!! Channel Inserts ??

[13th_Omen]

I am trying to decide how exactly to set up a decent little studio, utilizing the equipent I have. Right now i have all the drums in the basement, miced, and ran into a 16 channel snake. The snake goes upstairs to the control room and into my Yamaha MX200-16. It's an old mixer with 4 Aux. sends. Right now I am using 7 mics on the drums (2 oh, 2 kicks, snare, 3 toms). I need to get these tracks into my recording rig. Right now I have one ADAT but am either going to get another one or some other recorder such as the Yamaha aw4166. So how to get all the tracks there?

I currently have it set up so, Aux1 goes to the can amp, Aux2 is the toms, Aux3 is the OHs, Aux 4 is the kicks. So for the remaining tracks can I use the channel inserts? This is a very grey area for me. I really would like to know how to "properly" use channel inserts. I noticed that with the cord plugged in all the way it goes to the ADAT but not to AUX1 for the cans, and halfway in it goes to both, but this just seems hoky to me! Any insight on how exactly channel inserts work would be a whole bunch of help!!!!

 

[LooneyTunez]

If your mixer channels don't have "Direct Outs", then using the "Inserts" is the way to go. I would do this for all channels, and don't use the "Aux Sends" for tracking to the ADAT. The inserts work by putting both a send and return on one connector so you can send the signal out to be processed (by say a compressor), and then return that signal (from the compressor) back to that channel.

For tracking, you just go "one click" into the "Insert" so you can tap off the (probably pre-fader/pre-eq) signal without interupting the signal flow at the mixer. You would then use the "trim" or "gain" adjustment on the mixer to control the signal level to the ADAT.

Make sense?

 

[13th_Omen]

Make sense?

Sure, it sort of makes sense, except if the inserts act as both a send and recieve how the hell would that work with a compressor which obviously needs an input and an output. I understand that if need be I could just route it back from the compressor to another channel but again, that just seems hoky.. especially since I plan to use all 16 channels for tracking in the very near fututere!

Also, I don't want to use them as pre-EQ, if they are in all the way I can still use the EQ, but I can't turn the channel off with the channel on/off switch. I would like to do a little EQing while tracking, following the old rule of mine.. "Try to track it so you could set all the mix EQs at 0 and the faders at 0 and it sounds decent".

 

[Mark7]

Sure, it sort of makes sense, except if the inserts act as both a send and recieve how the hell would that work with a compressor which obviously needs an input and an output. I understand that if need be I could just route it back from the compressor to another channel but again, that just seems hoky.. especially since I plan to use all 16 channels for tracking in the very near future!

You need a Y cord. One end has a stereo (TRS) Jack plug and the other has two mono (TS) Jack plugs. You plug the mono Jacks into the Ins and Outs of your Compressor and the stereo Jack into a channel Insert socket.

 

[mrface2112]

if your mixer is like most, this is the case:

if you push a connector part-way into the insert jack (to the first click), it works as a pre-fader, pre-eq direct out, just like suggested. there is no return....and it will not interrupt the signal going to your faders or eqs, which still work just fine. this is called "tapping an insert", as that's exactly what you're doing--using the insert as a direct out.


if you need to have the eq on the board go to tape, then you'll need to push that connector all the way into the jack. this is NOT tapping the insert, and it will likely be post fader and post eq. big difference from tapping the insert, but can still do what you need it to do.


if you want to run a compressor in there, i'd run your mic to the mic input, use the gain to control your level, tap the insert as listed above, run that into your compressor, and then run the line out of the compressor into your snake going to the recorder. does that make sense? this won't get your board's eq on there, however, but would likely provide the cleanest signal path.


HTH,
wade

PS--there MAY be some mods you can do to your mixer to convert tapping your inserts to be post-eq, but you'll have to check with your board's manufacturer.

 

[13th_Omen]

Thanks, I think I have it now. I also had to go and read some out of "Modern Recording Techniques" to actually illustrate this concept, but I understand now. It also shows that I could push the plug all the way in and use the sen/recieve to and from the ADAT. I still don't need to do this but I just wanted to knoe how to do it. Thanks again!

 

[monopole]

I run an Alesis HD24xr recorder with channel inserts. One insert per channel. You can get insert snakes--I use three of eight inserts each, 10' long--to go from my mixer to my recorder. This can get costly if you do it one insert at a time. Set your recorder up so that you send the signal back to the mixer during recording, when idle, and not during playback (ie: no mics live when playing back).

Use your AUX sends to drive headphone amps or monitor speakers. You can also use one or two for off-mixer reverb and even pitch correction for bad singers (!!!). Bring the AUX Return into the mix through a stereo channel or a dedicated return. Set the depth of the return to your taste. I wouldn't record from these buses.

If your inserts are PRE channel EQ, you will have the raw mic sound recorded. You can move these to a computer for digital editing and effects. Also, you can play back to the house, and the band can sit in the audience and have a close example of how they sounded--the insert then goes through the house mix during playback.

Yamaha mixers seem to put the inserts post channel EQ. This is good for those who mix live to disc where you want all the effects and EQ done on the run.

Hope this helps,

Cheers,
Buzz.

 

[sweetnubs]

Are there subgroups on mixer? Tape outputs? Direct Outs?

 

[thajeremy]

guys...this thread is 3 years old....