Comparing my track to the bands previously recorded material, any ideas?

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TRNSTN

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I recorded a song for a band that I have posted in a previous thread and I want to know how it compares to a previous
song they have recorded. but as I mixed the track and the songs are at different speeds I can't tell.

Could someone briefly listen to both track and let me know how they compare in quality?

Just a brief listen would do, it would be a huge insight and help.

here is the track I recorded

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/no-respect-more-high-end

here is a previous song

40oz - pig iron music video - YouTube

Thanks again
 
Well, I listened and I'll be honest - the track you mixed sounds really thin.

The drums sound muffled, but I'm not sure that's something you can fix if they were recorded like that.
No element in the mix really stands out.
Depending on how the guitars were recorded, I still think it can be salvaged to be on par with the other one if they're particular fixed with some EQ and brought up with some limiting and then sidechained with the vocals maybe?
 
Thanks for being honest that's what i need.

I have room mikes on the drum's i cut that i can throw in and try, the guitars were DI'ed and recorded through an amp
so i'll try changing the levels and i'll play with the vocals. : )

Any better?

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/no-respect
 
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The second version sounds better. The guitars are fuller. I'd turn down the guitars a little bit. I'd probably nudge up the bass a little bit.

Drums still sound fairly bad. The snare doesn't have much crack to it and a TON of reverb. The kick is kind of indistinct. Cymbals are a little better, but kind of swishy.

The bass has a weird attack and sound.
 
Might I ask how you mix?

Monitors? Headphones? Loud levels?
 
I'll usually use a mix of both, usually start mixing on monitors and then have a listen on headphones and keep switching back and forth.

I just have the volume at what I would listen to music at not particularly quiet or loud.
 
Here is an MP3 of the drums unmixed from another song, so you can get an idea of where I'm starting from with the drums. It seems like the symbols
got on all the mikes so its pretty tricky mixing it. Thought I had faced the mikes away from the cymbals not really sure where I went wrong.

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/dayaftday-rawdrums-1

Here is an mp3 of the the Snare and Tom as well, maybe I just mixed in wrong. I started by trying to get a dryer sound by just using a few audio files, but
I think I just started with the wrong approach.

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/snare-tom
 
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Alright, got ya.
Yeah, I think it's best to avoid monitoring and mixing at loud levels for a number of reasons.
The main reason being that everything tends to sound good when it's loud on your system (monitors or headphones whatever), but it falls apart once you go to a normal or quieter level. So moderate to soft levels are best. At least I find.

So how were the drums mic'd?
Close or just overheads? and if overheads how were they positioned?

A lot of it sounds like it has to do with the drummer and the drum kit itself. Idk if they were duct taped or had no resonant heads or had old heads or what...
The trick is to get the drums sounding exactly how you want them to sound as they're being played - the drummer controlling his playing and playing dynamically across the kit as needed, and the resonance of the drums themselves to fit right. Not excessively muffed to death.
There's an old belief that you should get your kit and playing adjusted so that if you put up one condenser mic it'll sound just how it sounds.
 
I had an Audix D6 on the kick drum but it was at the back of the kick because the drummer had a new skin with no hole so the kick was weak. (Always going to be half way in the kick from now on).

I had a clip on senhieser clipped onto the the snare. (cheap but effective).

I had 2 small diagram condensers in the XY position over the kit for overheads (these should have been closer to the kit as well to focus on the cymbals, but like I said next time I'm recording from underneath, I think that will work well from what I've heard).

I had an SM7b on the Tom with both the cut and boost applied

I had an SE1A about 6 feet away from the kick drum as a room mike

I also had heil PR20, 2 drumsticks above the snare and an SM7b about the same distance behind the drummers right shoulder for a recorderman method.

I'm guessing now I should have used condensers for the recorder man method because it didn't pick up enough of what I wanted it to, I'm definitely going to
work on my close miking and facing mikes away from sound you don't want next time. It seemed like I had my bases covered prior to recording, but I guess with my lack of experience reading about something and actually putting it into practice is not that simple.

I've gone back to the drawing board and played with the levels on an unmixed file, Not sure how to EQ one section to sound good without making another section sound weird. It's mostly that prominent cymbal that I can't treat or do much with because it goes across mikes.

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/promcym

Playing with side chaining not sure if it will work or sound weird? any ideas?

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/drumsidechain

Maybe I should split up the drums leave side chaining on where it works, and where the symbols ring and it doesn't work as well have those on another channel?

That might be the best bet?
 
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Is that verb from the room or did you add it? Sounds like the entire kit is *swimming* in verb, really far away and dull. I don't know how you can get a mix going with that as a base, at least I wouldn't be able to. It's odd because that mic setup should get you decent sounds... Not trying to beat you up, just trying to understand how you arrived at that sound?

TRNSTN said:
I had an Audix D6 on the kick drum but it was at the back of the kick because the drummer had a new skin with no hole so the kick was weak. (Always going to be half way in the kick from now on).

I had a clip on senhieser clipped onto the the snare. (cheap but effective).

I had 2 small diagram condensers in the XY position over the kit for overheads (these should have been closer to the kit as well to focus on the cymbals, but like I said next time I'm recording from underneath, I think that will work well from what I've heard).

I had an SM7b on the Tom with both the cut and boost applied

I had an SE1A about 6 feet away from the kick drum as a room mike

I also had heil PR20, 2 drumsticks above the snare and an SM7b about the same distance behind the drummers right shoulder for a recorderman method.

I'm guessing now I should have used condensers for the recorder man method because it didn't pick up enough of what I wanted it to, I'm definitely going to
work on my close miking and facing mikes away from sound you don't want next time. It seemed like I had my bases covered prior to recording, but I guess with my lack of experience reading about something and actually putting it into practice is not that simple.

I've gone back to the drawing board and played with the levels on an unmixed file, Not sure how to EQ one section to sound good without making another section sound weird. It's mostly that prominent cymbal that I can't treat or do much with because it goes across mikes.

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/promcym

Playing with side chaining not sure if it will work or sound weird? any ideas?

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/drumsidechain

Maybe I should split up the drums leave side chaining on where it works, and where the symbols ring and it doesn't work as well have those on another channel?

That might be the best bet?
Click to expand...
 
Yeah I know that's what Iv been wondering, I think I added a little on the snare and the overheads but the rest of it was from the room it was a medium hall and bare and reflective.

I just found a picture I could rip from a short video clearly the mikes weren't close enough, and the positioning was off.

Here's a pic of the room.

imgur: the simple image sharer

I think I went for the right technique, but I kinda stuck to what I had read. The overhead for the snare in recorder man was 2 sticks from the snare and the same distance for the right shoulder mike and I used a dynamic and should have used a condenser. Plus the dynamics mikes are large capsule dynamics with let a lot of spill in.

I think its pretty clear from the pic where I went wrong now

1. Kick mike not in kick.
2. Dynamic mikes should be small capsule.
3. Microphones not positioned away from the sounds you don't want.
4. Some microphones not placed close enough, and wrong types of mikes for the wrong job.
5. No baffling or dampening.

It pretty much feels like I did everything wrong my intentions were good I'm a little embarrassed. I guess my lack of experience came through.

I had thought I was going to get a good image of the kick and snare and then just sit the overhead's underneath, panned from the XY position to get a big sound. But I had not planned on as spill and reverb.

The song I posted earlier is the one I've made most progress with [https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/no-respect], granted there is a lot of reverb on the drums I think it works ok when it all kicks in, it's getting easier to listen to as I mix and problem solve. But obviously there have been a number of problems and constraints.
 
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Non technical advice - don't ever be embarrassed. It's a learning process, and you are soaking it all in and you have a great attitude about it :-)

TRNSTN said:
Yeah I know that's what Iv been wondering, I think I added a little on the snare and the overheads but the rest of it was from the room it was a medium hall and bare and reflective.

I just found a picture I could rip from a short video clearly the mikes weren't close enough, and the positioning was off.

Here's a pic of the room.

imgur: the simple image sharer

I think I went for the right technique, but I kinda stuck to what I had read. The overhead for the snare in recorder man was 2 sticks from the snare and the same distance for the right shoulder mike and I used a dynamic and should have used a condenser. Plus the dynamics mikes are large capsule dynamics with let a lot of spill in.

I think its pretty clear from the pic where I went wrong now

1. Kick mike not in kick.
2. Dynamic mikes should be small capsule.
3. Microphones not positioned away from the sounds you don't want.
4. Some microphones not placed close enough, and wrong types of mikes for the wrong job.
5. No baffling or dampening.

It pretty much feels like I did everything wrong my intentions were good I'm a little embarrassed. I guess my lack of experience came through.

I had thought I was going to get a good image of the kick and snare and then just sit the overhead's underneath, panned from the XY position to get a big sound. But I had not planned on as spill and reverb.

The song I posted earlier is the one I've made most progress with [https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/no-respect], granted there is a lot of reverb on the drums I think it works ok when it all kicks in, it's getting easier to listen to as I mix and problem solve. But obviously there have been a number of problems and constraints.
Click to expand...
 
Yeah that's how I'm approaching it to learn from every recording session, try and make better decisions in the future.

I realised I forgot to do some pre production work on the drums, so I fixed that they are a bit better.
Anyone fancy a listen and critiquing this version of this tune

https://soundcloud.com/askew-a/stereowithoutthis

and let me know how the drums compare to before?
 
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