Best mics for micing guitar amps?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Massimo
  • Start date Start date
Well like I said in an earlier post, I'm getting a better recorder soon. I'll try again with my SM57 and then after I've tried everything and if I'm still not happy then I'll think about getting a better mic, a condenser most likely. I know the dynamics do just fine but fine isn't really what I'm after, I'm after great. So I just got to try a new approach.
 
Massimo said:
Ok all you master recorders, I need some advice. What's a good mic for recording an electric guitar amp? I have a SM57 mic which I've been using but I notice it doesn't capture the amps true sound. I want something that going to capture the sound as close as possible. Would a condenser mic be better?

Also, while I'm on the subject, what is a good position to position the mic from the amp? I've been putting it a couple of inches from the speaker. I guess that's the standard way of doing it.

Here's the gear I'm recording

Gibson Studio and Fender Strat, through a Fender Deluxe Amp.

Thanks in advance!

Massimo
Click to expand...
Sennheiser MD421. ;)
 
I started on a new project last night and played around a little.

1 guitar is a Tele through a Peavey Bandit and I miced it with an AT814. This mic is very similar to an SM58 but a little "fuller" in a head to head comparison. I haven't seen another one but found some info online.

The other guitar is a Telecaser throgh a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe. I put an Oktava MK319 on that one.

I'm really liking these MK319s. I get a lot of mileage out of them.
 
Tube amp to a 4x12 cabinet, turn volume and gain up loud

place a sure SM57 on a stand,
put the mic right up against the mesh speaker protecter,
with the mic parallel to the floor (level)
point the mic at the deep corner of the inner ring of the speaker

place a condenser mike about 3 or 4 feet away at standing up ear level, aimed at the center of the cabinet.

run the mics into two different channels, have someone stand in the sound booth and slowly move the condensor mic back or forth while you listen in the control room for distortion and phasing, find the optimum placement

Usually the 57 will get you what you need, but this way you have a little flavor to add in with it if necessary



http://www.soundclick.com/bands/9/ragsclothesbottlesmusic.htm
 
Massimo-

Sorry it took so long to reply. Scinx has said that he doesn't think the C1 is flat... and I would agree. In fact, in my first post I said:

"The C2000B is probably the most natural sounding while the C1000, the NT1 and the C1 all have more characteristic mid or high frequency peaks, which can be nice for certain clean guitar sounds."

Though in all fairness, I should not have mentioned the more peaky ones because your initial request was:

"I want something that going to capture the sound as close as possible. "

I just also got some good results from them, so I mentioned tham anyway. Some would say you shouldn't use use them... well, fine.

I also said that the condenser mikes are meant to be more accurate than dynamic mikes. I said this because condenser microphones, just because of how they are designed, are able to follow the soundwaves coming from an instrument (this is called transient response) more closely than dynamic mikes . This does not neccesarily mean that their frequency response is more accurate.

Yes, if you want flat, get a measurement mic (which is a mic made for the purpose of having a flat frequency response). But there are also many mikes that are relatively close to flat that are easily found in catalogs or stores. The Shure KSM 32 is one of those. But it's probably out of your price range ($600).

I would agree that the sm57 and other dynamics can work on guitar amps, but you said you want to record something that sounds like it does coming out of your amp. So I told you what you want:

1. A condenser mic- this gives you more accurate transient response than dynamic

2. A mic with a very close to flat frequency response

3. Placement of the mic at a distance that allows for a more natural sounding pickup (too close is not representative of the actual speaker sound)

People might try to convince you that you're not getting an accurate sound with an sm57 because you're not pointing it the right way, but they're wrong. The sm57 is meant to have a very particular sound, good or bad. For one, the bass frequencies roll off starting at 200 Hz and there's a 6dB peak at 6 kHz. This mic warps reality for a very particular purpose.

Of course you might just think you want accurate recording of miced guitar. You might hear it recorded and understand why everybody seems to like that 6dB peak at 6 kHz. But I would suggest you get a fairly flat condenser mic, play around with it and see what you think of it.
 
Thanks again noground

I've been doing my own little research by going to the AKG and Shure websites and looking up their recomendations for guitar amp micing. According to the AKG they recommend a C3000 for guitar amps, something about it's SPL being able to withstand very loud intruments. The C1000 and C2000 were recommended for wind instruments, piano, acoustic guitar, cymbals and room recording of electric guitars.

At the Shure website most of their condenser mics weren't recommended for guitar amps except for one of their higher end mics I forgot which one but it was either the KSM32 or KSM44. Like at the AKG site most of the Shure's condenser mics were recommended for wind instruments, piano, acoustic guitar and drums cymbals. I do remember reading about the "Flat" term but I didn't know what that meant. This is all new to me. I have no idea what the impedence means and all the other stuff except for the frequency range which is self explanatory.

So to tell you the truth my head is spinning a little with all this stuff. I didn't realize it was going to be so difficult. But I do know I would like a condenser mic for a variety of recording purposes but one important one would be recording my electric guitar and another would be for room recording of a jam session.

But narrowing it down I'm thinking about the AKG C2000B, C3000 or the Shure KSM27 maybe even a Shure SM81 I'm still not really sure to tell you the truth. There are some good deals on ebay for all of these mics.

I also know why people mentioned they liked the Sennheiser e609 it has a higher frequency range 40-18Hz than the SM57 40-15Hz also the MD21 has a nice Frequency range of 30-17Hz

Anymore input would be appreciated.
 
Massimo,

Dynamic mikes are pretty much the standard with guitar amps, especially the sm57. people use that on everything. I don't really get it, but to each his own.

Don't worry too much about what you get. Just get a good deal. All the mikes you listed will work fine for your purposes. There are thousands out there and you really don't need to spend more than $100-$200 to get something that will sound fine for a lot of purposes. And you've already got a 57 which apparently works well on everything (I must admit I like it sometimes too). good luck!
 
Hey,
More natural may or may not be what you are after. For example, at the bottom of this article:

http://www.clapton-online.com/clapton/mags/gp0601/ecgp0601.html

The sound engineer for Eric Clapton describes his setup for recording this guitar wizard. He uses expensive mics, of course, but I found it most intersting how he described the blending of the different mic sounds. It seems that he chose microphones and placements that gave him ultimate control during mixing. If the sound was to bright, then he may bring up the fader for the SM57 to even out the treble a little.

The point is: ONE of the most prominent guitar players in the world is using three mics to record his amp. According to his engineer, these mics all have different characteristics, which when placed and blended correctly, give optimum results. None of the mics listed in the article are "natural" sounding mics.

It is also important to note that the SM57 (a $80+/- mic), is used in Eric's setup. It produces a certain tone that is desirable for his style of music, regardless of price. I own one and I love it! I haven't tried that many mics on my old Fender Princeton Reverb, but the SM57 works great for me. Get this, I've even used the same setup to record vocals, with mixed results.

Your style of music will dictate your choices.

I recently acquired enough money to make some upgrades and I decided to get some mics. I mainly record bossa nova (brasilian jazz), but I also play blues and rock. I started researching, hoping to find a quick answer and get the mic right away....wrong! The further I dug, the dirtier my hands got. Everybody has a different opinion! Nobody can give you YOUR answer. I decided to use a combination of things to make my decision. My own ears (if possible, and they're not well trained yet), a round average of LOTS of opinions, and :) price.

I highly recommend that you spend some time on this and read Harvey Gerst's BIG mic thread. There are also some other great link here for choosing a mic.

http://www.freewebs.com/tekker/harveygerstmicthreads.htm

It is important to know the difference between a dynamic and a condenser when choosing a mic. The above link will help you understand why and give you some insight on mic placement.
 
Thanks everybody (noground), thanks freeztar for the article, interesting reading.

So it seems to get that pro sound it takes more than a simple SM57 or e609, makes sense because these mics have a limited frequency range. Having a couple of mics placed in different locations, dynamic and condenser fills the gaps and adds more life to the recording.

I found the Shure website pretty helpful with their recommendations and info on guitar amp micing. Anyway this is what I came up with for low to medium budget mics for best recording a guitar cabinet.

These are according to the recommendations at each website for guitar amp micing.

Shure SM57 Dynamic
Shure SM94 Condenser
Shure KSM27 Studio Condenser

AKG C3000 Condenser

Sennheiser e609 Dynamic
Sennheiser MD421 Dynamic

These are just a couple of recommendations I have come up with. There are plenty other mics out there that can do the job also.

Not mentioned from the manufacturer but mentioned here were

The AKG C1000 and the C2000 as well as a couple of others.

Well thanks again to everybody for their input and thanks to this great website it's been a lot of help.


Massimo
 
Oh, I should add I didn't come up with all of this stuff on my own. Got to give credit to noground and the others here who were so kind in helping me.

Mas
 
Massimo said:
Thanks everybody (noground), thanks freeztar for the article, interesting reading.

So it seems to get that pro sound it takes more than a simple SM57 or e609, makes sense because these mics have a limited frequency range. Having a couple of mics placed in different locations, dynamic and condenser fills the gaps and adds more life to the recording.

I found the Shure website pretty helpful with their recommendations and info on guitar amp micing. Anyway this is what I came up with for low to medium budget mics for best recording a guitar cabinet.

These are according to the recommendations at each website for guitar amp micing.

Shure SM57 Dynamic
Shure SM94 Condenser
Shure KSM27 Studio Condenser

AKG C3000 Condenser

Sennheiser e609 Dynamic
Sennheiser MD421 Dynamic

These are just a couple of recommendations I have come up with. There are plenty other mics out there that can do the job also.

Not mentioned from the manufacturer but mentioned here were

The AKG C1000 and the C2000 as well as a couple of others.

Well thanks again to everybody for their input and thanks to this great website it's been a lot of help.


Massimo
Click to expand...
Your welcome... good luck, take care and have fun... oh, and you should move the Sennheiser MD421 to the top of your amp mic list. ;)
 
Update..

Just got a new, well used Korg D1200, digital recorder. Recorded guitar with SM57 results were better with this recorder, probably because of the 3 way EQ and Frequency dial. There's definitely room for improvement, I got my eye out for a Shure KSM27! Then we'll see.

Peace love and chicken wings
 
I'd consider looking at the Audio Technica 4040. I recently compared it alongside the KSM27 and there was no comparison in my mind. Compared to the AT4040, the KSM27 sounded shrill and was WAY colder (less hot, i.e. lower volume). They are about the same price, so it was an easy decision for me (mine is being shipped right now, I'll let you know how I like it). BTW, the AT4040 also blew away the other 6 mics I tested in this price range. Just a thought.
 
I always swore by my sm57, but my band played a show 3 weeks ago and the club which normally used sm57's on my cab used a Sennheiser e609 this time... I was so impressed with the sound I bought one. I prefer it over the 57 for guitar amps now
 
Senn. 421's are very good ya can't go wrong with one of them....
Shure SM 57..
Blue Baby Bottle is pretty nice for some stuff..Its a little on the hot side..so you gotta pad it quite a bit in my experience..
At 4033 can get you some really nice results
I really like The Oktava ML19{older ribbon}To tame briter amps like say a Roland JC 120
AEA R84 is very nice..kinda mic you just plant in front of a amp and forget..nice and smooth..almost effortless..
Royer R121 like the R84 with a different voice a little more foward in the upper mids and top..excellent also..






Don
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top