Decent audio interface with Midi in/out. Presonus problem.

Pressuridion

Pressuridion

DJ, Producer, Raver since the late 90s
Hello everyone.
I recently bought a second hand presonus Audiobox 96 for recording with synths and also using Midi in/out for sync etc with Ableton. When I started playing tho I faced some problems with distortion and peaking, even that the input levels were below middle. Also stereo panning delay effect were lost as mono when the input volume increased. I thought i did something wrong connecting the mixer with the audio interface. Maybe I do. Or that the second hand presonus was faulty. But when I did a better research on YouTube (I wish I had done that before buying this interface) I found a guy reviewing this presonus, saying that it can't record audio straight in line, that the manufacturers don't recommend it and that it needs a di box. Also the sound has noise issues.
So I need help and recommendations for a decent audio interface with Midi in/out (must) around 100€. Also, does the later presonus Audiobox 96 (black box) or the iTwo have the same issue?
Thank you in advance
 
You could buy used - get a UA Volt - or get a Behringer U-PHORIA UMC204HD new at $120 - they are really good - I favor the UA Volt because of the pedigree - but I know plenty of people using the Behringer with good results - as for the later Presonus - I have no idea - I don't like Presonus products - they always have some fault or difficult workflow.
 
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What is the mixer for, and how do you have it set up in the DAW? The Presonus combo jack is labeled mic/inst, so the input is (by design) not intended for LINE level signals. Now, assuming you're feeding the mixer's main outs (L/R) into the two inputs on the Presonus, a stereo/2-ch DI would solve the problem if you connect the DI(s) to the interface with XLR cables. Then, in the DAW, create a stereo track input. Stereo and panning delay effects might work best placed on a stereo bus (or busses), and use sends from your stereo (mixer) track to those - just my preferred way of working with non-mono or panned mono tracks.

If you don't want to use the Presonus+DI(s), any modern interface that has a front panel switch that lets you select LINE/INST for the 1/4" part of the combo jack, or possibly additional LINE inputs on the back, would work. Just stick with a brand that has good reviews and the in/out options you need, or think you'll need in the future.
 
The combo input is not suitable for +4dB mixer outputs, it's meant for keyboard level. so guitars, .775V ish keys. You could build a pad into a homemade cable that would stop it maxing out on your mixer, or just run your mixer output lower.
 
This form of overload, a mixer into an AI that only handles 'pro-sumer' signal levels is quite a common one on forums.
As Rob says, one simple solution is to attenuate the mixer signal(make and model PLEASE!) that you can work with its meters but send a lower signal to AI.
Problem: what level of attenuation? Best solution is a 'pot box' i.e. a 10k Ohm log volume control in a tin. Bog easy to make if you can drill metal and solder. There are two options. A 'stereo' pot that fades both channels at the same time or two pots that allow independent control. I favour the latter.

I can post a drawing if required.

Once so setup it makes sense to 'calibrate' the system so you don't have to worry about noise or overs on day to day work.

Dave.
 
Papanate said:
You could buy used - get a UA Volt - or get a Behringer U-PHORIA UMC204HD new at $120 - they are really good - I favor the UA Volt because of the pedigree - but I know plenty of people using the Behringer with good results - as for the later Presonus - I have no idea - I don't like Presonus products - they always have some fault or difficult workflow.
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Thank you very much for the suggestions. I will check the UA volt. Looks very interesting. As for the Behringer is decent (not always), i like their products in general and their prices and i still have my uphoria umc 22. I went to the presonus after i bought my synth and midi in/out became an option. I also believed that it was more professional and with better quality. I always worry about the sound quality and inputs stability of Behringer. If you say that the umc204hd is ready good, i will definitely check it out.
 
keith.rogers said:
What is the mixer for, and how do you have it set up in the DAW? The Presonus combo jack is labeled mic/inst, so the input is (by design) not intended for LINE level signals. Now, assuming you're feeding the mixer's main outs (L/R) into the two inputs on the Presonus, a stereo/2-ch DI would solve the problem if you connect the DI(s) to the interface with XLR cables. Then, in the DAW, create a stereo track input. Stereo and panning delay effects might work best placed on a stereo bus (or busses), and use sends from your stereo (mixer) track to those - just my preferred way of working with non-mono or panned mono tracks.

If you don't want to use the Presonus+DI(s), any modern interface that has a front panel switch that lets you select LINE/INST for the 1/4" part of the combo jack, or possibly additional LINE inputs on the back, would work. Just stick with a brand that has good reviews and the in/out options you need, or think you'll need in the future.
Click to expand...
Thank you very much for your answer. I wanted to have a mixer so than i can play with my synths or record them as line in audio. Yes you are right that the combo jack is labeled mic/inst and was stupid enough not to check if "inst" is deferent than line in signals. You are also correct that i connect the L/R output of my mixer into the two inputs on the presonus but i did know that a DI is needed....Your advices and guidance is very helpful and appreciated. Thank you
 
rob aylestone said:
The combo input is not suitable for +4dB mixer outputs, it's meant for keyboard level. so guitars, .775V ish keys. You could build a pad into a homemade cable that would stop it maxing out on your mixer, or just run your mixer output lower.
Click to expand...
i see that. Now i understand. I should have made a better research before buying. So the option of having my mixer output lower will solve the problem? Am i gonna have lower signal in recording and noise by increasing in the DAW?
 
ecc83 said:
This form of overload, a mixer into an AI that only handles 'pro-sumer' signal levels is quite a common one on forums.
As Rob says, one simple solution is to attenuate the mixer signal(make and model PLEASE!) that you can work with its meters but send a lower signal to AI.
Problem: what level of attenuation? Best solution is a 'pot box' i.e. a 10k Ohm log volume control in a tin. Bog easy to make if you can drill metal and solder. There are two options. A 'stereo' pot that fades both channels at the same time or two pots that allow independent control. I favour the latter.

I can post a drawing if required.

Once so setup it makes sense to 'calibrate' the system so you don't have to worry about noise or overs on day to day work.

Dave.
Click to expand...
Oh my, thank you very much for the suggestion and analysis step by step. Very helpful. You also answer my second question to Rob, about low level recording and noise problem. The “ 'pot box' i.e. a 10k Ohm log volume control in a tin” sounds very interesting and cool but unfortunately I not good with stuff like that L Is that something like a handmade DI?
 
"The “ 'pot box' i.e. a 10k Ohm log volume control in a tin” sounds very interesting and cool but unfortunately I not good with stuff like that L Is that something like a handmade DI?
No not a "DI" at all (but could be used for "re amping") Now, brace yourself because I am going to say something that might seem unkind but I assure you is intended to help.

You are obviously not flushed with cash else you would just buy an SSL 'Big Six' and get TF on with things! In this Home Recording game if one is rich you can buy in or have made the gear you need. If, like most of us you are on a tight budget you have to learn new skills. OK, you say "easy for you Dave. You've been doing it for over 60 years!" Well yes BUT I HAD TO LEARN!* I will agree that if you don't have any DIY tools about the place, a drill, bits, few files, small vice, this will be tougher but most people have SOMETHING or can beg or borrow kit. Soldering is a bit more specialized but really not that hard on 'macro' kit like pots and jacks sockets. You will also have the ability to fix that cable that failed on a wet Sunday night. Like any skill, needs practice.
I can help.

*Yes I am 77.5 and now such work is a struggle. I have but one good(ish) eye so my short range depth perception is shot. Just yesterday I needed to solder two RCA plugs to a cable. Took me fekkin ages! Only ten years ago I would do that in my sleep in 2minutes per plug. (yes, the RCA-RCA cable DID work to get video from a camera back of my garden through the house to my living room!)

Dave.
 
ecc83 said:
"The “ 'pot box' i.e. a 10k Ohm log volume control in a tin” sounds very interesting and cool but unfortunately I not good with stuff like that L Is that something like a handmade DI?
No not a "DI" at all (but could be used for "re amping") Now, brace yourself because I am going to say something that might seem unkind but I assure you is intended to help.

You are obviously not flushed with cash else you would just buy an SSL 'Big Six' and get TF on with things! In this Home Recording game if one is rich you can buy in or have made the gear you need. If, like most of us you are on a tight budget you have to learn new skills. OK, you say "easy for you Dave. You've been doing it for over 60 years!" Well yes BUT I HAD TO LEARN!* I will agree that if you don't have any DIY tools about the place, a drill, bits, few files, small vice, this will be tougher but most people have SOMETHING or can beg or borrow kit. Soldering is a bit more specialized but really not that hard on 'macro' kit like pots and jacks sockets. You will also have the ability to fix that cable that failed on a wet Sunday night. Like any skill, needs practice.
I can help.

*Yes I am 77.5 and now such work is a struggle. I have but one good(ish) eye so my short range depth perception is shot. Just yesterday I needed to solder two RCA plugs to a cable. Took me fekkin ages! Only ten years ago I would do that in my sleep in 2minutes per plug. (yes, the RCA-RCA cable DID work to get video from a camera back of my garden through the house to my living room!)

Dave.
Click to expand...
I really admire you (and people like you) that have skill to make solutions on their own and that work pretty well. Respect
 
Back in my teens, magazines came with small pcbs on the front and you bought the bits and soldered up fuzz boxes, DI boxes and loads of useful stuff. My two sons, a few years apart did soldering at school, and one hated it and was useless, the other quite good, but never did it since. It's really not rocket science and how many musicians and recordists have never wanted to swap a connector at some point. Basic soldering is a life skill for people who use cables.
 
rob aylestone said:
Back in my teens, magazines came with small pcbs on the front and you bought the bits and soldered up fuzz boxes, DI boxes and loads of useful stuff. My two sons, a few years apart did soldering at school, and one hated it and was useless, the other quite good, but never did it since. It's really not rocket science and how many musicians and recordists have never wanted to swap a connector at some point. Basic soldering is a life skill for people who use cables.
Click to expand...
Yes, the rot set in when mains plugs became fixed from the factory by law ( UK/EU) Before that people bought a heater say and had to fit a plug...learn or stay cold!
Now I am being a bit coy there because the supply of properly wired mains plugs, with the correct fusing has probably saved thousands of lives from electrocution and death and damage from fires, but you get my drift?

The musical 'arty' types may not want to garner these modest skills but they can save you money and hours if not days of frustration. ALL HR bods IMHO need soldering kit and a $20 digital meter.

(my son is not keen on soldering but he can fix a cable. He does have an excuse. If he burns the tips of his left fingers he is buggered for classical guitar for a week!)


Dave.

Dave.
 
My son learned to solder when he was 9 with unleaded solder (which I find more difficult to use than the old 60/40 stuff). 2 years later he is now building a synth and his soldering is neater than mine!
 
Papanate said:
You could buy used - get a UA Volt - or get a Behringer U-PHORIA UMC204HD new at $120 - they are really good - I favor the UA Volt because of the pedigree - but I know plenty of people using the Behringer with good results - as for the later Presonus - I have no idea - I don't like Presonus products - they always have some fault or difficult workflow.
Click to expand...
i found a 2 months second hand UA Volt 1 for 100e. Does it worth ?
 
No - you can get a brand new, full waranty one for that money - second hand, without warranty? In my book, tops would be what? 60-70 Euros?
 
rob aylestone said:
No - you can get a brand new, full waranty one for that money - second hand, without warranty? In my book, tops would be what? 60-70 Euros?
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yes i know what you mean. But new one costs 135e at local stores and 129e at Thomann (plus shipping). Or do you mean i should get another card with 100e?
 
My euro conversion was a bit off - seriously though 135 new and 100 second hand is just too close for no warranty or right to return?
 
Papanate said:
Might be - if its in good shape - how much is a new one over there? €106.87 at Thomanns - that seems to be better to get a new one.
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the seller says that it's like new and that it still has 2 months warranty. New one costs 135e at local stores and 129e at Thomann (plus shipping)
 
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