building a webpage

  • Thread starter Thread starter mbuster
  • Start date Start date
Thanks for the great help. I'll work on it today. I liked the CoolPage program because it's easy to use. It doesn't let me take out the coolpage button, but if I open the page in notepad or something I should be able to get it out of there, (as long as I can wade through all that HTML) I'll move all the files to the same folder and check through the file names. I think I'll need to be learning HTML after all ;)
 
mbuster said:
Thanks for the great help. I'll work on it today. I liked the CoolPage program because it's easy to use. It doesn't let me take out the coolpage button, but if I open the page in notepad or something I should be able to get it out of there, (as long as I can wade through all that HTML) I'll move all the files to the same folder and check through the file names. I think I'll need to be learning HTML after all ;)

Mbuster: Checked back to your site...looks like you've got it figured out!

Glynb: Thanks!
 
Last edited:
ChristopherM,

I like your site, although it has a few "bugs". When I click the logo to enter it makes a new window, and the window is mis-sized. I mean it is a little smaller than full screen and it won't maximize. I like the nav-bar, did you make this? I'm not sure how I feel about it clicking on mouse-over but it is very cool none the less! Nice work.

What's so bad about Front Page? I have it, as well as Dreamweaver, Flash MX, and Fireworks. Front Page works fine once you figure it all out. Here's my site made with all my programs!

13th Omen Web Site
 
13th_Omen said:
ChristopherM,

I like your site, although it has a few "bugs". When I click the logo to enter it makes a new window, and the window is mis-sized. I mean it is a little smaller than full screen and it won't maximize. I like the nav-bar, did you make this? I'm not sure how I feel about it clicking on mouse-over but it is very cool none the less! Nice work.

What's so bad about Front Page? I have it, as well as Dreamweaver, Flash MX, and Fireworks. Front Page works fine once you figure it all out. Here's my site made with all my programs!

13th Omen Web Site

Bugs? No. The new window is intentional it isn't supposed to resize. I got the idea from this site. I liked their little TV, but didn't like what happened when the window was maximized (TV goes way up to to left of an otherwise blank screen on a high-res screen setting), so I disabled the "maximize" function on mine. I picked the specific size of it so that the whole thing would show up if someone was still browsing at 640x480. I check and "debug" my sites in all resolutions on IE, Netscape, Mozilla, and Opera. I'm quite aware of how it looks :)

Yes, I made the navigation bar. As far as the knobs doing the click action on mouseover, that was a stylistic choice, not a bug. About 75% like it and 25% don't. The people who don't are usually really annoyed by it though. I just haven't gotten around to changing it. More people were actually annoyed by the use of Flash, so I created an "old school" site just for them. Did you see the non-flash version?

Good job on your site, BTW...
 
I'm gonna chime-in in defense of FrontPage. :p


I use FrontPage for all the pages I've done so far and I've never had a problem with it.

And I like it for BOTH reasons that everyone was mentioning earlier... it's a good WYSIWYG editor AND you can edit the HTML directly.

I use a combination of both... I'll create the basics of the page using the WYSIWYG tab and then switch over to the HTML tab to make any specific modifications to the code.


I've done my website and my band's website using nothing but FrontPage.



I'd say for someone starting out, FrontPage can be pretty handy, because it will allow you to create something using drag-and-drop, and then click the HTML tab and see exactly what HTML was used to create it... no need to save pages under different file extensions and open them under some other application. You can figure out HTML in a day just by making changes and hopping back and forth between the WYSIWYG and the HTML tabs.



WATYF
 
I'm not so much attacking FrontPage as I am promoting the idea of knowing the basics of HTML. If you know what you are doing, FrontPage can be a great tool.

Your websites are nice. You've done your homework. You have got to admit, though, that it is immensely helpful to know HTML for getting your stuff done the way you want it done!

What I hate is when people create more work for themselves by avoiding the HTML.
 
WATYF said:
I'd say for someone starting out, FrontPage can be pretty handy, because it will allow you to create something using drag-and-drop, and then click the HTML tab and see exactly what HTML was used to create it...

That's what I did in Dreamweaver.

It's a lot like learning to play an instrument. Initially, it’s better to learn how to do something then try to understand why it works that way. When I learned guitar, I had teacher after teacher try to start me with that ridiculous Mel Bay’s Guitar 1 book. So what happens? I do what I feel a vast majority of people would do in
that situation. I quit every time because most people can’t handle the coordination demands on your hands as well as tackling the logic of theory, intervals, modes, or even simple melody. When I found a teacher who told me to “just put your fingers here” I was served a hefty helping of immediate gratification. I was encouraged by my accomplishments, My desire to learn was reinforced and I continued on the path of learning to play songs to the point where my hands were good enough that I could worry less about dexterity and more about learning the rules
of the instrument. I feel it’s made me a more motivated and consistent guitar player.

With Dreamweaver, I first learned to design a site. I wrote text in a table, threw images in side frame and “made them buttons,” and posted MS word html pages of the tabs I’d done. Then, with an example of something I had done, I had a perspective from which to learn. Just like WATYF, I read the source after I made them by toggling back and forth and learned both.

Now, I’m not saying learning to do things “the right way” by learning HTML won’t work. I’m sure it would. I, however, don’t have time to waste doing things the right way if there is no discernible difference to most web visitors doing it a much faster way. i'm also not a big fan of this dorky elitist attitude among coders that if you don't do your site in notepad, you're not worth your salt. I'm not saying I'm hearing that here, just that I encounter it.

to them, I say PHOOEY!~@#

2pence.
stone
 
stonepiano said:
I'm also not a big fan of this dorky elitist attitude among coders that if you don't do your site in notepad, you're not worth your salt. I'm not saying I'm hearing that here, just that I encounter it.

Yeah, I know what you mean.

As for me, I may be a dork, but I'm not an elitist dork :)

I've always felt (for me) that I gain a better understanding of something if I learn it the hard way. Cars, computers, guitars, women...oh the lessons I've learned!
 
What's the best Flash package?

ChristopherM,
That Tubes site you gave as an example is excellent, it's something like that I'd like to achieve in due course.

I guess Flash is the way to go, but it's really dispiriting that having invested so much time in learning HTML, that I realise I will have to bite the bullett and start to learn Flash.

But it does seem that in general IMO the 'sexiest' (do people still say that these days), most interesting, creative sites do use Flash, there's no getting away from it - providing it's used effectively.

On this last point I don't think simply using an elaborate animated intro is 'effective' use - I always press the 'skip intro' button - life's too short. But on the Tubes site example Flash is integral to the menu and the way the 'TV' interface works. I don't know if the guys did it themselves but it certainly has a pro feel to it. Whereas some of the other site examples given (and I'd include my own site) that rely purely on HTML say 'good amateur effort' to me.

In the short term I'll continue with HTML, but I guess I'll have to bite the bullett long term and learn Flash, ho hum, ho VERY hum...deep sigh!

Incidentaly, I understand that a new type of HTML is on the cards XHTML (?) in which a lot of the old tags will become obsolete, yet more work in future learning the new style HTML and revising the site - unless they make everything backwards compatible of course.

How tricky is Flash to learn? Are there 'painting by numbers' Flash packages to get you started? - Anyone?
 
WATYF said:
I'm gonna chime-in in defense of FrontPage. :p

...

I've done my website and my band's website using nothing but FrontPage.

WATYF

Nothing really impressive to see... nothing personal... it's just a very basic site. Would take about an hour to do in raw HTML code. Except for the cool java applet at the top of the main page which would take time to code... but you obviously didn't code that...

Now as for the music on your band's site... very impressive... when will the CD be released? I definitely want a copy.

- Tanlith -
 
Cool Page was cool back in the day, but after two years of college with my major as web design. I hate it. With all the stupid browsers and different versions, it's hard to make a site that will look the same for everybody. I have Microsoft Developer installed on this computer and I'm getting JavaScript errors. Cool Page alerts users with older browsers. They had to use stupid tags to align everything because of the drag and drop feature. Everything uses CSS Position Absolute. If a browser doesn't like CSS, you're screwed.
 
macromedia is really good about letting you try their software.

Why not download the flash trial and go through the lessons?
 
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