Color Color Color

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smellyfuzz

smellyfuzz

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Lots of talk lately on sound color.
Many statements like RNC is transparent,
All mic pre under $1000 color the sound.

Here is a question;

If you discover a certain sound element on say the vocal track, and
you can pin point it to say a piece of gear like the mic pre,

Can you EQ the coloring out ?
 
I'd say, no.

I try to express my (non-audio!) engineering little stupid view on this:

An EQ will only (at least it should) give a linear transformation of the sound. What I also understand as colour is more a non-linear thing. (Well I'm not perfectly sure whether I'll always be able to hear the difference).

You'll never be able to EQ away the sound (additional harmonics) that a tube distortion changes a 'clean' sound. Some mics or pres (well most that I own :D) and a slight little harshness to the sound. I'd say (just by feeling) that this is some distortion in the high-mids. You might cut the high mids, but the distortion stays there...

Also noise can give some colour to sound. You cannot get it away by simply eqing. Then the original freqs that were in that frequency domain are also turned lower and will probably be missing in your product then.

LAst but not least, I'd say that the stuff ANY compressor does to sound is to colour it. And that cannot be EQed away, either. But when it comes to colouring of compressors, it gets even heavier, as you create 'distortions' (nonlinearites) that vary with time...

I'm not sure whether this rather theoretical point of view will be of any help for you, but perhaps :D

aXel
 
I don't think there's such thing as EQing the color out. I think you would only be changing the existing color! You would be adding EQ, which to me would be adding more color and changing the color that the pre has.

Just a thought!!

RF
 
Aside from what's already been said about EQ not eliminating color, there's a kind of fallacy in your basic assumptions. The RNC (or any compressor) is not transparent - though some (like the RNC) are less colored than others. And there are several mic pres under $1000 that are among the least 'colored' preamps out there (Grace Designs & Earthworks come to mind right off the top of my head). You can't base your preconceptions (or your purchases) on things you read in magazines or on the internet. Beg, borrow, rent or do whatever you have to and HEAR things for yourself. Everyone's ears (like their needs and opinions) are different and subjective - you can waste a lot of money buying things that sound good in print which don't sound good in person ( or rather, things which sound - in print- like what you need, but aren't). Nobody, no matter how famous or respected in the industry, can take the burden off of YOU to decide what you need to do what YOU do.


Scott
 
It all depends on what kind of color you are refering to.

If you're talking about a piece of gear that boosts/exaggerates a certain frequency or range of frequencies, then sure, an EQ can get rid of some of that color, if you simply use it to cut whatever frequencies the gear in question originally boosted, for example.

But then you're opening up a whole different can of worms, there, since the EQ might be of the variety that imparts it's own color (perhaps it's transformer-based).

But things like distortion or compression artifacts . . . forget it. Once it's there, it's there.
 
There are generally two approaches to the philosophy of colour in recordings - as I see it.

One: You're on a budget. Therefore, you want to get gear that will be as transparent as possible. The Grace 101 mic pre was reviewed in Recording Magazine, and the reviewer was amazed at how transparent it was. There is a fair amount of gear out there that is relatively affordable and reasonably transparent. Here, you rely on the colours of the instruments alone to add character to your recording.

Two: You can afford a wide range of gear, including things like Sennhaiser U87 mics, a Neve console, LA2A compressors, etc. In fact, you have a collection of all sorts of expensive stuff. Why have all this stuff? Because much of the expensive gear is highly saught after because of HOW they colour the sound! This is why some instruments/singers will sound better or worse with different combinations of mics, mic pres, etc.

Here is an illustration of the difference....
One: Cool.... that sounds exactly like me.
Two: Holy cow! That recording really makes me sound good!!

As an aside...

There is a ruler-flat mic, according to Harvey Gerst (aka Mr. Mic Guru) on "the big thread." It is made by B&K and it was made for test purposes. They're rarely used in recording, though, because they are percieved as "boring" mics.

For more info, check out "the big thread" here

It is quite elaborate and involved, but it is so valuable that you should have to pay for it. Really.... check it out!

Chris
 
Chris Tondreau said:


...You can afford a wide range of gear, including things like Sennhaiser U87 mics...
Click to expand...

Does Neumann know about this? ;)

Chris Tondreau said:

As an aside...

There is a ruler-flat mic, according to Harvey Gerst (aka Mr. Mic Guru) on "the big thread." It is made by B&K and it was made for test purposes. They're rarely used in recording, though, because they are percieved as "boring" mics.
Click to expand...

Actually, ruler flat mics like the B&K's, Earthworks, and others are used quite often - especially in applications like Decca-tree recordings of classical music. When recording a world class orchestra in a world class hall, for instance, "enhancement" via microphone color is not particularly necessary or desireable.
 
You know, it dawned on me later that I mixed up the Sennhaiser/Neumann thing. I knew someone would call me on it. :o Oh, well.... that's what I get for thinking in two different directions while I type.

About the B&K mics, you have a good point. That would be a perfect application for a mic like that, as there are so many different colours - colours that each individual player works towards getting for a good number of years - that are being captured at the same time. You wouldn't want to mess with that.

chris
 
Personally, I don't really get all excited about things like preamps, and such that 'color' the sound. I pretty much always want to hear OUT what I put IN. I suppose I can appreciate the idea that a particular mic can enhance certain characteristics of a persons voice, but if it sounds great to begin with, and you capture it nicely, that would be what I want. I don't want to 'color' it. The same boils down to basically all the instruments to me. Especially when you start adding up a particular "color" over many tracks...I don't particularly want it to end up just sounding like a color (hhhmm...sound like a color......what the H does that mean?:rolleyes: ). Of course I'd excuse the person that wants an "artificial" sound to begin with....but personally, I think almost ALL of the sounds in pop music are artificial sounding anyway. So...then again, I suppose you can color it any color you want.

I made sense...right?
 
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