Can I Work The Way I Like To?

[Oxygenmask]

Hi,

I have 4 keyboards and a Roland VS880. I really want to switch over to a computer based audio/sequencing package. I am going to build a system with around a 1010-LT. I am pretty familiar with using plug-ins and the midi functions of Sonar and other Cakewalk products. I am thinking about moving to Cubase however.

Now, I just don't get the basics I guess. I feel stupid enough, so be as sarcastic as you like...

When I sync up my equipment, I use MIDIclk because that's the only MIDI message that the boards will respond to. I have been told that you shouldn't use that method of synchronization when you use audio in Sonar. Now, the VS will send and receive SMPTE, so I guess I could record audio to that and transfer it BUT....

Question 1: Say I lay an audio track of drums down in Sonar and then want to put a MIDI track under it, won't the two get out of sync? Digital audio has latency whereas MIDI doesn't, so everything is going to be out of whack right?

Question 2: I'm not married to MIDI. If I could work in all audio I would be happy too. But, if I have an audio track laid down, I need to hear that audio file without latency to lay down my next track right? Otherwise everything will be out of whack again. And, if the latency for playback is different from that of recording, how the hell can I play along to create the next track?

I guess what I'm really asking is this... right now I create a MIDI file on my master keyboard's onboard sequencer. When I like it, I transfer the audio to the VS. When I hit play on the VS, I can create another MIDI file in perfect time with the first track and then turn that into audio. I hate bouncing, so 4 tracks is a lot less attractive than the many you get with a good computer system. Can I work the same way with the computer (given that the most advanced sync I can transmit to the computer is SMPTE/MTC?)

I think something popped in my head. I need aspirin.

Oxy

 

[Torpid-x]

I'm no expert on outboard midi equipment, but using Sonar with a modest system to todays standards, using the internal midi I don't have any latency problems unless I'm playing something looped for hours. If I fall asleep with a project looping, when I wake up some tracks are slightly off. Midi and audio tracks sync fine.

and, you should, at least in Sonar, record your midi to audio. then do your mixing. Sonar can handle MANY tracks on a < 1 Gig system with 256 megs of ram. bouncing is only nessecary if you need more track than god to finish your project. Effects on the other hand, might slow you down some.

if a track records a little behind using outboard gear, you can easily bump it into place.

Hope that helps answer your question, I need a drink!

 

[Oxygenmask]

Thanks for replying Torpid. So what your saying is that I should record a MIDI track first, turn it into audio. Then, when I play back the audio, I should be able to record another MIDI track in time to the audio track right?

Also, if that MIDI track needs to be bumped, do I just wing it, or is there a more scientific way to align it?

Oxy

 

[Torpid-x]

question 1, yup, you got it.

question 2, there's many ways to bump an audio track, some more scientific than others, in Sonar you can just grab it and drag it. or use numbers in a dialog box to get it perfect. Really I never had to do this once with Sonar, just on an old and weaker version of cakewalk, on a lesser system. all my midi tracks record without latency, but I only use internal midi.

you said your alread familliar with the features of Sonar, so you know you can also edit midi tracks.

keep in mind I know little about external midi clocks, the choices of clock in sonar are : internal, midi sync, smpte/mtc, and audio. with the option to offset smpte/mtc. (not that I know what that means) I'm guessing you can make up for any latency problems if you have to.

Ah, I'm in over me head here, I go drink more.

 

[Oxygenmask]

Thanks Torpid. I really appreciate the response. I will try experimenting some more with a friend's system this week. I wanted to find out how excited I should get for my own system. I appreciate your time and insight.

I'm out of aspirin, don't understand that much about SMPTE, and think I should start drinking as well.

Oxy