Copyright and royalty issues in my band

D-drone

New member
My band has just finished recording our first single and its got to the time where we need to think about royalties if the thing gets anywhere. My occasional co-writer believes everything should be equal between all four members, regardless of contribution (keeping in mind that only he and I are writers).

I wrote the song and the recording is pretty faithful to the orginal demo I presented to the band but there have been a few additions by the others ie the use of triplets in parts of the song as a rhythmic feature (over existing chords - no structure change), lead parts in the chorus and a solo over an existing bridge.

Q1) Do any of these constitute a claim for songwriting credit, I'm of the opinion that they are production aspects only and as such I own the copyright and full royaties?

I have offered to do an equal split by way of personal contract between the four members (ie I get the 100% royalties directly and then disperse with clauses dictating that it remains within the life of the band etc), thus keeping control of the work, but I'm slightly worried about any claims on the above grounds of arrangement.

As for other works, we've really only got two tracks that we play regularly that were co-written (with my guitarist). In both I wrote the lyrics and vocal melody in there entirety, based on his original instrumental ideas and structure. However for one of the tracks I was involved in structure as well as adding a few key riffs (ie the first verse and chorus). In the second track I have only added vocals and done some slight rearranging of his existing parts.

Q2) Is it reasonable to except these two tracks and any other subsequent co-written works to be split AT LEAST 50/50 to me, ie in the second song he cannot reasonably claim more than a 50% credit?

I'm sure these problems are run into by many band members but I've searched and haven't found much to support or deny my view on this. I would appreciate answers on the general situation and the two main questions. The personal contract idea is a way of possibly removing the monetary implications by keeping everything equal within the band. I guess another thing I'm trying to ascertain is when a song becomes a song and not a work in progress, as I guess it could be claimed with the first song - with small changes like were made or if there were ever more significant things, are these composistion aspects or re-arrangements?

I would also appreciate any links to any articles pertaining to these articles that I present to the band and specifically the co-writer to support (or deny!)my view. I understand the equality argument but I would like to think that what mine in the first place is always mine.

Before I ramble to much more -
Q3) I would have thought something that was entitled to copyright credit in the respect of currently unregistered work would be something which considerably changed the character of a song, such as vocals (from my side) or a major new section (ie a bridge - taking it from the musical side of the argument)?

Anyway please help me, I don't want my to implode over this but I don't want to lose my works to people that never wrote them!
 
You need to distinguish between performance rights and songwriting credits. The norm is that rights for the actual recording are split equally between all performers, but publishing rights lie just with the songwriter(s). Arrangements don't count - it's lyrics, melody and chords, to simplify. So Jagger and Richards get all the publishing rights for most Stones songs, even though Watts's drumming is a huge part of their sound.

If it helps, the former head of the British Academy of Composers and Songwriters has propsed a form which sets out, at the recording stage, agreement about who made what contribution to the song. So if, for instance, a bass player comes up with a killer riff that brings an otherwise mediocre song to life, you might agree that a percentage of the publishing rights are his / hers. If your band members are reasonable, you should be able to agree something song by song - if they are not then you have a problem ;)
 
The US copyright registration forms have you spell out each authors contribution to the original works.
Keep in mind that, since you have recorded the songs, you'll be registering the actual recording as well as the underlying song components (form SR).
On the form, you would list each author who contributed any appreciable amount of content to the songs... It will be up to you guys to settle your internal disputes as to whether the triplets, etc. will be considered appreciable.
Once listed on the forms and registered with the copyright office, the law doesn't distinguish between the AMOUNT of authorship... Meaning, if you co-authored with another registrant... you two are 50/50 regardless of how much 'more' you did than him... If there are 3 authors on the form then the authorship in the laws eyes fall at 33/33/33 etc.

First and foremost, you guys really need to sit down and reach an agreement regarding song creation (and put it on paper).

Good luck!

:)
 
Your band is in trouble!

I have gone threw this many times and most recently with a band that had 18 songs the majory of the songs were written by the lead singer. He wrote the lyrics and came up with 3 chord progressions for the songs but that was it. As a band we filled in the gaps and brought the song to life. Our band is no longer together because of him constantly bringing up MY SONG MY SONG when in fact his songs were mearly lyrics with an accoustic 3 chord progression. And me as a bass player would be playing much more then 3 chords to make the song sound full. In fact if you played just my bassline it didn't even sound like part of the song. (I took all the bass lines i wrote for his songs and turned them into new songs that I structured.)

The other issue was no one except him kept bringing it up, we all could care less. Worry about that when you break. For a "BAND" that has 2 songs I wouldnt be focusing on who wrote what. Someone in the band is always going to feel they contributied in a way that benifited the songs. Make it simple before you loose your band. when your done with a new song write down what makes the song stand out. And sit down as a band and listen to your song talk to each other . Your lyrics could be horrible but the music makes it sound good! Now I'm not saying your a bad writter I'm just stating that mabey someone in your band might thing so, so they are on another forum saying My lead singer lyrisist sucks and our music is what drives the song how to I get my royalties for making his music sound good.

If you don't talk it out you wont have to worry about royalties because your band will break up because of it.

This may not be the best way but heres how we put the songs on our website with who contributed to it. As well as on our demo cd.

Song: I love Guiness Extra Stout
Lyrics Written BY: Joe Dirt & Dirty Lisa
Music written By: Joe Dirt, Mike Jones, Fred Watson & Animal
Performed By: Emmit Otters Jugband

Hope this gives you some insite to the path your band is heading in. I'm sure theres a bunch of us on here that have gone threw this and lost bands because of it. If you as a songwritter need the full rights to the song maybe you should be a solo artist that hires studio musicians to play your songs. And then it's all you!

AND dont forget to poor man copywrite your material untill you an get it properly copywrited.

Peace
 
If you look at Stone Temple Pilots' CD inserts, ever song has "Lyrics by: X, Y, Music: Y, Z" on EVERY SONG. It's not for royalties sakes, they don't care. It's just a way of documenting who did what, so that X can say, "I don't write many lyrics, but I did HERE. . ." and just for interest sakes, it's good.

As for "Bridge: Y, Chorus music: X, Chorus melody and underlying harmony: Z," etc. don't get ridiculous, because you'll just piss people off.
 
gspotstudios said:
Your band is in trouble!

I have gone threw this many times and most recently with a band that had 18 songs the majory of the songs were written by the lead singer. He wrote the lyrics and came up with 3 chord progressions for the songs but that was it. As a band we filled in the gaps and brought the song to life. Our band is no longer together because of him constantly bringing up MY SONG MY SONG when in fact his songs were mearly lyrics with an accoustic 3 chord progression. And me as a bass player would be playing much more then 3 chords to make the song sound full. In fact if you played just my bassline it didn't even sound like part of the song. (I took all the bass lines i wrote for his songs and turned them into new songs that I structured.)

The other issue was no one except him kept bringing it up, we all could care less. Worry about that when you break. For a "BAND" that has 2 songs I wouldnt be focusing on who wrote what. Someone in the band is always going to feel they contributied in a way that benifited the songs. Make it simple before you loose your band. when your done with a new song write down what makes the song stand out. And sit down as a band and listen to your song talk to each other . Your lyrics could be horrible but the music makes it sound good! Now I'm not saying your a bad writter I'm just stating that mabey someone in your band might thing so, so they are on another forum saying My lead singer lyrisist sucks and our music is what drives the song how to I get my royalties for making his music sound good.

If you don't talk it out you wont have to worry about royalties because your band will break up because of it.

This may not be the best way but heres how we put the songs on our website with who contributed to it. As well as on our demo cd.

Song: I love Guiness Extra Stout
Lyrics Written BY: Joe Dirt & Dirty Lisa
Music written By: Joe Dirt, Mike Jones, Fred Watson & Animal
Performed By: Emmit Otters Jugband

Hope this gives you some insite to the path your band is heading in. I'm sure theres a bunch of us on here that have gone threw this and lost bands because of it. If you as a songwritter need the full rights to the song maybe you should be a solo artist that hires studio musicians to play your songs. And then it's all you!

AND dont forget to poor man copywrite your material untill you an get it properly copywrited.

Peace

It's still your singer's song even though your band's arrangement brought it to life. Sometimes an arrangement so changes a song that the writer should have a moral and ethical obligation to include the arrangers as co-writers on the copyright registration....but don't hold your breath.

Poor man copyrights don't work in court and are a waste of time.
 
hey Gspot...

i've been looking for a copy of " I love Guiness Extra Stout", by Emmit Otters Jugband, do you know what label they're on? ... i heard emmit just got busted for runnin shine, so all their albums are gonna skyrocket. keep an eye out.
 
I have always been a fan of functioning as a unit.
In Blind Melons albums they say: All songs writen by Blind Melon as One
But thats just me.
 
It gets complicated and very specific to the band in question and their process. A band like U2, for instance, used to come up with songs almost entirely democratically through jamming, but as time has gone on, has now narrowed down to a couple of primary writers, and so while the crediting section is the same, the royalty split is different. Whereas R.E.M. still does Buck, Mills, Stipe in equal parts no matter who contributed what. It seems to be down to temperament. Toad the Wet Sprocket got around it by a sort of hierarchical crediting system (one song would be by Glen & Toad, another by Todd & Toad, etc.), though I'm not sure how that got worked out royalty-wise.

The key is that everyone's happy, and that sounds like the primary sticking point in the original post. If someone's not letting it go, it'll be a fault line that will open up again in future, probably at a very inconvenient time. I have no band-aid, but I will say that in my experience, resentment on a low simmer is 100% fatal to a band member's commitment in the long term.
 
Back
Top