Cubase 7.5 vs. Melodyne for corrections?
- Thread starter BxD
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jimmys69
MOODerator
Cubase Variaudio better? -no. Easier? -definitely yes. Melodyne runs separately from it's host. You upload to it, then play back through it. Then export the final when done to save resources. With Variaudio it is integrated with the software. Quite a bit less accurate and realistic, but works great for small corrections on the fly. I would never try to create harmonies with Variaudio.
To what degree do you plan to 'correct' pitch?
And yes I agree with bongoboy about not using it. Problem is, it is needed often with the singers I get in my studio. If it were my vocal track, I would perform it until I got it right. Many don't wish to spend $$ or take the time to do that, so I use another tool in my box.
jimmys69
MOODerator
I understand man. I have done some youngster recordings as well.
You are not going to be able to fix 'screeching' vocals with Melodyne or Variaudio. Melodyne works as a plugin insert to transfer the audio to the outside program. Well, the version I use does. I don't believe there is a plugin version that works in real time as plug in that way. Either way, there is no fixing of a 'screech' just like you can't take the distortion out of a recorded guitar track.
You are not going to be able to fix 'screeching' vocals with Melodyne or Variaudio. Melodyne works as a plugin insert to transfer the audio to the outside program. Well, the version I use does. I don't believe there is a plugin version that works in real time as plug in that way. Either way, there is no fixing of a 'screech' just like you can't take the distortion out of a recorded guitar track.
jimmys69
MOODerator
One thing I have found that works with singers with less than desirable control (especially kids or stoned adults), is to take a track they have recorded. Pitch correct the heck out of the part, and have them sing along with that in their mix. Seems the brain naturally moves to the correct notes when hearing it while singing. Hell, Stryper had a keyboard player playing their vocal notes through monitors so that they nailed them. Kind of the singing in the shower effect, only with the perfect note to sing to.
Best to you and the project. Let me know If I can help in any other ways. I have a soft spot for the young ens...
Best to you and the project. Let me know If I can help in any other ways. I have a soft spot for the young ens...
Guitargodgt
New member
Melodyne is definitely not faster at all. Even the plugin requires you to transfer the audio into the plugin before processing.
However when it comes to how each works, melodyne is more transparent IMO and does better than even auto tune for crazy stretches.
However when it comes to how each works, melodyne is more transparent IMO and does better than even auto tune for crazy stretches.
Bane01
Like Yeah!
I would trust Melodyne over Variaudio any day. Of course best to use both sparingly and only to fix mistakes you can hear and not see. I wish Steinberg would just get smart and forget VariAudio and implement Melodyne integration instead. That's all Celemony does is pitch correction so why bother introducing another me too product that won't come close? There's even speculation that VariAudio may go standalone one day...seriously?
Using Melodyne in Cubase can be a bit of a trick and I prefer not to use the conventional Transfer method cuz it's a bigtime PITA, not to mention you have to bypass FX so they aren't recorded too. Generally once you have recorded and comped a vocal performance, you can bounce to a new file and open that in standalone Melodyne. There you can save as an .mpd so you can come back and get things you missed earlier. And of course you can save as WAV files along the way. Beats the heck out of the long transfer method. Cause you'll also notice working that way that a lot of your navigation controls are still in use by Cubase and working between the two just becomes a freaking mess.
Using Melodyne in Cubase can be a bit of a trick and I prefer not to use the conventional Transfer method cuz it's a bigtime PITA, not to mention you have to bypass FX so they aren't recorded too. Generally once you have recorded and comped a vocal performance, you can bounce to a new file and open that in standalone Melodyne. There you can save as an .mpd so you can come back and get things you missed earlier. And of course you can save as WAV files along the way. Beats the heck out of the long transfer method. Cause you'll also notice working that way that a lot of your navigation controls are still in use by Cubase and working between the two just becomes a freaking mess.
jimmys69
MOODerator
We are in complete agreement here.
I usually do pitch correction before I get into the mix stage. Insert Melodyne/pitch correct and then export/import to a new audio track. I disable the original and use the tuned track as the main track.
What is the benefit of using Melodyne in stand alone mode? I am just curious as to your workflow. I myself find it impossible to correct vocals without the other tracks.
If Variaudio came close to Melodyne, I would just use it. Sad that others have tried to make comparable tools that just don't have the ability to do the job well. Then again, Melodyne costs more than Cubase. Guess you get what you pay for huh? Would be nice to see it integrated....
I usually do pitch correction before I get into the mix stage. Insert Melodyne/pitch correct and then export/import to a new audio track. I disable the original and use the tuned track as the main track.
What is the benefit of using Melodyne in stand alone mode? I am just curious as to your workflow. I myself find it impossible to correct vocals without the other tracks.
If Variaudio came close to Melodyne, I would just use it. Sad that others have tried to make comparable tools that just don't have the ability to do the job well. Then again, Melodyne costs more than Cubase. Guess you get what you pay for huh? Would be nice to see it integrated....
Bane01
Like Yeah!
Jimmy, each method has its advantages and disadvantages you just gotta choose which you can live with better. If Cubase workflow wasn't so darn good I might have switched to Sonar over this integration issue.
Of course other than getting to bypass the Transfer process (with tempo changes and other annoyances), there's are a couple things that make it easier to work standalone for me. First of all the vocal is outside it's processing and backing track which can be good or bad. You can hear more potentially if it's not smothered in reverb. It is harder to tune outside the context of the song, still you can hear it in your head anyway and meters are a nice backup. But the biggie is that when you run Melodyne as a plugin in Cubase in the conventional manner, you are forced to use Cubase's navigation controls to get around the Melodyne interface. How fast your cursor gets around depends on your zoom level in the host app. So in essence, the Melodyne cursor and timeline is slave to the DAW, which I find supremely annoying and a bit glitchy when trying to work fast. In stand alone you can drag the cursor along the timeline and navigate promptly, because of course it is the master. When I get it back in Cubase I can mix it with no frills. Because if, for instance, you want to trim off the silence at the beginning of a recording, you can't do that because it still referencing Melodyne. Of course, silence can be deleted in Melodyne, but the same hold true for all other offline processing. There are many other minor reasons but these are the main ones.
Of course other than getting to bypass the Transfer process (with tempo changes and other annoyances), there's are a couple things that make it easier to work standalone for me. First of all the vocal is outside it's processing and backing track which can be good or bad. You can hear more potentially if it's not smothered in reverb. It is harder to tune outside the context of the song, still you can hear it in your head anyway and meters are a nice backup. But the biggie is that when you run Melodyne as a plugin in Cubase in the conventional manner, you are forced to use Cubase's navigation controls to get around the Melodyne interface. How fast your cursor gets around depends on your zoom level in the host app. So in essence, the Melodyne cursor and timeline is slave to the DAW, which I find supremely annoying and a bit glitchy when trying to work fast. In stand alone you can drag the cursor along the timeline and navigate promptly, because of course it is the master. When I get it back in Cubase I can mix it with no frills. Because if, for instance, you want to trim off the silence at the beginning of a recording, you can't do that because it still referencing Melodyne. Of course, silence can be deleted in Melodyne, but the same hold true for all other offline processing. There are many other minor reasons but these are the main ones.
Guitargodgt
New member
I used to use rewire before getting the plugin. I hated that workflow.
Anyhow my workflow is the same as Jimmys, place melodyne on the tracks I want it on, hit the transfer button and play the song. Go back tune the track and then bounce to a new track. I actually take melodyne off the original tracks and mute them though.
Trim silence and add effects after that.
Anyhow my workflow is the same as Jimmys, place melodyne on the tracks I want it on, hit the transfer button and play the song. Go back tune the track and then bounce to a new track. I actually take melodyne off the original tracks and mute them though.
Trim silence and add effects after that.
Mo Facta
Farts of Nature
Variaudio is just as good as Melodyne, IMO. The fact that it is implemented into Cubase makes it a winner for me. Why would I want to hassle with a third party program when it's all right there?
Variaudio has lots of tricks up it's sleeve that make it a lot more powerful than one would think.
Firstly, you can't just think you're going to hard quantise everything and it's going to work and Melodyne is the same. There are always breath and mouth noise artifacts that get through and sometimes single notes are split into different segments. Then it's a matter of using the segments tool to make sure you've got the segments you need. Then you have to use the pitch and warp tool tool to smooth the transitions using the "end stoppers" on each segment. These are invaluable tools.
For those that don't know what I mean when I say "end stoppers" (I don't know the feature name), if you click anywhere in the segment near the bottom (the cursor will look similar to this: ][), a line will appear which will make anything beyond that line unaffected by pitch bending. Putting the cursor at the top left or right of the segment will allow you to smooth the transitions while leaving the rest of the pitch line unaffected. To me that's the most invaluable tool in the entire P&W toolkit.
Cheers
Variaudio has lots of tricks up it's sleeve that make it a lot more powerful than one would think.
Firstly, you can't just think you're going to hard quantise everything and it's going to work and Melodyne is the same. There are always breath and mouth noise artifacts that get through and sometimes single notes are split into different segments. Then it's a matter of using the segments tool to make sure you've got the segments you need. Then you have to use the pitch and warp tool tool to smooth the transitions using the "end stoppers" on each segment. These are invaluable tools.
For those that don't know what I mean when I say "end stoppers" (I don't know the feature name), if you click anywhere in the segment near the bottom (the cursor will look similar to this: ][), a line will appear which will make anything beyond that line unaffected by pitch bending. Putting the cursor at the top left or right of the segment will allow you to smooth the transitions while leaving the rest of the pitch line unaffected. To me that's the most invaluable tool in the entire P&W toolkit.
Cheers