, when played thru my sound system was AWESOME!
"If it ain't broke,don't fix it!!" :)
 
Desssser unit recomendations

What desser units are recommended for really
great results?

Thanks
 
Slim,

I just downloaded the db-audioware DX plug-ins...how do you work the de-esser (I'm using Cakewalk 9 Pro)? Sorry this is such a newbie question... I've never used a de-esser before, I just use a pop filter and take it easy on the consonants...:p
 
Shailat, you mentioned using a pop filter and angling the mic - I understand about the pop filter, but why angle the mic? Singing directly toward the diaphragm creates sibilance?
 
Repositioning the mic is a better choice of words rather then angeling.

A sibilant sound is a "s" or "t" that has a lot of high freq's sound, loud in comparesent to the rest of the word.
In some mics, the presence peak that is accented due to their freq response and combined with the close micing of vocals
can cause the problem. Therefore a correct mic choice and placement can do a lot to help.
When you angle a mic lets say aming downwards towards the mouth you deemphasize breaths.nose noise and lip smacking.
Hence you see that a different position can change the tonal charecter and sometimes a subtle change can help de emphesize sibilance as well.
 
Sibilants "s" and "t" are explosives, so when close miked they create transient peaks. Deeser is compressor, keyed ( controlled ) by a sie-chain eq, which is tuned in 2-4 kHz freq range . So, if you use deeser to remove harshness, try to equalize in 2-4 kHz region instead.
This is typical mic setup to avoid sibilance whe recording: raise mic in singers eye level, angle at his mouth at 30 degrees on 20cm distance, with pop filter between. This is because human voice is spreaded most balanced from mouth up at 30 degrees angle, and sibilance is direct ( so it miss microphone ).
Best Deeser plug-in is Waves Deeser ( best metering ).
When deesing, it is more important to find exact freq of "s" peak, than compressor settings; those are transients, so you need fastest attack and fast release ( to not compress rest of audio ).
If your singer sounds like he lost his front teeth, you overdone it. ;)
 
Sibilants "s" and "t" are explosives, so when close miked they create transient peaks. Deeser is compressor, keyed ( controlled ) by a sie-chain eq, which is tuned in 2-4 kHz freq range . So, if you use deeser to remove harshness, try to equalize in 2-4 kHz region instead.
This is typical mic setup to avoid sibilance when recording: raise mic in singers eye level, angle at his mouth at 30 degrees on 20cm distance, with pop filter between. This is because human voice is spreaded most balanced from mouth up at 30 degrees angle, and sibilance is direct ( so it miss microphone ).
Best Deeser plug-in is Waves Deeser ( best metering ).
When deesing, it is more important to find exact freq of "s" peak, than compressor settings; those are transients, so you need fastest attack and fast release ( to not compress rest of audio ).
If your singer sounds like he lost his front teeth, you overdone it. ;)
 
Igormeister said:
Sibilants "s" and "t" are explosives...
Click to expand...
er... no.... the word is "plosives".... if they were explosives, we'd have a lot of talent's fleshy bits 'n pieces to clean out of the condenser grills, not to mention the pop screens!

;)

:D :D

Bruce
 
Dude, the first time I recorded, they *were* explosives. It was painful to listen to them. I didn't even have to write in here to ask what was wrong. :D

Shailat, Igormeister - thanks for the useful input. Igormeister, you sound like you know what you're talking about - what are you up to over there, and how long have you been up to it?
 
Excuse my bad english.
I am recording/mix/mastering engineer here at Croatia Records. I am about 8 years in audio now, 2 years as a full time pro. :)
 
terminolgy check

I thought sibilants were hissing sounds e.g., "s's", and plosives were popping sounds - e.g., "p's and t's". Is that not correct?

BTW, Igormeister, your English is fine. You bring some good knowledge to this forum, stick around.
 
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