Decisions, Decisions and then CONFUSION.

[Rassoodocks]

Well, well. Like most of the messages i've read on here, i'm not the only one who is swooned by endless sales talk about a good product and have trouble sticking to my guns.

Basically I had my mind set on the Delta 44 card by m-audio. Now i'm making some second guesses at things i've read on here and in magazines.

Here's the scenario...

I'm basically recording jazz.. when it's not jazz, it's usually in the mould of fusion jazz or something with that,

"i want it clean and big and sparkling and give me a pro sound that NOBODY CAN DENY, not even me!"

so, the delta 44 seems a good choice to my way of thinking. I don't want to record lots of tracks at once... I multitrack them all that's what i'm comfortable with. 4 inputs is enough for recording a guitar amp, Acoustic, voice etc!

But, Alas!!!

what about drums ???

Drums are VERY important to my music and i fear that 4 mics wont be enough...(crap, it wont be enough will it!) Sure it's better than one room mic today, but down the track i'm sure i'll whinge about the lack of presence that i get on my drum recordings.

So, what to do ?

buy two delta 44's ? buy a mixer ? Buy the omni studio package ?

the omni studio i have considered because of the mic preamps.. that's very attractive...phantom powered mics infront of your voice or acoustic are always going to sound better than battery powered mics.

but the omni comes with the delta66, which only has 4 inputs also. This means desk.. and desk i'm not too keen on, i want to keep it on my pc.

i could always try the m-audio 1010...???

so my question to all you kind people is... What's the solution to getting a card that keeps it in the pc, has phantom power and lets me get enough inputs for drums ?


Thanks a million,
Rory.

 

[AlChuck]

Depends on how your plan to record. 4 inputs is probably minimal for having reasonable mixing control over the various parts of the trap kit, so if you were recording the drums and other instruments in separate passes, you could make do with the Delta 44.

But if you want to record an ensemble 4 tracks and have the parts isolated for control in mixdown, 4 tracks won't make it.

-- unless -- you are recording a live ensemble and can skip the need for isolating tracks for effects, etc. For example, recording a classical ensemble or an acoustic jazz quartet is often tracked straight to stereo, warts and all, with no plan to do anything that most people think of when they talk about mixing. If it's all about just capturing a live performance, you could do this with a four-channel, or even a two- channel interface. But you have to be a damn good professional recording engineer to have success with that approach...

I think the best bet would be to get a Delta 1010 or similar interface. You can stack two or three of them too if you need more tracks later.

 

[Badger]

I'll second the delta 1010 idea. Most of the time I never use more than a few of its eight inputs, but when I need them, I really need them...

 

[TexRoadkill]

Luckily jazz drum sounds are more natural and easily achieved with fewer mics. It's the huge 'in your face' rock sound that requires a lot of mics and tracks. A kick, snare and 2 OH mics will probably be plenty if you have a good kit, room and mics.

If you use a mixer you will not be limited to 4 mics, only 4 tracks.

 

[chessrock]

Alright. So you say you want to be able to record drums, and the style of music you are doing is mostly jazz.

One thing I think you (and some of the others here) may have overlooked is that jazz drums require very little micing. I've known some very good jazz recordings to use only 1 overhead microphone and nothing else. To me, that's a little extreme, but you could conceivably get outstanding results with just two to three mics.

Will 4 inputs get you there? Sure, if you plan on micing the drums first, and then everything else separately . . . something I don't think is very common with jazz, but perfectly acceptable.

My second concern was that you mentioned you want exceptional sound . . . at professional calibre that no one can deny. Those are some pretty lofty expectations that I'm not completely sure the M-audio cards can deliver.

I mean they CAN, but undenyably, the top studios out there are mostly using more pristine audio-to-digital converters costing thousands of dollars. The only sound card that I know of that is capable of delivering that level of sound is called the Lynx II.

Keyword search Lynx:

http://www.sospubs.co.uk/search/query.asp

 

[RWhite]

Get a mixer, do a drum submix into 2 tracks. My 2 bits.

 

[neirbo]

Luckily jazz drum sounds are more natural and easily achieved with fewer mics. It's the huge 'in your face' rock sound that requires a lot of mics and tracks. A kick, snare and 2 OH mics will probably be plenty if you have a good kit, room and mics.

I generally agree with this statement. If you seach this forum on "drum micing" you'll get lots of folks who swear by the 3 or 4 mic method, even if they have more inputs available.

But, I wonder what you mean by "jazz". If you are talking old school, then minimal micing should be just fine, even preferable. But more modern styles tend to have a very different drum sound that can probably only be achieved with more mics. Think Dave Weckle, or Spiro Gyra.

 

[Rassoodocks]

what i mean by jazz.

ok... well.... dave weckle and dennis chambers. I do like that style.. but it's very very aggressive jazz druming in my definition. Something like Carter beauford (dmb) i dig that, i'm almost sure he has every drum miced. The drum sound that i suppose i'd love to have and keep in a box is that of phil selway's drum sound (radiohead drummer) song in question, Pyramid Song off the Amnesiac album. I can safely say that's my ideal mix of head room and presence.

then of course there's always the james brown drums and miles davis/john coltrane drums. I love that sound.

If anyone can give me a few more pointers, i'd muchly appreciate it.

Btw, those 96khz signs on the aard website look mighty inviting. I've pretty much decided on the aard 24/96. But if someone can say, you need more mics and it will get your drum sound sounding 600 dollars better, then i might reconsider.

I know one thing, The 24/96 is going to give me 4 and only 4. If i get the q10, i can have 4, or 5, or 8. more options. But i don't know if spending that extra money will make that much of a difference.

Cheers,
Rory.