Cant get things LOUD enough, but meters say they're on zero DB. What gives?

C

Chrisulrich

Member
Dear Anyone.

This applies to EVERY TRACK I've ever written, apart from one, and I dunno what the difference was with that one track!

I'm using just MIDI, VSTs, entering every note with the mouse into QSE Level 2 because I can't play anything as I'm disabled. OK.

So I write the track, mix it as best I can. It sounds lovely and loud on the computer. The speakers are Numark, fairly decent, not $4000 mindblowers but I'd say they were OK for mixing. So I save it as an MP3 and listen to it on my MP3 player - and it immediately sounds only half as loud as anything else on the MP3 player. Now here's the kicker.

If I play it and another MP3 on my computer, they both sound EXACTLY THE SAME LOUDNESS!! If I put mine on a CD, MP3 player or anything else, it immediately sounds only a fraction as loud - you have to turn everything right up to hear it at all. If I try mixing any louder, I get clipping central which I know is bad. So I'm stuck.

Why, when I bounce the fricking thing down as a soundfile, does it sound great on the computer but not on anything else, like ever? I'm not saying the mix itself is brilliant, right now I'd settle for hearing my crapulous mix as loud on my hi-fi/MP3 player as I do on the computer.

Now I know nobody's heard of QSE, it's a simple soul recording-wise, it doesn't have any separate volume controls for bouncedown, what you hear is what you get as far as I can work out. And I've tried recording it with Audacity so I can see the waves being created and they look not as big as professional MP3s - but it still SOUNDS loud enough (it's still on the computer) and if I try to amplify it, it says it's within a couple of DB's of zero DBs (-2 or -3) so I think 'Headroom!' and leave it alone. And it still sounds far too quiet on anything that isn't a computer.

And I'm stumped and have been for years! I've tried bunging compression on the final mix in Audacity, it distorts more than it helps (when I do it, unless I'm doing something really stupidly wrong.) I've got Ozone, but I'm USING Ozone on the final mix and, on the computer, the results sound glorious It's just when it LEAVES the PC (it's not a MAC) the problems start!

All answers will be tried.

Yours hopefully

Chrisulrich
 
Cant get things LOUD enough, part 2...

Dear Anyone.

Part One is on the Newbies forum, it's got virtually the same title, but I noticed I was allowed to post MP3s here so I decided to post one. And you'll probably notice its BIG problem straight off, which is what I need help with.

Forget the probably crapulous quality of the actual mix, I can't get LOUDNESS out of the final bouncedown. On my computer, lovely and loud. On an MP3 player/CD/anything else, FAR too quiet. Yet computer says everything's on (or near, allowing 2-3DB headroom) zero DB. If I put compression on the final mix, instant distortion. If I play it on my computer next to someone else's track, they sound roughly the same volume (not a lot of difference). If I play it as an MP3 on my MP3 player next to someone else's track, VAST volume difference! I know there's this trick of shove it onto a CD using normalization and rip it off again, but that tends to kill my mix a bit by flattening everything out too much. It cures the problem but half-kills the patient in the process. (And it costs a fortune in blank CDs!)

Anyway, I wanna know why, when my track says it's on zero DBs (give or take 3db) it doesn't sound as loud as another track that says it's on zero DBs when I'm not playing them on the computer. I'll try to work out how to upload an MP3 here, if I can't, I'll post a link to it.

Yours hopefully,

Chrisulrich
 

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Last edited:
Use a limiter on the final buss.

I merged the two threads. Please keep it in one thread.

Thanks
 
Go read the Mastering forum. Report back.

Also, make sure you fully understand the difference between WAV and MP3, what can end up on a CD and how, as well as what an MP3 player (such as iTunes) may be doing to your recording.

The answers are all there. See you in a month... :D
 
Dear Chilli.

Sorry for the 2 threads, I thought the MP3 forum was the only place you were allowed to post MP3s, you see, so I thought I had to put a thread there as well

I'm abouit to try a limter on the main output (if that's what 'final buss' means, QSE doesn't use busses as far as I know.) I use Ozone on the final output usually and that's gotta have a limiter in it somewheres...

Surely though if it needed a limiter at the output/recording point and I wasn't using one, it would sound quieter on the computer as well as on anything else, not AS LOUD as anything else on the computer and only quieter on portable MP3 players and CDs? That's not gainsaying what anyone's put, cos I dunno what's going on,

I'm off to read the mastering forum now as the other guy said. If the limiter helps at all I'll post the result!

Yours respectfully

Chrisulrich
 
Just a hunch... If it sounds the same volume as a commercially mastered track on your computer, whatever software you're playing it through might have a "auto level match my songs" setting checked someplace. I'm pretty sure itunes has one, and I know for a fact that ipods do because I used to use it and wondered the same thing.

All that aside, as others have said, you're track isn't mastered and it won't ever sound the same volume until it is.
 
Chrisulrich said:
Dear Chilli.

Sorry for the 2 threads, I thought the MP3 forum was the only place you were allowed to post MP3s, you see, so I thought I had to put a thread there as well

I'm abouit to try a limter on the main output (if that's what 'final buss' means, QSE doesn't use busses as far as I know.) I use Ozone on the final output usually and that's gotta have a limiter in it somewheres...

Surely though if it needed a limiter at the output/recording point and I wasn't using one, it would sound quieter on the computer as well as on anything else, not AS LOUD as anything else on the computer and only quieter on portable MP3 players and CDs? That's not gainsaying what anyone's put, cos I dunno what's going on,

I'm off to read the mastering forum now as the other guy said. If the limiter helps at all I'll post the result!

Yours respectfully

Chrisulrich
Click to expand...
Hi Chjris,
I played your piece in Samplitude Silver (cos you can get that free) and for sure it is only averaging -10dBFS . I then exported it as a.wav and opened it in Samplitude SE8(cos I can drive that better!) and normalized it to -1.1dBfs. That drum spike pushed the system into hard clipping so that has to be tamed before you can get the average level up (I do NOT however want to tread on any toes here! I know valves, not mastering!) .

PERSONALLY! I would be quite happy to listen to the original and have the full, (intended?) whooomp of that drum!
I don't do "pods". I am a dyed in the wool hi fi man.

I think you need a "proper" DAW and Sam silver is ones such (but limited to 8 tracks). Reaper is also great.

Dave.
 
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