Bus sends?

  • Thread starter Thread starter ecktronic
  • Start date Start date
ecktronic

ecktronic

Mixing and Mastering.
Does anyone know of a way to buss tracks to a channel so that the original tracks arent heard, but the bussed track is?
Is this even possible?

Im wanting to do this so I can send 2 guitar tracks to the buss channel and apply effects to the buss channel so I only hear the effected guitars and not the un effected guitars.

Cheers,
Eck
 
pre fader aux send. then mute the other tracks.

are we talking software or analog mixer?
 
bennychico11 said:
pre fader aux send. then mute the other tracks.

are we talking software or analog mixer?
Click to expand...
Ok, I did a pre fader send from each track to the buss track, but when I muted the original tracks it didnt send it to aux track. The only way I could get it to work was to unmute the tracks and pull the faders right down.
I now have to use the aux sends as my guitar volume controls which isnt the best, but as long as Im not using volume automation then I should be fine.

Cheers.
Eck
 
Have you considered just copying the original tracks to new tracks, processing the new ones, and muting the originals?

G.
 
ecktronic said:
Ok, I did a pre fader send from each track to the buss track, but when I muted the original tracks it didnt send it to aux track. The only way I could get it to work was to unmute the tracks and pull the faders right down.
I now have to use the aux sends as my guitar volume controls which isnt the best, but as long as Im not using volume automation then I should be fine.

Cheers.
Eck
Click to expand...

That's because it's pre-FADER and not pre-mute. ;)
 
Just buss your channels to a group, and then insert the effect you want on that group with the effect being 100% wet.
 
7string said:
That's because it's pre-FADER and not pre-mute. ;)
Click to expand...

hmmm, that's odd.
I guess different programs do it different ways. Prefader send should be before mute/solo. I guess just pull the fader down instead.
 
Actually, prefade should normally cut when the channel is cut as well. At least if you are assumoing it will act like hardware.
 
xstatic said:
Actually, prefade should normally cut when the channel is cut as well. At least if you are assumoing it will act like hardware.
Click to expand...

actually, it's the other way around.
pushing mute on a channel that has it's send to prefader should NOT affect what's going to the send. This is the whole reason for the pre fader. So no mute, solo, fader, even pan changes affect what's going to the aux send...typically a cue mix (therefore the engineer can solo tracks in the studio to listen to without effecting what the band is hearing)

Example:
From the Mackie 32-8 Manual

With the PRE switch depressed, Aux Sends 1&2 receive their input from a point before the channel fader and MUTE switch, and are not affected by changes in these controls. This is the normal setting for creating stage monitor and/or cue headphone sends.


This is the way it works in Pro Tools too. I can't think of any logical reason to make it so the mute button still affects a prefader send. Makes the prefader send pointless.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
Have you considered just copying the original tracks to new tracks, processing the new ones, and muting the originals?

G.
Click to expand...
Do you mean turning my 2 mono guitar tracks into a stereo guitar track so I save on plug-ins? I was trying to work out a way to use 1 set of plug ins for 2 guitar tracks,since it saves on cpu plus it makes it a hell of alot easier to tweak the guitar tracks at the same time rather than solo each and then copy the plug settings.

Eck
 
easy: set up your buss output and input, then take whatever tracks yer bussing out of the stereo buss!


or have it so that the tracks you don't want to hear don't have an output.
 
ecktronic said:
Do you mean turning my 2 mono guitar tracks into a stereo guitar track so I save on plug-ins? I was trying to work out a way to use 1 set of plug ins for 2 guitar tracks,since it saves on cpu plus it makes it a hell of alot easier to tweak the guitar tracks at the same time rather than solo each and then copy the plug settings.

Eck
Click to expand...
Well, no, that's not quote what I meant, since I had no idea that's what you were looking to do :p .

But yeah, you could create a stem file, a sub mix of your guitars and run the effects on that while keeping the source tracks muted.

G.
 
You don't need to set up sends...
Just set the output of the individual tracks to a stereo bus and apply your effects there. Route the resulting "guitar" bus to your master.

Why would you need to mute anything?
 
metalhead28 said:
You don't need to set up sends...
Just set the output of the individual tracks to a stereo bus and apply your effects there. Route the resulting "guitar" bus to your master.

Why would you need to mute anything?
Click to expand...

that'll work too.
many different ways to do one thing ;)
 
bennychico11 said:
actually, it's the other way around.
pushing mute on a channel that has it's send to prefader should NOT affect what's going to the send. This is the whole reason for the pre fader. So no mute, solo, fader, even pan changes affect what's going to the aux send...typically a cue mix (therefore the engineer can solo tracks in the studio to listen to without effecting what the band is hearing)

Example:
From the Mackie 32-8 Manual

With the PRE switch depressed, Aux Sends 1&2 receive their input from a point before the channel fader and MUTE switch, and are not affected by changes in these controls. This is the normal setting for creating stage monitor and/or cue headphone sends.


This is the way it works in Pro Tools too. I can't think of any logical reason to make it so the mute button still affects a prefader send. Makes the prefader send pointless.
Click to expand...

Actually, the Mackie mixer may do this, but that would be the first time I ever remember a board doing that. Prefade really would have nothing to do with solo's either. It is NORMAL for a channels signal to be completely muted (except often times the insert point) when a channel is muted. If it was not, than you would never be able to take a channel out of a mix that had any kind of prefade send. Headphone/cue mixes are typically made prefade for one reason.... so people listening to them do not have to listen to all the changes that the engineer is making for a different mix. Prefade allows the enigneer in the control room to solo and make his own mix for the control room without directly affecting the headphone mixes to the artists. Generally, it is a very bad idea to have a console channel stay open when muted. What if you were to quickly need to silence that channel?

With DAW software however I would imagine that there is an option for how prefade sends are treated. Even on actual consoles there are sometimes options. Usually this option is whether or not the EQ tracks to the prefade sends. As a point of reference, I would not assume that just because Mackie implemented something that it is standard for all consoles. I have consoles by Soundcraft, Yamaha, Midas, D&R, Allen Heath and even a couple little Mackie's. NONE of them leave a channel's prefade send open when the channel itself is muted.
 
You're right. It looks like this varies from console to console (particularly found in larger format). I'm just looking at the Allen & Heath ML3000 model and it offers post mute send...although they offer you the choice of also setting it pre-mute via an internal jumper.

It's been awhile since I've worked with larger format consoles that offer every option under the sun. I'm mostly all in the computer now. I guess it depends on the manufacturer and what they want to put on their mixer/console.
I just wouldn't ever want to mess up a headphone cue mix because I hit the mute button when trying to listen to something.
 
I have an ML5000... I am not sure which jumpers it allows, but pre fade sends still mute when the channel is muted. This is a stock setting. In fact, they do on the ML3000 as well. I understand not wanting to accidentally mute a portion of the mix, but being able to mute something in a hurry is actually a much better option. This is especially true when dealing with live stage monitors which really surprises me that Mackie would say that a prefade send not being affected by a channel mute is standard. That in my opinion would be plain old wrong. I do like the option though of being able to do that, but I like it better as an internal jumper or at least a recessed button that can not accidentally be depressed. In my opinion this needs to be something that a person only activates when they are fully aware of all the ramifications.
 
metalhead28 said:
You don't need to set up sends...
Just set the output of the individual tracks to a stereo bus and apply your effects there. Route the resulting "guitar" bus to your master.

Why would you need to mute anything?
Click to expand...
So you only hear the effected guitars and not the uneffected guitars that you are sending to the FX channel.

Eck
 
You need to set up a group channel. Set the output of the guitar channels to route to the group channel. Done.

Don't use the AUX, don't use FX channels.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top