Condenser Mic Noise

J

jonathangeiger

New member
I've heard that condenser mics are known to pick up every bit of noise that's around, whether it be computer fans or amps or whatever. I will mostly be recording guitar amps and the like so I was wondering if I'm going to have to worry about getting my amp to be really quiet as far as noise goes. It's really pretty quiet but the way I hear you guys talk about these condensers I'm wondering how wise it would be to buy something and then have all kinds of noise being picked up. I'd like to buy a condenser though.

Also, could you reccomend some nice Noise reduction plugins?
 
I use Cool Edit Pro's built in noise reduction filter. I find it extremely transparent, and super easy to use. You just have to make sure there's a spot in each track where there is nothing but background noise (from your computer fan, guitar amp, refrigerator, whatever), and pick a small sample (believe it or not, smaller samples are actually better) of just noise.

Using cardioid pattern instead of omnidirectional helps a bit, too. That said, I use my SM57 dynamic mike on my guitar amp, anyway, so it's very quiet. Overall, if you're having to deal with a lot of noise, it may not be worth it to use condenser mikes.
 
I wouldn't use a noise reduction filter on anything but a restoration project but that's just my opinion. The amp will usually be loud enough that other noise won't matter. A noise gate should be enough to get rid of all but the worst of amp buzzes.
 
Last year I was working on a commercial CD (classical piano). The hall, the recording was made, had an air conditioner on and it was impossible to turn it off. We were thinking that later it would be possible to remove noise. We tryed a couple different NR programs--DC-5 and Waive, which supposedly is one of the best on the market. Finally, we gave up this idea, as even with minimal amount of reduction, we found that a lot of 'magic' of the recording is gone. In commercial release, we just made a note about it.
 
does anyone know some settings I can use as a starting point using a noise gate on vocals...I'm using the gate in the waves c1 and it's not taking out the background noise...I have the following settings right now
gate open: -60
gate close: -65
attack: 300
release: 100
hold: 1
 
Crawler said:
does anyone know some settings I can use as a starting point using a noise gate on vocals...I'm using the gate in the waves c1 and it's not taking out the background noise...I have the following settings right now
gate open: -60
gate close: -65
attack: 300
release: 100
hold: 1
Click to expand...
It's going to vary a lot depending on the output level of the preamp, the loudness of the singer. It's something you just have to play with. There are no starter settings. The reason why it's not taking out the noise in your case is because the open and close level is set way too low.

Plus, what does that have to do with this thread?
 
^ the guy who started the thread was speaking about mic noise and I also seen texroadkill mention something about noise gates so I figured I'd ask in the thread and maybe the answer could also help dude who started the thread..anyway thanks for your reply
 
Thanks for the feedback, I really hate using noise reduction programs cause they really do take away alot of "magic". And that's why I started this thread. Anyways, I'm not sure my first question was really answered, or maybe I didnt really state it that well.

You see, I want to buy a condenser mic to pick up the nuances of my guitar and amp and for a nice stereo image but , seeing as I am a student, buying something even $100 or $200 is a big purchase and I want to make sure that, when I get a condenser, I'm not gonna find it's picking up even the most minute hum from my amp, because I hear they "amplify even the smallest sounds".

My amp isnt loud at all, its actually really quiet. But I just want to make sure.

So...will the condensers pick that up?
 
Yes of course. Just like a dynamic will. What mic you use doesn't matter in that regard. When a mic is close to an amp, it will pick up any hum coming from the amp, but once you start playing the hum doesn't matter as much. If the hum is problematic, all you can do is work on minimizing the hum. The mic doesn't matter.

Also, you mentioned "stereo image." Are you going to be stereo mic'ing the amp? If not "stereo image" doesn't come into play.
 
yea ill be stereo micing it. But, I've heard condensers pick up everything. For Example I've heard people having to turn off refrigerators on a different level because the mic picked them up. Or, maybe I'm wrong.

Either way, thanks for the help.
 
When I fire up a condensor in my living room, with the windows open I can hear kids 50-80 feet or more away outdoors. Part of that is because of the sensitivity of the mics, and part of it due to the density of the neighborhood where I live.
 
jonathangeiger said:
yea ill be stereo micing it. But, I've heard condensers pick up everything. For Example I've heard people having to turn off refrigerators on a different level because the mic picked them up. Or, maybe I'm wrong.
Click to expand...
No, you're right. For example, A condenser will pick up a refrigerator that's 30 feet away and a dynamic won't, because a condenser is much more sensitive than a dynamic. On the other hand, both a condenser and a dynamic will pick up hum from an amp that's 6 inches away because even though a dynamic is less sensitive than a condenser, it's still sensitive enough to pick up hum from 6" away. And the hum will probably be nearly as loud with the dynamic as with the condenser. Do you see what I'm saying? That's why using a dynamic is not a way to get rid of hum. The only way to get rid of hum is to somehow keep the amp from humming. Do a search on doing that. I know there's been some threads about it.

Also, how will you be stereo mic'ing your amp? If you're sticking two identical mics up to the grill, it probably doesn't sound any different than just sticking one mic up to the grill. I guess unless you're mic'ing each speaker in multi-speaker amp.

In either case, I've found that the difference between mic'ing an amp with a condenser and a dynamic is less than you might think. Amps exist in the midrange, and dynamics can do a great job capturing midrange. The frequency range of amps is not high enough to take advantage of condenser mics extended frequency response anyway. (e.g., amps only give off up to 10 kHz and below, while most condensers go up to 20 kHz)

Anyway, hope this helped.
 
Last edited:
People seem to find those Behringer noisegates ok and they won't be expensive at all. I am wondering because I seem to be stacking up many copies of my computer fan at the moment. This is less of a problem with dynamics than condensers, but with guitar amps you're talking the hum coming from the same source as the music. That's why cominginsecond was right.
 
I guess when you're running a loud guitar amp, the sensitivity of the microphone almost becomes irrelevant because the volume of the guitar sound will push any extraneous sound very far down into the noise floor.

If hum through the amp is a problem, try these things first:

1) Make sure your guitar and microphone cables are well seperated from any AC cables (like extension cords or the amp's power cable). Especially troublesome are cables that are coiled.

2) Get a hum-eliminating power bar or power conditioner (anywhere from around 60.00 and up).

3) Switch out any suspicious looking cords. Use the best quality guitar and microphone cables you can get. They have better shielding. Never "strong arm" wrap existing cables as the shielding can be ruined.

4) Don't get too close to your amp as your guitar pickups wil react to the field emanating from your amp.

Okay, this is a bit off topic, but definitely relevant to eliminating noise while miking guitar amps.
 
I guess when you're running a loud guitar amp, the sensitivity of the microphone almost becomes irrelevant
Click to expand...
No, you see, the point is that no matter how loud the amp, the mic is being positioned to get what comes out of it. The hum is coming from the amp! If it was a separate source, e.g. a fan, the sensitivity of the mic may become a factor.

Other than that, the advice is spot on. With single coils, try rotating yourself to reduce the noise.
 
noisedude said:
People seem to find those Behringer noisegates ok and they won't be expensive at all. I am wondering because I seem to be stacking up many copies of my computer fan at the moment. This is less of a problem with dynamics than condensers, but with guitar amps you're talking the hum coming from the same source as the music. That's why cominginsecond was right.
Click to expand...

I have eight Behringer noisegates, but only use one of them in the talkback system. I will explain this further in the post.
The gates have a certain influence on the sound that I don't like and they open with a little kind of click.

If your PC is making too much fan noise you should put in in a closet or anything like a big box. I'm sitting behind a PC right now (Hewlett Packard) that makes very little noise. My son has a PC that's almost unhearable.

About the noise gates: The Behringer Intelligates have a button for 'ducking' , which reverses the way they work. So they don't open on a certain level, but they close on a certain level, kind of an infinite ducker.

I have a room mic in the tracking room that's connected to the last input on the desk and I use it for communication with the band, so I can hear what they say. But when someone suddenly stroke his guitar or bash a drum, I will blow my monitors. Here comes the gate in duck mode, when there's a noise other than people talking, the gate closes at lightspeed. It's in the insert permanently.

There's a talkback mic on the desk which is connected to the second last channel of the board and it is sent to the trackingroom speakers. Normally I have to mute that channel when I start recording, but sometimes one forgets this. So the second gate in duck mode is in the insert of that channel and the key in is connected to the SMPTE on track 24 of my 2" machine.

As soon as the machine starts rolling, the SMPTE will close the gate and the talkback mic is muted, kind of an automated TB system.

Can you follow me?
 
That's very very clever. Shame you don't like them for normal use though. I'm trying to do more recording outside of my room but housemates get pissy when I leave cables all over the floor!
 
That is a pretty clever use of a noise gate, Han. Noisedude, I think you're housemates should be more understanding--after all, it's art! Don't they want to be invited the Grammy party?
 
ok, thanks. I get it now. I was under the impression that since condenser could pick up noise from a refrigerator upstairs and stuff that hum 6" would be really loud, since it's alot closer.

But on the stereo imaging thing I guitars arent normally stereo miced, but I'm a little unorthodox in terms of playing and junk. I dont really record anything other than guitar and found sounds, I'm a minimalist, I guess. But anyway, my amp is a twin reverb so I'll be micing each speaker, one with a 57 and the other with some condenser...probably a b1, since I hear it's just something you have to have. Or maybe I'll get an At3035... I dont know yet. I'd just like to have a condenser handy.

...but thanks for all the info, I get it now.

=)
 
noisedude said:
That's very very clever. Shame you don't like them for normal use though. I'm trying to do more recording outside of my room but housemates get pissy when I leave cables all over the floor!
Click to expand...

So you think my IQ is higher than the average chimpansee? :D

I used to gate toms, but although the Intelligates are very fast and they have EQ on the trigger side, so they don't open on cymbals, the sound of the toms is fuller and less boxy without the gates.
So my conclusion is that the gates have an effect on the quality of sound.

This has nothing to do with attack, hold and release/decay settings whatsoever.

So if I feel the need to gate toms or whatever, I can do that with the board's automation, just like you can do with a DAW.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top