DECENTER - Down The Line

  • Thread starter Thread starter DogmaticVox
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DogmaticVox

DogmaticVox

Meh...
Hi guys,

I recorded this last night for my one-man-band project DECENTER. It's a cover of Jose Gonzalez's "Down The Line".

Here's some background:

Everything was recorded on my laptop through my Fast Track USB (one XLR and one quarter inch input) into Sonar.

The guitars were tracked using my Epiphone direct into Amplitube.

I don't have a bass, so I did some trickery to record the bass track with my guitar.

The drums were all programmed. (I know it's obvious!)

Vocals were recorded into an SM58 through the Fast Track USB. (interesting fact, I lost my pop screen and don't have wire hangars and pantyhose so I put on of my daughter's thin polyester hand puppets on the mic and sang into that. haha


So with all that being said, HERE'S THE SONG.

What do you guys think? Is it passable?

Thanks,
Garry
 
No, it's not passable. It's very harsh and stacked in the midrange. The guitars are fuzzy and lack clarity. Whatever you did for the bass doesn't work. There is no bass presence at all.

You listed a bunch of recording equipment, but what you didn't list, and what I suspect is the problem with this mix, is your monitoring situation. What are you listening through to make this mix? You can have beginner equipment or pro equipment, but none of it matters if your monitoring setup and room is crap. You say you recorded this on a laptop. Please don't tell me you mixed it through the laptop speakers.
 
Greg - I mixed it all using a pair of closed-ear Sennheiser studio headphones. I tried eliminating the presence of the bass so it sounded more like a LF extension of the guitars. I disagree that the distorted guitars should be crystal clear. I want them to to get the power chords across a la Skrape or the new Filter record and layered the clean guitar to fill it out a bit.

I admit I do need to get a proper bass and monitors. Want to donate? haha
 
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DogmaticVox said:
Greg - I mixed it all using a pair of closed-ear Sennheiser studio headphones. I tried eliminating the presence of the bass so it sounded more like a LF extension of the guitars. I disagree that the distorted guitars should be crystal clear. I want them to to get the power chords across a la Skrape or the new Filter record and layered the clean guitar to fill it out a bit.

I admit I do need to get a proper bass and monitors. Want to donate? haha
Click to expand...

I'm not suggesting using clean guitar tones. Powerchords are cool, but listen to what you got here. They're fizzy and lack definition. The heavy overdriven almost indistrial guitar sound you want is fine, but it still has to be recorded well. Powerchords have a lot more power when they're not mushy and messy. Yours sound like a mash of fuzz.

Headphone mixes rarely come out well. They lie, a lot. Save up some money and get some monitors.
 
It's very harsh and stacked in the midrange. The guitars are fuzzy and lack clarity. Whatever you did for the bass doesn't work. There is no bass presence at all.

Yep.

Before reading Greg's comment, I fiddled with WMP, and came to the exact same conclusion.

And the bass drum figure would do better, I think, if you just hit the one beat, then the double eighth onthe three-and....
 
Thanks Greg.

To keep it from going into the fuzzy zone and get a nice crisppity crunchy peanut buttery distortion, should I pull back a little bit on the gain and increase input level or just keep messing with amps / pedals until I find the right distortion?
 
DogmaticVox said:
Thanks Greg.

To keep it from going into the fuzzy zone and get a nice crisppity crunchy peanut buttery distortion, should I pull back a little bit on the gain and increase input level or just keep messing with amps / pedals until I find the right distortion?
Click to expand...

Well, the general consensus on recording distorted guitars is to cut the gain back and multi-track with tight performances for a big but clean distorted sound. Since you're not using a real amp, you'll need to fiddle with the settings. What sounds like a great distorted tone by itself can often get harsh in the mix.
 
I like the singer's voice. That sounded good.

I agree on the over distortion of the guitars. The part is fine, the double tracking is pretty tight and I'm guessing you can get a decent tone out of your rig. But the gain was just turned up too high here. It gives it a fizzy sound. I'd suggest a retrack with a little less overdrive.

The bass kind of just blended one note into the next as Greg suggested.

I did detect a buildup of frequencies in maybe the 2K - 4K octave. I don't know if I'd describe the sound as harsh, but it wasn't exactly "un-harsh" either.

The snare sound was a little slappy. The cymbals were a little swishy.
 
DogmaticVox said:
Is this any better... or worse?

MIX 2
Click to expand...

It's an improvement.

One thing I'm noticing with the guitars is that they sound scooped in the midrange. Better, but now they're scratchy and thin. It cleaned up the mix though. So look for slightly more mids on the guitars, and find whatever else is making the mids stack up and clutter the mix.
 
Greg hit it right on the head with the guitar sound, they're too muddy. Mix overall is pretty muddy, the voice is not loud and clear enough, at the end the drums almost disappear and definitely get a real bass or a bass sim in there. The song's pretty good though and the performance too, so keep working at it.
 
Greg_L said:
It's an improvement.

One thing I'm noticing with the guitars is that they sound scooped in the midrange. Better, but now they're scratchy and thin. It cleaned up the mix though. So look for slightly more mids on the guitars, and find whatever else is making the mids stack up and clutter the mix.
Click to expand...

Okay, I think I found what was cluttering up the mids and cleared the mix up a bit. I think this is getting close to the best I can do with this song making do with what I have.

MIX 3

Greg, thanks again for all your input. It's really appreciated.
 
DogmaticVox said:
Okay, I think I found what was cluttering up the mids and cleared the mix up a bit. I think this is getting close to the best I can do with this song making do with what I have.

MIX 3

Greg, thanks again for all your input. It's really appreciated.
Click to expand...

Another improvement. Getting better. It really needs a real bass, and the overall compression/limiting makes it pretty hard to listen to. It's pretty harsh when everything is at full power. Forget about how loud you can make it and focus on a balanced mix. Then you can squash the shit out of it.
 
I remember Greg getting my first mix bang to rights almost the same proble...


youre trying to run before you can walk imo...


Id put all the faders down to zero, take all the effects off...then bring them up to their correct volume...then if one sound is on top of another pan it, if the tracks frequency is masked by another EQ it, if the track peaks are stopping its body being heard then compress it...dont do anything unless something is telling you to

It just sounds like you are doing things because you think you need to..its a bad mix thats being over compressed.....and Ive only listened to the third one..


the performance sounds good though, a bit foo fighters in there...but get back to basics with the mix as I think you've lost wherever it was meant to be going and starting again may be the best idea..

its just practise...
 
kcearl said:
I remember Greg getting my first mix bang to rights almost the same proble...


youre trying to run before you can walk imo...


Id put all the faders down to zero, take all the effects off...then bring them up to their correct volume...then if one sound is on top of another pan it, if the tracks frequency is masked by another EQ it, if the track peaks are stopping its body being heard then compress it...dont do anything unless something is telling you to

It just sounds like you are doing things because you think you need to..its a bad mix thats being over compressed.....and Ive only listened to the third one..


the performance sounds good though, a bit foo fighters in there...but get back to basics with the mix as I think you've lost wherever it was meant to be going and starting again may be the best idea..

its just practise...
Click to expand...

I hear ya KC. I'm actually looking forward to starting a new song from scratch so I can employ all I've learned just going through this exercise. Holy $hit this eats up my time though... It's easy to "just work on it for a little bit" and next thing I know it's 3am. haha

Here's the last one I'll post of this tune. I bumped up the vocals a bit and tried lowering compression (instead of slamming the track to get the overall volume at 11).

MIX4
 
DogmaticVox said:
I hear ya KC. I'm actually looking forward to starting a new song from scratch so I can employ all I've learned just going through this exercise. Holy $hit this eats up my time though... It's easy to "just work on it for a little bit" and next thing I know it's 3am. haha

Here's the last one I'll post of this tune. I bumped up the vocals a bit and tried lowering compression (instead of slamming the track to get the overall volume at 11).

MIX4
Click to expand...

lol tell me about it...my wife became a recording widow last August


but in time what used to take a month takes a week....its all about training yourself to hear better and what to do with what you hear...

Id be more worried if i couldn't play than couldn't mix....mixing you'll get with a little patience and learning...playing well sometimes never comes


though if i were you I wouldnt leave this project...you've just overcooked it, there's plenty right about it, performance, that overtakes whats wrong with it, bad mix...keep at it mate


oh yeah listening now and Mix 4 is sounding way better...id imagine the guys would think the guits are still a bit fizzy, and the cymbals still sound hissy, but big, big improvement on mix 3....great vocals too :)
 
Yup, better again. You're trending in the right direction. Like kcearl said, the hats and stuff are still pretty bright and the vocals could come up more, but this mix has dimension and space and it "breathes", if that makes any sense. Compare it to your first mix. This mix #4 is light years better. Get a bass! :D
 
Hey Greg / KC,

I've mixed another version (with real bass this time!). I think it's getting a litter better.

Here's the latest MIX


...and for shits and grins, here's the first one I came to you guys with - OLD MIX

Thanks so much!
 
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