Calling all guitar gurus part II

Jagular

Jagular

Active member
I posted a thread a while ago. I really appreciate the help you guys gave me.

My situation has changed. My budget has increased from $1,000 to $2,500 (including electronics, tax etc) so I figured I would post a new thread with some specific questions.

I have played a bunch of guitars over the last few weeks. Especially a lot of Taylors, Martins & some Larrivees. Some others I need to check out a little more are Guild & Alvarez (Yairi)

I tentatively plan to put an LR Baggs Dual Source in whatever I buy (unless someone gives me good reason not to). That's about $250 installed.

Since my budget has increased, I'm looking very closely at Martins right now. I have played D-28's, HD-28's, D-35, D-40, HD-28V. I have to say. I liked em all for different reasons. The 28's & 35's are in my price range for sure and maybe I can find a deal on a 40 or 41 if I'm lucky. I did a bunch of research to see what the major differences in these models are. I'm more concerned about structure & sound than aesthetics.

So here's the specific questions on the Martins.

1. The D-28 and D-35 have non-scalloped top braces where the HD-28 & HD-35 have scalloped top braces. What does this mean and what difference might it make?

2. Top braces on the 35’s are ¼” compared to 5/16” on the 28’s. What difference might this make?

3. The HD-28 & 35 has a zig zag back purfling where the 28 & 35 have just a solid back. What does this mean and what difference might it make?

4. The HD-28V has a couple differences. The top bracing pattern is forward shifted. What does that mean? The bridge style is “Vintage belly drop-in – long saddle”. What does that mean?

Like I said, I liked the sound and feel of all of these so far for different reasons. I haven’t tried an HD-35 yet. I’m going to take a half day off and go down to Gruhn’s here in Nashville and try out a bunch more guitars. Maybe they have one down there :D.

Anyway…thanks again in advance. Maybe I’m analyzing this too much, but I don’t spend this much money lightly (the CPA in me? :D:D)

Thanks again.
 
Jagular said:


Anyway…thanks again in advance. Maybe I’m analyzing this too much, but I don’t spend this much money lightly (the CPA in me? :D:D)

Thanks again.
Click to expand...

You're analyzing it too much. Try guitars. Buy the one that makes you feel like you're having an orgasm when you play it.

Don't worry too much about the technicalities. Tone and feel are everything.
 
^^^^ what he said ^^^

Best damn acoustic I ever played was a 1945 Gibson that was saved from a fire, but not before the heat shrunk the tuning pegs and flattned the finish with a bit of smoke discoloration.

The action was ungodly, the tone was outta this world, the feel, the everything was dead on....except for one thing:

the owner didn't wanna sell it!

Waaaaaaaah!

I also played that $10,000 Martin. I wasn't impressed. Yet I turn aroun dand grab a Yamaha AXP-5 and fell inlove. Too bad my budget was about $25 at the time or I woulda bought it.

Currently, I'm still happy with my Fender Gemini II. Not the greates acoustic and considered entry level by most, but I love the damn thing. Looks great to be over 15 years old too :)
 
Hey Jag,
I got a great idea!
Just get the Larravee with electronics for about $1200, and send me the rest so we can both have one!

Great idea huh?



bd:D
 
While I do think you should get the one that feels better in your hands, I will give some insight into your questions.


1. HD models (up to the 35) have Scalloped braces to give more bass response. (inline with the original D28 from way back when. The D41's and up, all have scalloped braces. The D40 is either a D28 or D35 with abalone all over to look like its bigger brothers. Thats why it is so much cheaper than a D41.)

2. Bass response. 28 models have more than the 35 models. Models D41 and up are based on the oridingal D28, or todays HD28

3. Its called Herringbone. Just for looks. That is what was use as binding on the original D28s from the 1930's.

4. This is more than I feel like getting into right now. But I will just say that a HD28V is a BAD ASS guitar.


But I am happy with my D41. The only guitar that I would even consider getting after this is a D45V with the snowflake inlays. But that will be a LONG time from now.
 
I guess I should probably mention that even though I used the words "better bass response," that does not mean it is a better guitar. As the 35 series has less bass response than the 28s.

This is just for a different style of music. The more "boomy" guitars however do not always sit well in a mix with other music. So be warned.

Country is a good example of what the original D28 from the 1930s was designed for. But fingerpicking and even alot of flatpicking sounds better on something like an OM or OOOM. You should take a look at those too just for the sake of covering all your bases. There are VERY nice tones to be found on them.
 
Thanks Outlaws. That was very helpful. Your explanations made sense compared to what I was hearing when I played them. BTW...I played a D-41 on my way home tonight and uhhh....yeah...that played really nice. Not sure if I can get there financially, but I'm gonna give it a try. Otherwise the HD-28 was very nice too. I actually really liked the HD-28V a little better for some reason, but I didn't have them side by side to compare. Maybe at Gruhn's. :D.

Thanks a lot. This was very informative :)
 
I have both the D35 and the D45. An HD28V is essentially braced and built the same as a 45, with a lower-graded top. Which means it may not be exactly quarter-sawn, or may have slight variations in the color and grain density across the entire top. The 40-series tops are the best stuff that Martin has to offer. If you wanna save a few bucks I would really take the time to look around for a used HD28V or even a 41. In the used market the 41's don't command that much more than a good-quality 28 because the 28 is a more sought-after guitar.

The main differences are as follows:

The "forward shift" of the X-bracing pattern is the original pre-war design.

I'm not sure about the tuners, but I believe you can get Waverly Butterbeans on the HD28V. If they're available, I'd spring for them.

About "sound"........... My 35 has very even tone across all registers. A very balanced volume across the bass and treble.

The 45 has noticably more bass, and brighter treble, IMO.

Both guitars ring very nicely. When you try out any guitar, try it in a very quiet room, and listen to the guitar's own "reverb". To me, that sound is the mark of a well-made instrument. The plywood-backed guitars just don't seem to have it. The tone sounds flat and lifeless to my ears.

The scalloping of he braces allows the top to vibrate a little more freely than the thicker braces on the 35. After about 4-5 years the top on my 45 bellied just a bit. I was concerned, and took it in to Rick Turner in Los Angeles. I was told by Rick and the owner of the shop (not the shop I bought it at, BTW) that it's pretty common and not to be alarmed. It's part of the process of the guitar "opening up". My 45 is 18 years old now, and the bellie-ing never progressed to become problematic. I use only light-gauge strings on it, and it is a cannon!!!!

If you want to hear what a vintage HD28 sounds like check out anything by Tony Rice. He has played Clarence White's 28 since the mid-70's. That instrument is a monster, with very deep bass and stinging treble!
 
Ya know..........

I am suprise that of all the questions Jagular asked, not one was in reguards to the 2 peice backs of the 28 series, and the 3 peice backs of the 35 :p
 
Thanks c7. That was very helpful info. It also explains why I seemed to like the HD-28V sound better than the D-28 and HD-28. That may be the one I go after. Although, admittadly, the "balanced" sound of the 35 sounds attactive too. But there was something about that HD-28V. Thanks a lot.

Outlaws - maybe I didn't ask because I already know :p

Or maybe not...LOL...so spill already :D.

Thanks a lot guys :)
 
Hey Jag,

Living in Nashville, you gotta go to Cotten Music for acoustics.

http://www.cottenmusic.com

Gruhn's is a great store - I've been there many times over the years (although since Dan Mills left it just doesn't seem the same).

Cotten Music always has a great selection of used Collings guitars (and lots of other good stuff, too!) While Martins are (and have been) excellent guitars, Collings go the extra mile in performance.

Check them out - a D-2 from the early nineties that has been played a lot will absolutely knock you out.

foo
 
Thanks foo!!

I will most certainly check out Cotten Music. Thanks for the heads up on that & the Collings
 
hmmmmmm...............

Well since you asked;

It seems to be something along the lines of projection and tone. Just like everything else. Though, I must say, the forward shifted bracing would seem to have more to do wih projection than having just a 2 piece back. But a 3 piece breaks up the sound a bit more for a slightly quieter guitar. More "folk"-like.
 
You can have a field day with this budget. Here are some boutique and small run makers to become familiar with:

Bourgeois

Huss & Dalton

Collings

Santa Cruz

True North

Froggy Bottom (These are a bit out of the range, but worth spending some time with anyhow).

You should be able to find examples of each of these at Gruhn's. Look for older guitars!!

Oh... and if you really want to spend some change and get something that will change how you feel about life, go here and click on the pic...:D.
 
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Thanks Treeline. I ran across some of those names in the link foo gave me to Cotten Music. Looks interesting. More research :D.

Oh and starting at $7,000. That would certainly change my outlook on life. I would be out of the house looking in :D.

Thanks for the suggestions :)
 
here's a great suggestion... I've recently been made aware of this company out of Oregon called Breedlove. These guitars are just simply amazing. Gorgeous instruments, and they sound phenominal! When I shell out the cash for a *good* acoustic, these are the guys i'm going to. Now... if they'll only start making acoustic basses... :D
 
My only problem is that all these independent companies have some of the ugliest headstocks you can imagine.
 
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