Damnit, MSR-16 is making noise in the circuit at idle

  • Thread starter Thread starter Seeker of Rock
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Seeker of Rock

Seeker of Rock

Let us be unburdened by that which has been ?
Alright, took the MSR-16 to the tech before ever even plugging it in. I asked him to look it over and let me know what he found. He found a tension roller that needed re-covering, uneven head wear so he relapped the record/play head, and two channels were reputedly having problems resulting from something wrong in the amp card.
When I got it home, I powered it up. Now it was not hooked up to the board at this point. Meters were intermittently pegging on a couple of channels. Turned it on again the next day and the meters on the MSR were no longer doing this.
Great, so a few weeks ago I am recording some drum tracks on channels 1 and 2. No problem. Some of the meters (chs 2, 3, 16, maybe one more) are jumping again when machine is idling, but no sounds seemed to be emanating through the monitors as a result.
This weekend, finally get my DM Pro outputs assigned to utilize all six (instead of the L/R mains I was using previously). Run them into channels 1-6 of the board accordingly (divided into kick, snare, hat, toms, ride and crash cymbals). Everything is great, quiet, sounding great through the board and out of the monitors. Until I turn the MSR on. Pops, hissing, whining radio sounding frequency very silently in the background, and thumps. Tried recording the drums on channels 1-6 and all of these irritating noises made it to tape. Also, channel six apparently received input (meters showed it did) but is not returning the recorded sound.
Man, I am sad. Any ideas before I call the tech? :confused: :confused: :confused:
:( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(
 
if its not the grounding or poor electricity; I would say you're poo-poo'd. sorry, bud. you also might want to check that the cables going b/t your board and the msr aren't fooked.
 
Tech sounds like a power supply problem. Depending on the exact culprit, I may be screwed or it may be something simple. I'm going to try and get it to him this week. Before I do, I'm going to run an extension cord to different outlets around the house and see if it makes any difference.
 
If it is a grounding problem, it likely could be your whole house, not just one or two outlets. Do you have a friend's house you can try it at or something? I'd say your best bet, if you're taking it to the tech anyways, is see if you can recreate the problem there. Just make sure it's happening all the time, everytime, that way you don't look like a fool at the tech's. If the problem goes away at the tech's, it's a grounding problem.

I had a similar problem with clicks and pops on a TSR-8, although not as badly as you're describing. When I took it to the tech, I looked like a fool, as it was fine when we tried it there. Since I couldn't rewire my whole house or anything, I tried a cheap line conditioner and just about all of the problem went away.

Hope that helps,
-MD
 
Seeker of Rock said:
Tech sounds like a power supply problem. Depending on the exact culprit, I may be screwed or it may be something simple. I'm going to try and get it to him this week. Before I do, I'm going to run an extension cord to different outlets around the house and see if it makes any difference.
Click to expand...

Sorry you're having all these problems with you r to r Seeker. I wouldn't bring it back to that tech. He doesn't seem to know what the hell he's doing. He should have seen those things going on when he checked it out unless he's full of shit. That stuff started as soon as you got it back. I would have checked it out before you brought to the tech so you knew how it was going in.

I would call the guy you bought it from and tell him you want a refund or you're going to report him to e-bay. :mad:
 
Thanks man. It breaks my heart to have it happening, but it could be something simple or it could be something serious. I first need to eliminate possible culprits. I'll take it to some newly-wired facility and plug it in there, see what happens. Also going to try switching the removable power cord with one to my boards 220watt power supply, see if it maybe it's a bad cord (cord is new from MF, simple removable 3-prong cord, but at $2 bucks, who knows). If neither of these gives results, I am going to contact TASCAM and get a recommended tech. in the area. Apparently they recommend the guy I took it to and the business is TASCAM certified, but absolutely if the problem is not something in the power, he should have caught that.
Good news is the Mackie 24.8 I bought to mate with the MSR sounds great, got my drums channeled out, so I'm ready to roll once I get something to record onto! Sorry, had to mention the good side just to try and keep myself positive. :(
 
Have you tried recording to ALL of the tracks to see if it does it on ALL of them?

Do some tests like that and document everything.

My heart goes out to ya....
 
Well, some more to add now. It is only when the Dolby S is engaged (chs 1-8, and again chs 1-16) that it seems to get the transients. It sounds like a hot mic placed outside with slight, intermittent breezes hitting it. You know the sound. And only when Dolby is engaged.

I feel like an idiot on channel 6 problem. I let my 3 year old son help me hook the snake up, and apparently he slipped a return cable by me.
But still the intermittent "mic in the breeze" sound when Dolby is on. Still have some more research to do, but maybe it is just a bad Dolby unit. :confused: :confused: NR is internal but separate, isn't it?
Nonetheless, she just got a name...Christine. Like the movie she seems to have a mind of her own. :mad:
 
Oooooohhh. I KNOW that sound. I can't quite remember, but I have a piece of gear that was doing something like that lately.
Is that dolby a seperate unit? Can you test w/out it engaged?
 
I tested without engaged (it is button activated externally) and no problems so far. It is almost like the engaged (especially chs 1-8 button) do the reverse of what they should. :confused: :confused:
Nonetheless, it would seem I have a problem with my NR unit at the least, hopefully nothing more. If it is the Dolby, does anyone know if they can be repaired?
 
NR typically in my recording has reduced hum and hiss...not the case here. Maybe it IS the NR. Still saddened, thinking of cutting my losses and going to the Dark Side, Alesis HD24. I LOVE the sound of tape though and it is what I have worked with so far, be it cassette on a 488MKII, so I don't want to give up. I love the sound of the board, just the machine is biting me in the arse. :( :( :( Any ideas? Maybe it is just a learning factor.... :confused:
 
Is the dolby a seperate removeable unit?
If it is, yank it out. You don't need it anyway :p
I have seen various NR units on eBay over the past few weeks. Just don't give up on the medium.
I run a PT rig, but am starting to reintroduce analog to the studio.
I DO believe in a best of both worlds theory....
 
I can hear hiss with the machine, but then again I hear hiss with the board if I push the levels. But I have, with shipping, about $1800 into this machine so far. Disheartening, yes, but the final end is this...I know what I need to hear in recording. It would suck if a bum deal strayed me from my long love of tape, but I just don't have that kind of cash to keep sending to someone who will tell me, well, your machine needs more of this and that...maybe that's not the case, and if so I really love tape anyway, but if not, I don't know that I can risk another $1800. That's a lot of money, man.
 
I appreciate the motivation. Another $500 probably another $150 for shipping AND pro packing, and then how the hell do I hook it to my machine? I'm venting, and I apologize, but this is a worse-case scenario for me. Personally, I think there is hope due to the fact Christine only seems to be moody on the Dolby chs 1-8. I know at this point she needs a visit to a doctor. Time will tell from there, but I know from what little I got to record on her, 1/2" has a beautiful sound. But another 6 bills into it, not sure what I would do. Anyway, I have recorded 1/2" before, but with full bands, never personally at my will. She sounds sweet and I love the sound, just not the pops and crackles.
wish Christine well. :)
 
It's cool to vent... that's why we are here.
Someday you will be past all this crap and think back to this day and it won't feel so bad.
Just take your time and get it done. it will surely be worth it.
What can you do? sell it broken and take a loss?
Dump it in the trash? There are only so precious few of those machines floating around.

Take your time, don't freak out, do it right
 
Take that Dolby-S out and trash it!

... is what I say! :eek: ;)
 
How useable is the machine without the NR? ANy experience, or is it better to look into repairing the NR?
 
Seeker of Rock,
Sorry to hear your having problems with your MSR-16. I've had the dbx version for a few years now and it has been solid since taking care of some initial problems that showed up after I purchased it. (second owner) I had to replace all the rubber,have the head re-lapped and of course a complete mechanical and electrical alignment. As far as using the machine without the noise reduction I believe you'll notice quite a bit of tape hiss so that's probably not an option. After your tech had the head lapped he would surly have had to do a complete mechanical and electrical alignment. However the initial alignment is done without noise reduction engaged so he wouldn't have noticed the problem. He probably should have at least checked out the functionality of the noise reduction but normally the noise reduction circuitry is not something that requires periodic adjustment. On my machine the dbx circuits are divided on two circuit boards,(ch's 1-8 and 9-16). Assuming the dolby version is laid out the same your problem could just be associated with one circuit board. If you are somewhat technically inclined you could swap the boards and see if your trouble moves to channels 9-16. The dbx boards on my machine are located behind the rca connectors. Quite a bit of dis-assembly is required to access them. I seem to remember a post back on the old Tascam forum where someone was having the same problem with an S version machine. I think it turned out to be certain components (capacitors perhaps) that were breaking down from age causing the intermittant static noises your hearing. These components were located on the dolby boards and required replacement to remedy the problem. Another thing to check is make sure all the wiring harnesses that connect to the various circuit boards are securly plugged in. There's a zillion of them and it's possible your tech may have bumped something and in transporting the machine something has come loose. This has happened to me twice in the early days, once my capstan motor just stopped turning and another time the channel level meters were acting crazy. Both troubles were caused by a cable connector coming loose.
Since you probably already have about $300 into the machine with repairs (head lap and alignment) you don't want to give up now :) Hang in there and you'll get it sorted out. If your located in the north east I can highly recommend a repair facillity called new jersey factory service. Good Luck, Dave
 
Seeker of Rock, After thinking about my previous post I believe the dbx cicuitry is divided up with two channels per card not eight. Sorry about that ! Not sure how the S version was laid out. Regards, Dave
 
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