Compression, Noise Gate, Limiters, De-Essers: All At Once Or One At A Time??

[Mike Freze]

Hello! I'm beginning to understand the different roles that compression, limiters, noise gates, de-essers, etc. have in the mixdown or final mastering process. I suppose you could add some of these processors right at the time you record each track, if you choose.

Is it best to use only one processor/effect at a time when you record, mix, or master? Or can you use several or all together at once? I'm not sure.

Is it best to limit yourself to just one or two of these effects and forget the others?

Example: vocals. You want to avoid breaths between singing segments (noise gate); then you want to get rid of sibilance (de-essers); then you want the highs and lows to be balanced (compressor). That's 3 different processors for a vocal track!! Is that realistic? Is there a general rule for when to apply them: at recording (maybe an external hardware device), during mixing, or wait until mastering?

Mike Freze

 

[RAMI]

Is it best to limit yourself to just one or two of these effects and forget the others?

It's impossible to answer. You use the tools you need to get the job done. Sometimes, it's one, sometimes 2, sometimes 5 effects. But, chances are, if you need to process the hell out of something, it wasn't tracked very well in the first place.

Example: vocals. You want to avoid breaths between singing segments (noise gate);

Not necassarilly. I never gate my vocals.

then you want to get rid of sibilance (de-essers);

Some would argue that if the "esss-ing" is so bad, you should have fixed the problem while tracking rather than waiting until mixing.

then you want the highs and lows to be balanced (compressor).

If by "highs and lows" you mean "treble and bass", then that's not a compressor's job. That's an EQ's job. If you mean "loud and quiet parts", then yes, you use a compressor for that.

That's 3 different processors for a vocal track!! Is that realistic?

Sure, if they're all needed

Is there a general rule for when to apply them: at recording (maybe an external hardware device), during mixing, or wait until mastering?

No general rule. You apply them when you think you need them. Sometimes it's dependant on your gear. If someone has a really nice outboard compressor that they want to apply to vocals, chances are thay'll apply during tracking. But there's no rule for when or how much.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

It's me again

The only rule is to use them only when and only if you want or need them.

Personally, most of those things you mention do little but collect dust in my studio. I can't remember the last time I wanted or needed to use a noise gate, and the need for a de-esser is extremely rare, because I usually take care of that before I even hit the Big Red Button by ensuring proper mic placement and technique in tracking. And the hardware limiter is only for when I'm recording something so dynamically out of control that I have to throw a governor on the signal, also very rare. I'll put a software limiter across the stereo master for the *cough* loudness *cough* thing, but that's about it.

There's nothing *wrong" with using all those devices at once if they are needed, but honestly, if they are needed on one track at once - regardless of the stage - one probably should take a step back and look at their tracking technique and seeing what they're doing wrong that they need to throw so much processing at the signal.

The exception is if one is using all that stuff to create special studio effects. That's fine; if you need to use all that stuff in some way to get an unnatural but desired sound,go for it! But if you need all that stuff just to get a bad recording to sound good, then you probably should look at fixing whatever is causing the recording to be that bad in the first place.

G.

 

[DJYoshaBYD]

^^^^ they pretty much covered everything that i was going to say.. you need to understand why and how they work, and apply them if and when they are needed..

only thing i can add is, record low, record right, and you wont have to do major major work when mixing and mastering.. you need to always strive to get the best quality recording you can get from your gear, and that will help soooo much when it comes to mastering.. there is no set way to do it, per se..

 

[Mike Freze]

Thanks, Glen, once again! Hey, did you get my e-mail or private message?? Just curious.

Mike Freze
mike.freze@yahoo.com

 

[RAMI]

....you're welcome.......

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

Thanks, Glen, once again! Hey, did you get my e-mail or private message?? Just curious.

I just read the PM, your e-mail hasn't made it past my spam filter yet, you have to answer it's challenge.

I'll send you a response to the PM shortly, I just got home and I gotta eat first

And yeah, to be fair, Rami did beat me to the response in this thread with basically the same answer (but more detailed perhaps), so he should get credit.

G.

 

[Bristol Posse]

+1 to using what you need as and when it's called for and only when it's called for

And the simplest answer is usually the right one, if you don't want hard esses in the vocal, use good mic technique to avoid recording them, same with breath sounds

I'd also add that if, for what ever reason, you're stuck with having to use a less than ideal recorded vocal track in a mix, for all three of the examples you quote fader riding/volume and mute automation during mixing would, in most cases, achieve a more natural sounding result.

Too much ess sound, use volume automation to pull down the fader on the ess sounds rather than slapping on a desser, even a good one will have some effect on the entire vocal track not just the esses

Too much Breath sounds you could automate mutes to get rid of them all together, that sometimes leaves the vocal sounding a little wierd however, as singers really do breathe, so if it's just too loud, use volume automation to turn it down

To level the vocal, I'd always use fader riding/volume automation during the mix instead of heavy compression during tracking or mixing. Generally speaking even on a good vocalist (which I am not) the amount of compression that you would likely need to really level a vocal so it can always sit above the rest of the tracks would crush all the life out of the entire vocal track. Also if you have sibliance (essing) problems, heavy compression will make it a hundred times worse and finaly, crushing flat the loud parts of a vocal and bringing up the overall level will make those pesky breath sounds even louder by comparison and probably make a noise gate useless on them too.

Compression IMO/IME is more of a tone shaper than a leveler, especially on vocals which are usually very dynamic in nature. I do quite often use a hardware compressor when recording vocals, not to level them or to avoid clipping since I never track that hot but because I like how it can color the sound a little in a way I can't get with even my nicest emulation plug in compressors.

Keep it simple

of course YMMV

 

[Greg_L]

....you're welcome.......

 

[aaronmcoleman]

i like the idea of using automation to pull down the sibilants. i'm going to do that right now! thanks.