Computer idiot trying to put together a pc DAAW...

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pacman9000

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that "AAW" is me realizing I'm an idiot when it comes to computer recording...

I've done recording in a studio setup using a 4 bus mixer recording to ADAT, and have also used a standalone digital recorder/mixer: the obviously compressed audio sounding Roland VS1680...but when it comes to computer recording I can't differentiate my ass from my elbow yet, although I continue to try.

I've happened upon a cheap computer (1st computer of my own), the only one I could afford, but I think it's pretty good and I might be able to use it for a DAW eventually if I am able to get help in becoming less of an idiot...that's where this board comes in, and I'll cut to the chase:


My Computer:

Compaq Presario 600 - 1.73ghz Pentium 4, 512MB ram, 60GB harddrive, one available PCI slot (i have no idea what type, or how I find out what type).


I think I need a soundcard and a mixer...but I'm still very confused, for instance, could someone explain to me the difference between firewire, usb, and pci and put it in laymens terms:



THE FOLLOWING IS AN EXPLANATION FROM ECHO PRODUCTS THAT I DON'T UNDERSTAND:


Is my hardware compatible with an Echo product?


Each of our product families requires a different hardware interface to the computer. The interface required by each product family is described below.


AudioFire family: AudioFIre2, AudioFire4, AudioFire8, AudioFire12 - Requires a FireWire interface.


Indigo family: IndigoIO, IndigoDJ - Requires a Type II CardBus slot.


Echo 3G and Echo24 family: Layla3G, Gina3G, MiaMIDI - Requires a PCI slot*


*All PCI products are compatible with 5V PCI, 3.3V PCI and PCI-X.





Q: HOW DO I FIND OUT IF I HAVE A CARDBUS SLOT, OR A FIREWIRE INTERFACE? WHAT DO THEY LOOK LIKE? MY COMPUTER IS FROM 2002 IS THAT BEFORE FIREWIRE WAS IMPLEMENTED?

Q: IS A SOUNDCARD THE BEST WAY TO GO? I HAVE 1 PCI SLOT AVAILABLE BUT i DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND...HOW WOULD I FIND OUT?

Q: WOULD A FIREWIRE INTERFACE OR USB INTERFACE AUDIO INTERFACE BE CHEAPER AND JUST AS EFFECTIVE?


Q: WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN AN AUDIO INTERFACE AND SOUNDCARD?



MOST IMPORTANT QUESTIONS:


Q: IF I GET A SOUNDCARD CAN I PLUG MY MPC DRUM MACHINE AND KEYBOARD DIRECTLY INTO THE SOUNDCARD AND EQ/COMPRESS WITH THE SOUNDCARD, OR DO I NEED A MIXER?


Q: IT LOOKS LIKE MOST SOUNDCARDS UNDER $500 HAVE ONLY 2 INPUTS, ISN'T IT A PAIN TO HAVE TO RECORD TRACKS 2 AT A TIME INTO THE MULTI-TRACK RECORDING SOFTWARE?


Q: I'M INTERESTED IN THE SOUNDCARD/USB/FIREWIRE SETUPS PEOPLE HAVE, AND IF THEY USE A MIXER AS WELL OR DO YOU EQ WITH THE RECORDING SOFTWARE?



FYI, MOST OF MY MUSIC IS 8 TRACKS AND ALREADY SEQUENCED (NOT MIXED DOWN), I JUST NEED TO RECORD MY MPC AND KEYBOARD INTO THE PROGRAM SO I CAN ADD MY FRIENDS VOCALS AND MIXDOWN AND DO A BASIC MASTERING OF MY WORK.

I'M TOTALLY LOST HERE, FRUSTRATED THAT I DON'T HAVE THE MONEY TO FIGURE IT OUT ON MY OWN THROUGH EXPERIMENTATION, SORRY FOR THE BASIC QUESTIONS.

I KNOW I CAN FIGURE OUT THE MULTI-TRACK SOFTWARE, IT'S THE HARDWARE ISSUES I'M STRUGGLING WITH FOR THIS COMPUTER SETUP.


THANKS FOR ANY HELP SUGGESTIONS
 
Last edited:
20 views and no replies?

what is this too basic for people to stoop down so low to help me out?

just give a basic overview, c'mon I'm a nice guy.
 
are people uptight here?

lol, you you gotta build up a rep and have good standing with the "regulars" before anybody will reply to your topic?
 
Relax, it will come!Ill read it over in a bit and offer what little I can in a while.
 
Oh, God, Beez is going to offer advice. Pity the helpless!
 
pacman9000 said:
Q: HOW DO I FIND OUT IF I HAVE A CARDBUS SLOT, OR A FIREWIRE INTERFACE? WHAT DO THEY LOOK LIKE? MY COMPUTER IS FROM 2002 IS THAT BEFORE FIREWIRE WAS IMPLEMENTED?
Click to expand...
Google your pc model #

pacman9000 said:
Q: IS A SOUNDCARD THE BEST WAY TO GO? I HAVE 1 PCI SLOT AVAILABLE BUT i DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND...HOW WOULD I FIND OUT?
Click to expand...
If you only need 2 inputs and 2 outputs, I'd recommend M-Audio Audiophile 24/96 PCI card.Only cost you $100.

pacman9000 said:
Q: WOULD A FIREWIRE INTERFACE OR USB INTERFACE AUDIO INTERFACE BE CHEAPER AND JUST AS EFFECTIVE?
Click to expand...
I don't know.

pacman9000 said:
Q: WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN AN AUDIO INTERFACE AND SOUNDCARD?
Click to expand...
I believe the terms are interchangeable.



MOST IMPORTANT QUESTIONS:


pacman9000 said:
Q: IF I GET A SOUNDCARD CAN I PLUG MY MPC DRUM MACHINE AND KEYBOARD DIRECTLY INTO THE SOUNDCARD AND EQ/COMPRESS WITH THE SOUNDCARD, OR DO I NEED A MIXER?
Click to expand...
I believe you'll need a mixer or a preamp.


pacman9000 said:
Q: IT LOOKS LIKE MOST SOUNDCARDS UNDER $500 HAVE ONLY 2 INPUTS, ISN'T IT A PAIN TO HAVE TO RECORD TRACKS 2 AT A TIME INTO THE MULTI-TRACK RECORDING SOFTWARE?
Click to expand...
Not for me, as I typically record alone.
 
I think I need a soundcard and a mixer...but I'm still very confused, for instance, could someone explain to me the difference between firewire, usb, and pci and put it in laymens terms:
Click to expand...

Speaking relative to their postion in your question: faster, slower, fastest. Depending on the manufacturer drivers may, or may not, be stable.

If your PC does not have a Firewire (1394) port then you need a PCI firewire card. Personally, given that you have only one PCI available, I would just go with a PCI based soundcard. But, you know, whatever.

A type II CardBus (also known as PCMCIA slot) is usually found only on laptops, although they are available (provided you have a open PCI) for install on desktops.

Q: HOW DO I FIND OUT IF I HAVE A CARDBUS SLOT, OR A FIREWIRE INTERFACE? WHAT DO THEY LOOK LIKE? MY COMPUTER IS FROM 2002 IS THAT BEFORE FIREWIRE WAS IMPLEMENTED?

Q: IS A SOUNDCARD THE BEST WAY TO GO? I HAVE 1 PCI SLOT AVAILABLE BUT i DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND...HOW WOULD I FIND OUT?

Q: WOULD A FIREWIRE INTERFACE OR USB INTERFACE AUDIO INTERFACE BE CHEAPER AND JUST AS EFFECTIVE?


Q: WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN AN AUDIO INTERFACE AND SOUNDCARD?
Click to expand...
Speaking respective to their position...

You do not have a CardBus slot, and you do not have a integrated Firewire port. If you bought the computer used you might have a Firewire adapter in a PC slot, but I doubt it. A Firewire port looks much the same as a USB port, only two corners on one of the narrow ends are rounded. A USB cord won't fit.

A sound card, of some type, is required.

No to cheaper, and no (IMO) to just as effective. But then I have been burned with external Firewire adapters. YMMV.

There is no difference, per se. Feature sets vary by manufacturer.

Q: IF I GET A SOUNDCARD CAN I PLUG MY MPC DRUM MACHINE AND KEYBOARD DIRECTLY INTO THE SOUNDCARD AND EQ/COMPRESS WITH THE SOUNDCARD, OR DO I NEED A MIXER?


Q: IT LOOKS LIKE MOST SOUNDCARDS UNDER $500 HAVE ONLY 2 INPUTS, ISN'T IT A PAIN TO HAVE TO RECORD TRACKS 2 AT A TIME INTO THE MULTI-TRACK RECORDING SOFTWARE?


Q: I'M INTERESTED IN THE SOUNDCARD/USB/FIREWIRE SETUPS PEOPLE HAVE, AND IF THEY USE A MIXER AS WELL OR DO YOU EQ WITH THE RECORDING SOFTWARE?
Click to expand...
Depends on the sound card. You will most likely not need a mixer, and even if you had a mixer it would have to interface to the soundcard, most likely via Firewire.

Well, perhaps.

EQ with the software.

Given what you have provided I would suggest the Echo 3G. Luck. Hope this helps.
 
beezelbubba said:
Relax, it will come!Ill read it over in a bit and offer what little I can in a while.
Click to expand...


you know...you're right, I do need to relax...but I can't, I bought this computer and I feel I'm in over my head because everything changes so quickly, use usb, no firewire..wait there's a new type of pci slot, some cards dont' work with the pci-x...WTF!!


i've been serching google, i can't find anything in laymens terms explaining the differences and if I can even have firewire installed on my computer, what is the difference between pci and firewire and usb i just want to record, i know what i'm doing when i record i just can't even take the first step in getting setup because i'm scared to spend money on things I don't understand...i fukin hate computers and wish i could just afford a reel2reel or a fukin akai dps24 but i really want to like computers i do, but i don't have any confidence that i can keep up with all the technical jargon and rapid changes some of which don't improve anything just make companies more money....like cd's have inferior quality to tapes and they don't even make tapes or reel2reel anymore, bullsh1t, i hate this sh1t.


sorry

no im not computers suck man, fuka driver, a delivery driver? what is this a catering service technology?

fuggin drivers and dongles, crackers and cereals, usb's firewires pci's and incompatible hardware with software how does this make home recording easier again???

new technology sucks, i would buy a reel to reel if they still made parts, sounds better, easier to setup and use
 
wheelema said:
Speaking relative to their postion in your question: faster, slower, fastest. Depending on the manufacturer drivers may, or may not, be stable.

If your PC does not have a Firewire (1394) port then you need a PCI firewire card. Personally, given that you have only one PCI available, I would just go with a PCI based soundcard. But, you know, whatever.

A type II CardBus (also known as PCMCIA slot) is usually found only on laptops, although they are available (provided you have a open PCI) for install on desktops.


Speaking respective to their position...

You do not have a CardBus slot, and you do not have a integrated Firewire port. If you bought the computer used you might have a Firewire adapter in a PC slot, but I doubt it. A Firewire port looks much the same as a USB port, only two corners on one of the narrow ends are rounded. A USB cord won't fit.

A sound card, of some type, is required.

No to cheaper, and no (IMO) to just as effective. But then I have been burned with external Firewire adapters. YMMV.

There is no difference, per se. Feature sets vary by manufacturer.


Depends on the sound card. You will most likely not need a mixer, and even if you had a mixer it would have to interface to the soundcard, most likely via Firewire.

Well, perhaps.

EQ with the software.

Given what you have provided I would suggest the Echo 3G. Luck. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...


THANKS EXACTLY WHAT I NEEDED, VERY CONCISE AND THANK YOU FOR QUOTING ALL MY QUESTIONS, IT IS REALLY APPRECIATED.


THE ONLY THING I WOULD LIKE TO ASK IS ABOUT USING A MIXER, NOW YOU SAY I WOULD HAVE TO INTERFACE TO THE SOUNDCARD??

I THOUGHT IF I HAVE A MULTI-INPUT SOUNDCARD (LIKE 8 INPUTS) I COULD JUST USE THE 1/4" ANALOG INPUT AND DO ALL THE EQING AND COMPRESSION BEFORE GOING IN...i THOUGHT SOUNDCARDS HAVE ANALOG 1/4" INPUTS THAT i COULD RECORD INTO FROM THE MIXER?


THANKS AGAIN, I SHOULD TAKE SOME COMPUTER COURSES OR SOMETHING, ANYONE RECOMMEND ANY VIDEOS ON COMPUTER RECORDING AND COMPUTERS IN GENERAL (HARDWARE COMPONENTS MAINLY).


THANKS!!!!1
 
When you look at multitrack software everything has tracks up the wazoo. These are equivalent to channels on a mixer. But mixers that allow you to establish a one-to-one relationship with those tracks are a relatively new development. Most mixers, such as some of the SoundCraft, would combine all of the channels into one data stream (S/PDIF on SoundCraft) so that even though you had sixteen channels at the mixer you would end up with only one track on the software.

Now there are mixers (for example Mackie) that have a Firewire interface and which establish a one-to-one relationship between the mixer and the multitrack software so that channel one appears on track one by itself, channel two appears on track two by itself, etc.. Pretty nice, and correspondenly pretty expensive.

Naturally you could take the analog off of the mixer into the analog in at the soundcard... if it had enough in's.

Hope this helps.
 
If all your devices have line outputs, you can connect straight to the sound card's line inputs. Sound card / interface are basically the same thing. Usually an external device with mic preamps and other bells and whistles is referred to as an interface. You can compress before the box or in the box, your choice. One thing you should keep in mind is in/out latency. You'll likely get the lowest latency out of a high quality pci interface. (Somone will be along shortly to say that pci is dead.) Some plugins (effects and virtual instruments) will add more latency. If you like to monitor with effects, you might want to use outboard gear. Once you get settled on a system that works for you, there's no need to worry about the newer technology unless something in your system dies and you can't find a replacement part. No one can tell you everything you need to know in a single thread. Think over your budget and needs, put together a few imaginary systems, and start asking questions.
 
TravisinFlorida said:
If all your devices have line outputs, you can connect straight to the sound card's line inputs. Sound card / interface are basically the same thing. Usually an external device with mic preamps and other bells and whistles is referred to as an interface. You can compress before the box or in the box, your choice. One thing you should keep in mind is in/out latency. You'll likely get the lowest latency out of a high quality pci interface. (Somone will be along shortly to say that pci is dead.) Some plugins (effects and virtual instruments) will add more latency. If you like to monitor with effects, you might want to use outboard gear. Once you get settled on a system that works for you, there's no need to worry about the newer technology unless something in your system dies and you can't find a replacement part. No one can tell you everything you need to know in a single thread. Think over your budget and needs, put together a few imaginary systems, and start asking questions.
Click to expand...


Thanks Travisinflorida this is also very helpful and thanks again to Wheelema...

yeah i guess wheelema you were talkin digital and I was thinking analog, maybe I should think about going in to the card through the digital in but I think I might stay analog because I think even an analog mixer/eq does add a bit of warmth and a slightly more organic feel, even if it really is just because of a little pink noise that's added...but I could be wrong, there could be sometype of tube eq software or something that gives that desired effect.



More Questions...oh and maybe I can get every single question I have ever had in my life answered in one thread, because it keeps going up every time I post, jejeje.



WHY IS PCI DEAD????????????


DIDN'T WHEELEMA JUST SAY IT WAS FASTER THAN FIREWIRE?


IS FIREWIRE SUPPOSED TO REPLACE PCI?????


WHAT'S THE WORLD COMING TO????


WHAT IS LATENCY AND WHAT WILL HIGH-LATENCY DO TO MY RECORDING, WILL IT MAKE IT RECORD CHOPPY AND BE UNUSABLE???
 
thanks again, everyone in this thread on my buddy list


...but i still can't post any new topics... :mad:
 
It's not so bad

Let's look at your situation. You are used to the VS stuff. I was once a VS1680 userr as well. To get similar functionality you are going to need an interface that allows 8 inputs w/ pre-amps. This is where the Firewire card comes in. Most of the decent affordable interfaces are gonna need to connect to your PC via a Firewire connection. I use the PreSonus FirePod....there are lots of others out there. Most of the interfaces come with some sort of lite version of a DAW software. Consider the software (Cubase, ProTools, etc....) the same thing as the stuff that happens on the screen of the 1680. The FirePod comes with Cubase LE. It's not bad for a beginning package. Let me know if this is helpful or if you would like me to expand on my little analogy.

cheers,
 
sauce said:
Let's look at your situation. You are used to the VS stuff. I was once a VS1680 userr as well. To get similar functionality you are going to need an interface that allows 8 inputs w/ pre-amps. This is where the Firewire card comes in. Most of the decent affordable interfaces are gonna need to connect to your PC via a Firewire connection. I use the PreSonus FirePod....there are lots of others out there. Most of the interfaces come with some sort of lite version of a DAW software. Consider the software (Cubase, ProTools, etc....) the same thing as the stuff that happens on the screen of the 1680. The FirePod comes with Cubase LE. It's not bad for a beginning package. Let me know if this is helpful or if you would like me to expand on my little analogy.

cheers,
Click to expand...


hey thanks for the response, I have no problems understanding recording/mixing software, I'm relatively competent at recording and I've used programs like performer....I'm an idiot when it comes to computer hardware issues...and drivers, things that require in-depth pc knowledge.

My computer does not have firewire...I do have an available pci slot, why do you think firewire is better?


is it possible to add firewire?

why would I want to add firewire instead of just using the pci slot?



thanks
 
If you use a firewire mixer, you can record similtaniously and keep the tracks set up. So you can record, say 4 tracks at the same time, and in your software, they will stay seperate. That's the big advantage for me. USB doesn't seem that great since it only can do a stereo mix, from what i know. And PCI gives you the option of separating tracks if you have the hardware to support it (enough preamps, etc).
 
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