Cubase Vs. Protools vs. anything else

  • Thread starter Thread starter solit
  • Start date Start date
God Damn It.

I said fucking Nuendo sounds better than PT. I said nothing about Cubase. Cubase depends on what version it is for how it sounds. I won't argue this shit. If you quote me you better get your shit right. Also just because you mix something in two systems doesn't mean shit to me. You may be better at one than the other, who knows.

Kirk
 
Re: n-track

solit said:
Well, thanks for the input.

If I have an audiophile 2496 and decide to go with mixing software or either:
cubase sx or n-track,
would you recommend that I do my mixing on the pc with my mouse, or is there an external mixer that I should buy that would make the job easider. so a few questions:

1. n-track and cubase sx. are both compatible with my audiophile 2496?

Don't use n-track! It will destroy your life! It is the most unstable piece of crap software I have ever used... ever!

I'm with James Argo, get Sonar. It is some much more intuitive than any Steinberg product.

2. which is easier to use for a beginner?

Neither. Sonar is the most usable serious ap out there.

5. would you recomennd plugging in an external mixer for use with either mixing software? No, because then you can't recall your mixes.
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Digidude824 said:
Have you ever tried running say a 32 track session using 5 plug in's per track, and using multiple aux sends?
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Why would you ever, in any conceivable universe, want to have 5 effects each on 32 tracks of audio? That mix would sound like crap, regardless of what effects you were using or how you were using them.
 
cominginsecond said:
Why would you ever, in any conceivable universe, want to have 5 effects each on 32 tracks of audio? That mix would sound like crap, regardless of what effects you were using or how you were using them.
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you probably wouldn't but you know your computer can handle it, if you ever wanted to.
 
"2. which is easier to use for a beginner?

Neither. Sonar is the most usable serious ap out there.
"

dont forget Vegas' interface, if easy is paramount, it uses the least keystrokes per function of any app, period. Sonar can murder it in MIDI implementation tho, and also in that sonar can use external control surfaces so you dont have to mouse your way thru a mix

"I know I was much more happy with the sounds coming out of Protools than I was with the gritty digital sounds coming from Cubase."

ummm

something else is going wrong here...is that as opposed to the uh "analog" sound of PT?

theyre both digital

as for grittiness, Cube-Endo is capable of rendering digital clones, even with gain change and return. PT cant do this. If your sound is being hurt somewhere there are other trees to bark up. I think maybe you found PT easier to work with and more conducive to your style, and I'd have to agree usually. Cubendo is a midi sequencer with audio thrown in recently as an afterthought, while PT is foremost an audio app. However, that doesnt mean that anything should sound worse in cubendo than PT, in fact the opposite is true. This is a case of RTFM or pilot error if you couldnt get it to sound good in cubendo
 
You are all making me sick. Lets settle this with a big knife fight.
 
cominginsecond said:
Why would you ever, in any conceivable universe, want to have 5 effects each on 32 tracks of audio? That mix would sound like crap, regardless of what effects you were using or how you were using them.
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At ease, im talking about power. If this is so, then why the hell do newer apps have 5+ inserts per track??? eh??? whats the point then? I'm not saying you have to use 5 per track, im saying do a test of computer power vs. the "unlimited" lingo.

Thanks for that reply, cause you just made a great point!
 
hmm, it's not that all 5 effects have to be real FX.
How about timing critical delays eh? I often find myself just screaming for more AUX in Nuendo (YES, I use Nuendo!), 'coz I tend to use much delay for fattening/slapback/doubling etc. and these are timing critical. Or a nice guitar loop in 8th where I wanted to have a little delay on 16th..
Or how about typical reverb for just that one channel eh?? well, usually I end up using about 2 or 3 different reverbs..

you know.

I mix on a 2.4 gig, 512MB audio tuned PC and it is capable of doing LOTSA channels and FX in realtime.

greets, ro
 
what about SAW Plus

For strickyly Audio and no midi.. Saw Plus was pretty cool and easy to use. I played with it the other night and it was very smoothe.

What was really funny about it is when I went to uninstall the damn thing. No uninstall. A message popped up saying " just delete the folder" because no registry entries are used with SAW.

It did everything on it's own I guess. LOL

I still say Sonar though. LOL

Im working a Ptools session this weekend. Never used it before but hell,, All I need is a mouse.


Malcolm
 
that bob lentini guy, the saw guy, is an INCREDIBLE programmer! Didnt one version of saw weigh in at 640 k ? That guy just needs help with his user interface and then the whole world is doomed!
 
Ok, I'll chime in here. Protools is the industry standard for one simple reason, it got that way while PC hardware wasn't up to speed enough to support serious DAW work. It is only very recently that processors and other hardware, software and OS's have become fast enough, and stable enough to make a native solution really competitive with PT. Once entrenched in industry standardness, it's tough to be de-throned. You not only have to prove that you have a serious Pro Tools killer, offering the same or better functionality, sound quality, and reliability, but you also have to overcome the transferability issue too.
In my ever so humble opinion, the best contender right now for being the Pro Tools killer is Samplitude 7.0 Professional, but while the software is pure genius and sonically stellar, it is practically unknown......sort of the industries best kept secret by way of absolutely dismal marketing. For audio quality and editing functionality, it walks all over PT. In a landscape of MIDI sequencers turned audio recording apps, Samplitude has always been about being the best audio engine, and it simply is.
Cheers, RD
 
what industry is this that PT is standard in ?

the same one where ADAT's and Pesonus Compressors are standard in ?

In any "big" room your as likely to see a Fairlight, Sadie, Soundscape or NED system as you are to see PT
 
*.wav or *.w64, both of which pt has a hard time dealing with.
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Huh? WAV is the default file format for Pro Tools since version 5.0. If you want to argue that they had to update their software to get there, then you would be correct, but what app hasn't been updated? At the time 5.0 made this move, Cubase SX did not even exist.

Yes, you are likely to see other systems in pro studios, like SADIE, etc. But which are you most likely to see when you walk into a pro studio? Until (if) the industry makes a big switch over to Nuendo, as everyone seems to be predicting, it's still Pro Tools.

As far as OMF compatibility goes, it is a format created and owned by AVID, and the reason everyone except Digi supports it for free is so they could claim their systems were compatible with Pro Tools, to avoid losing sales. Pro Tools doesn't need OMF compatibility to exchange data with other Pro Tools systems (duh) and thus it's not a big priority for them. Not that I agree with their strategy re: making post houses pay for the option, but like every other company, they are in business to make money...
 
actually in a big fat pro studio you are likely to see NO software whatsoever, except possibly Sonic Solutions in their mastering Suite. WHich is the main reason I laugh at the industry standard BS. I now have ONE idol of mine that occaisonally chooses to use PT. The rest still either use other software or would much rather do without software of any sort ( the vast majority)

about the wav compatiability. I stand corrected, though I still see constant screaming at the Duck not being able to open wav's and see the PT knuckleheads around here still having major trouble with importing them. Then again try opening a 96k file in anything but HD

I got nothing against PT users, but in the end I am not stupid enough to say that you MUST use any software. Its whatever the engineer is familiar with. The finished product should be the clients ONLY concern and this is where I get PISSED. Now lots of bands are trying to dictate format, which is retarded. They think there is some magical sound that PT makes or something and we all know thats not true. The industry standard hype is what I call BS against
 
I agree it's mostly hype, as far as bands are concerned. If they sound good, they're going to sound good on any medium. If they sound like crap, they're going to need a lot more work to sound better, regardless of the recording medium. But any system out there (given professional-level recording facilities and equipment, and quality recording, mixing, and mastering engineers) will do the trick.

I use Pro Tools because I like to have my plugins running on dedicated hardware... it gives my CPU a lot of freedom to run other apps, samplers, synths, etc. And it also alleviates a lot of worry on my part... I never have to wonder if my CPU is going to max out, I can just pull up a window that tells me straight up how things are being used. When I run out of power on the cards, I can add processing on the CPU... it's elegant and simple, not a lot of BS.

If you want to talk about hype, I will willingly go head to head with you on the 96k "hype." Few "standards" are currently more irrelevant for music production than that.
 
"If you want to talk about hype, I will willingly go head to head with you on the 96k "hype." Few "standards" are currently more irrelevant for music production than that"

youre not gonna get any argument from me there. If lower cost ADC's could get better filters it would be sonically irrelevant. But heres another case of stupid client dictating format. We get a LOT of calls for 96khz, so consequently, I have the ability to do it, though I can only do 30 tracks of input at 96khz at a time.

I have plugins running on dedicated DSP as well, but nowhere near as smooth as the way PT can do it.
 
Hey pipe, what you should do to counter the PT format choice when clients are shopping is to show them the raw data. Im pretty sure when Lynn Fuston is done with the CD people will crap their pants. I bet Digidesign will crap more because from what Ive been following, PT LE on the 001 is better sounding to a majority of engineers when the old double blind fold test is done. Why go TDM if the 2 buss gets accumulated plug-in artifacts. It seems they didn't line up the ducks;) when they integrated the bit math on the plugends.

File problems with PT..say it isnt so! Check your filname extentions and change it to PT format.

The only reason PT became an industry standard (for a period) was that they were one of the innovators of HD recording systems. The big problem is that they didn't listen to the real users and all the hype had been working. But Nuendo, Sequoia, Radar... etc are slowly erroding away at the PT hype. I use lots of different softwares, I even use N-track once and awhile. Each one has strengths and weakness but none of them are so stellar that picking one out of the bunch would be a no brainer. Use what you can afford and makes sense to you from a layout/function view.

How many here can listen to a CD and hear the different between 2" tape and anything else. Even pro's get surprised.

Peace,
SoMm
 
Re: n-track

solit said:
Well, thanks for the input.

If I have an audiophile 2496 and decide to go with mixing software or either:
cubase sx or n-track,
would you recommend that I do my mixing on the pc with my mouse, or is there an external mixer that I should buy that would make the job easider. so a few questions:

1. n-track and cubase sx. are both compatible with my audiophile 2496?

CLS: Yup. Both should be.

2. which is easier to use for a beginner?

CLS: Cubase SX. N-track is very good for beginners in that it is so inexpensive, but it has been very unstable. That can get very frustrating.

3. whats the cost of cubase sx?(I looked up n-track, its $69)

CLS: Um...$600, I think...pretty pricey, but I think its worth it.

4. is there any reason cubase sx would be better?(assuming it is more expensive)

CLS: MUCH more stable, a bit more fully featured, looks really nice.

5. would you recomennd plugging in an external mixer for use with either mixing software?

CLS: You won't need an external mixer unless you want one. :) They have a number of uses, but I wouldn't start out with one unless you need the preamps.
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pipelineaudio said:
"2. which is easier to use for a beginner?

Neither. Sonar is the most usable serious ap out there.
"

dont forget Vegas' interface, if easy is paramount, it uses the least keystrokes per function of any app, period. Sonar can murder it in MIDI implementation tho, and also in that sonar can use external control surfaces so you dont have to mouse your way thru a mix

"I know I was much more happy with the sounds coming out of Protools than I was with the gritty digital sounds coming from Cubase."

ummm

something else is going wrong here...is that as opposed to the uh "analog" sound of PT?

theyre both digital

as for grittiness, Cube-Endo is capable of rendering digital clones, even with gain change and return. PT cant do this. If your sound is being hurt somewhere there are other trees to bark up. I think maybe you found PT easier to work with and more conducive to your style, and I'd have to agree usually. Cubendo is a midi sequencer with audio thrown in recently as an afterthought, while PT is foremost an audio app. However, that doesnt mean that anything should sound worse in cubendo than PT, in fact the opposite is true. This is a case of RTFM or pilot error if you couldnt get it to sound good in cubendo
Click to expand...

No shit they're both digital. But Protools sounds smoother and warmer. Cubase sounds sterile. I could tell this even before I did any mixing in Protools.

Scott
 
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