BIG guitars!!!

  • Thread starter Thread starter notredamer0789
  • Start date Start date
notredamer0789

notredamer0789

Nashville Rocker
Hey guys, we (my old band and I) just recently got out of the studio not too long ago mixing and mastering some new and old stuff and one of the techniques he (the engineer) used was to mic the gtr. amps, but he also split the signal and sent a couple of copies of the gtr. to ampfarm on pro tools. I am very aware of this method and use (well TRY) it in production at home. He overlayed 2 or 3 of the same gtrs. on one track to fatten it up. Thats the problem, I do that, BUT it doesnt sound near as great as his does. (KEEP IN MIND.. I do not have perc. in AND im using Izotope which is a fart in the wind compared to ampfarm {in my opinion}) I just don't get that right sound I am looking for..its prbly b/c of the way I mix them. Should i just bring a gtr. up at one time each (on fader) and play with the mix until I get that sound I want? Or is the trick in some sort of compression?

Thanks guys.

I know it's prbly obvious like: He had a full mix to work with sound wise or he has a VERY NICE PRO TOOLS HD set up and nice monitors to work with lol... but I appreciate the input anyways. :)
 
Samples

If you could post some samples of your mixes then I could take a listen.
Try www.lightningmp3.com to upload your music.

What style of music you playing?

Eck
 
Alright... it's not a full mix like I said only gtr. BUT maybe you can hear something. I am at work right now so i will post later. Thanks
 
notredamer0789 said:
I know it's prbly obvious like: He had a full mix to work with sound wise or he has a VERY NICE PRO TOOLS HD set up and nice monitors to work with lol... but I appreciate the input anyways. :)
Click to expand...

Actually ... I think it goes more like: This guy knew what the hell he was doing. :D

And you pretty much don't. Which is okay. Not knockin' ya or anything. But this guy has likely spent hours and hours of his life experimenting with different combinations of amps and DI'd / amp farm settings.

If you had to do it over again, I would recommend paying much closer attention to what he was doing, and bombarding / interrupting him with questions on how he's doing it and how it might be replicated, etc. Then go and lock yourself in your own "laboratory" for a few weekends and don't come out until you feel like you've got a good handle on the whole "Big Guitar" thing. :D

.
 
I've never used Pro Tools/Ampfarm, but I would be willing to bet there's a reasonable difference in quality between that and Izotope's amp simulator. It's not bad but I had a hard time getting good sounds when I worked with it.

Combine that with what Daisy said and it shouldn't be too hard to figure out why yours doesn't compare to his.
 
oh you are DEF. right about the experience thing. He has a band signed to Atlantic/Word Records, and hes been at it since he was 16 or so.. so he knows what hes doing and I don't so much lol. Thanks for the input guys I really respect and appreciate it.
 
notredamer0789 said:
Thanks for the input guys I really respect and appreciate it.
Click to expand...

Are you serious? How do you respect a bunch of replies that offered you no suggestions other than figure it out yourself... ..or he's better than you.. danny.guitar was the only one that responded with ANY info that may have been helpful.

I'm in the same situation with my mixing. I come to homerecording.com and into a forum about mixing/mastering and see this kind of response... Granted, there really wasn't a lot of info to work from on the original post, but surely there has to be some better advice people can give.

Sabbath
 
Constructive criticism, that's how this board works. It's also how audio engineering, and specifically getting better at it, works. You have to be realistic and take advice (in whatever form) to improve. I'm nowhere near happy with my recording sound, and I know it's just a case of practice rather than asking where the magic 'awesome' button is in Logic.

There's a lot of experience on this board, and pissing off the people in charge of it is never a good policy. That is all.
 
I just realize that, if you are nice to people--people (in turn) will be nice to you. I have learned almost EVERYTHING from mocking other people and trying new ways and learning on my own. I understand what advice they are shooting out there and i DO respect that. I am in NO position to tell someone what to do or that I am better than their advice, b/c simply put... I'm not. I do appreciate the direction people put me in to push myself to learn.
 
If you really want help, you'll post a sample of your mix/guitar sound, and even better if you also post the one done by the other guy. Otherwise, it's just a guessing game and it's impossible to give you any sort of specific advice.

http://www.lightningmp3.com
http://www.soundclick.com

There are a lot of places to post MP3s. ;)
 
Sabbathack said:
Are you serious? How do you respect a bunch of replies that offered you no suggestions other than figure it out yourself... ..or he's better than you.. danny.guitar was the only one that responded with ANY info that may have been helpful.

I'm in the same situation with my mixing. I come to homerecording.com and into a forum about mixing/mastering and see this kind of response... Granted, there really wasn't a lot of info to work from on the original post, but surely there has to be some better advice people can give.
Click to expand...

Sabbath, you should really go back and and actually read and think about the advice that you're so freely criticizing. Because it sounds like you could really use it and benefit from it.

Clearly, you don't "get it."

You're frustrated, because you believe there should be some simple answers. You're probably used to doing things a certain way and getting certain results. Everything logically progressing; starting point, method and end point. Certain inputs result in predictable outputs, etc. etc.

I hate to break it to ya, but you really gotta' throw all that thinking away! :D This ain't the matrix, where everything is governed by rules and logic. Recording and mixing is just totally F'ing messed up. If you're looking for prescribed methods and shortcuts, tips and/or "golden rules," and that's the kind of world you live in ... then you're going to grow some serious grey hairs in a short amount of time if recording and audio is your thing. :D

The engineer in question has been doing this since he was 16. To be able to take this guy's (possibly unorthodoxed and nuanced) methodology that he's likely developed over at least a decade of trial and error ... analyze it and paraphrase it all in to a simple message board post, easily digestible for the attention-deficitized crowd of today ...

... frankly it's insulting to the engineer in question. And it's insulting to anyone in the audio profession, frankly. It's insulting to even ask such a question, if you want my real opinion ... just as it's kind of insulting to insinuate that it's mostly attributable to his gear setup. And I say this because it trivializes what I'm guessing were hours upon hours this person has lost from his life obsessing over how to get a great recorded guitar tone.

.
 
Last edited:
Thanks Daisy for saying all the things I was gonna say. I will add only one comment.
Mixing is more ART than SCIENCE. It helps if you have a handle on the engineering part but when you step into the mastering suite it's more about what has happened between somebody's ears. That's the "art part"


chazba
 
A Tale of Two Newbies...

...and how one "got it" and the other didn't...

In any case, I apologize for the nasty and unnecessary remarks by some people, who have been duly chastised.
 
Then again, if you're a simple homerecorder like myself (and I suppose nearly everyone on this forum) it's a lot of fun to just play around with mixing things and doubling guitar tracks and whatnot.

It doesn't have to sound pro... but I'm always looking for some new ideas to experiment with.

For example...

I've just been trying to mic a guitar track, then also record the DI from my amp and pan them hard left and right. Makes it a lot better already. Next you go and tweak with some eq stuff (lows on the left, highs on the right, shit like that) and you just keep fiddling with it for a while. You can also put flanger on one of the tracks... or a little chorus on the other. Play around with some reverb... whatever sounds interesting

Now if there were more people that would just throw around some ideas for newbies like myself, instead the old 'you have to start mixing when you're 4 years old, and be a pro to get anything remotely decent'. Whatever! I'm just looking for some input to have some fun with my music. That's all.

I hope anyone will be willing to share a cool idea. Thanks.
 
Joepie said:
Then again, if you're a simple homerecorder like myself (and I suppose nearly everyone on this forum) it's a lot of fun to just play around with mixing things and doubling guitar tracks and whatnot.

It doesn't have to sound pro... but I'm always looking for some new ideas to experiment with.

For example...

I've just been trying to mic a guitar track, then also record the DI from my amp and pan them hard left and right. Makes it a lot better already. Next you go and tweak with some eq stuff (lows on the left, highs on the right, shit like that) and you just keep fiddling with it for a while. You can also put flanger on one of the tracks... or a little chorus on the other. Play around with some reverb... whatever sounds interesting

Now if there were more people that would just throw around some ideas for newbies like myself, instead the old 'you have to start mixing when you're 4 years old, and be a pro to get anything remotely decent'. Whatever! I'm just looking for some input to have some fun with my music. That's all.

I hope anyone will be willing to share a cool idea. Thanks.
Click to expand...

This is what I'm thinking the original poster was referring to. Putting big space by panning hard L-R sounds like what the guy did. Double tracked (not simply stereo mic placement) then panned far apart. Gives the BIG guitar sound. --at least it's worked for me in the past.
 
What I've always done to achieve big guitars is two mics on the amplifier and then layering parts. Its a little harder to do on clean/slightly overdriven guitar since the notes are very distinguishable. However, on distorted guitars, you can layer it really nice and then pan them out to give that big sound. I'll post a sample of what I've done later.

Usually on clean guitars I like to keep one layer and then putting a chorus effect or expander on it to bring it up more in the mix.
 
Personally, the most effective way to get a "big guitar" effect is to give a Martin dreadnaught to a dainty female folk singer on a stool. I never cared for that look myself.

Or did you mean sound-wise...?

:D

G.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top