Behringer MX3282A or MX9000?

[earworm]

i find this sad,
going for the looks? DUDE, after a few years the faders will start falling off, channels WILL stop working, gains will stop working, PPM meters will die, buttons will crack and break in two

why do i say this? i've been using a 9000 for a while (not in my studio!!) and well, the sound quality is nice, but hell i WILL ALWAYS REFUSE TO BUY this thing !!!

the looks? maaaaaaaannnnn...you'll be throwing this mixer out of your window in a few years from now,
i impress my musicians with my tiny soundcraft M8, sounds great,
but next to my M8 i got my old studiomaster which LOOKS IMPRESSIVE but doesn't sound that amazing (anymore, its old)
and i just tell the band that i even used to have a 24 channel mixer, sold it cause it didn't sound too good....(PS, those studiomaster mixers i worked with were like 20 years old, the other 10 and EVERY SINGLE BUTTON WAS STILL IN PERFECT SHAPE !!!!!!impossible with berrie gear!!!!!!!)

music is about SOUND, you wanna impress? go stand on a podium or make amazing records, what if the band asks you after they receive their cd:
"how come it doesn't sound so totally amazing, its recorded on a huge mixer, no?"

the next mixer i'll buy will be the Allen and heath mixwizard,
16 channels of real nice quality, right now i'm even more impressed with my M8 pre's than with my joemeek vc8 and my symetrix 528 !!
so i wonder, what kind of outboard pre's will you buy then, if you really want to upgrade the sound, you'll need to spend AS MUCH OR MORE on ONE PRE as you paid for your behringer!


let me repeat it again, go for quality, hang basstraps on your walls, built a cheap'n'easy vocal booth (mine costed me around €150 and it impresses people)

 

[Renascent]

Why is everyone harping on the looks comment? It's seriously a nanothought in the back of my mind I just thought I'd mention because I was listing things. I'm not trying to do anything here but create good sounding music, I'm just as big of an audiojunkie as everyone else here.. so please dont get side tracked commenting about the silly looks thing i said.
It turns out this thread has made it much more difficult. while I haven't really gotten the kind of responses i was looking for, i really do appriciate the ones ive gotten (thanks again guys) perhaps the smartest thing for me to do is to find a mixer of lesser channels, but with the ability to add another identical mixer later on for extra channels. does this make sense? Maybe a 14channel mackie, or a 16 channel mackie? I'm still skeptical about behringer, I was hoping to get some more folks with personal experience with these mixers though so if you've ever used one please continue to give feedback on what you thought about them!
Thanks again everyone
scott

 

[Dr ZEE]

It seems like there's some confusion about quality VS features.

There's no confusion here. It's no brainer. If you NEED features and got very little cash - the way to get the gear with desired features is to 'compromise' on some qualities. The choice you make must be REASONABLE and rather based on real experience data.
I hear/read all over the place unreasonable unfavorable remarks about equipment with lower price tags. And as well I hear/read load of unreasonable favorable remarks about high-priced equipment.

having a large in-expensive mixer of any brand doesn't look more professional...

heh heh, not true, actually... because, just for the look of it - yes, it does, if the look means a sh*t to anyone. But it is NONSENSE at the end, because look is look .... it's all that is

... infact, it can do the opposite if your clients know anything about gear.

I guess, you mean the look of 'Large Behringer Mixing console' may do the opposite? Right? The negative 'impression effect' on your clients that is? Right?
Okey. Here's what I can tell.
First of all: "What Clients?" are we talking here about. Are we discussing home recording studio? Or what are we talking about? Who's confused here?
OK. I guess, it is possible to build a home studio, which would be used not just by owner ( for recording and producind his/her own or his/her band's tracks/albums/demos or what ever musical/audio material), but also for ather musicians - clients that is.
Now, if! you will be able to manage to attract some 'clients' who would prefer your private basement home studio over a commercial recording facility, then good chances are they have NO clue (or are careless) about gear. And thus, a large mixing board of any brand will sure impress the hell out of them . So that would be a good strategy
On the other hand, a client, who sees "Behringer" brand in the rack and gets negative impression right on the spot IS NOT really a knowledgeable client, but rather is impressionable one Knowledgeable clients (individuals in general) are very hard to impress (neagatively or positively) with anything, period.

/respects

 

[Dr ZEE]

Why is everyone harping on the looks comment?
scott

that's a word game really
You see, you say "It looks more professional" simply meaning that it looks like it has more professional features. That's how I read it ...
It's not about the LOOK per say ...
but then again... if it was about look. Hah hah , as I've said, it DOES look more "professional" .... simply 'cos it's larger and has more things on it ...LOL

/respects

 

[Renascent]

Thanks Doc

You hit the nail on the head though. I'm not really going to be trying to attract clients in any way other than word of mouth through friends and such.
For example, there is a large "hardcore" band scene around here. I usually goto the shows as something to do, and since I do that, a majority of the musicians/promoters know who i am. When I brought up the possiblity of a simple basement "studio" to record reference demos and maybe a couple "first time" CD's for distribution at shows, they were loving the idea. Also, sound quality isn't a HUGE deal with alot of these guys because theyre mostly hosting their songs on purevolume and myspace, and audio players on those two sites are anything but sub par, let alone decent.
As it is, there's a kid charging 75bucks for 3 song's, mixed and "mastered".. he's recording in his house, no accoustical treatment, no good mics, using a pirated version of protools and I dont think he has very much knowledge based on the quality of the demo's. In his defense, it's a nice little deal he has going I just feel like I could do better, and since I'm going to school for this stuff I'd love to be exposed to it as much as possible. No better way to learn than to DO IT right?

I hope this clears up my intentions a little bit. Like i said, for the most part this is an extremely budgeted project. I make anywhere from $250-400 a week depending on jobs/hours so a $1000+ mixing console might not be in the cards for me right now. I was just seeing if there were any alternatives before I started peddling drugs or something to get what I need

cheers!
Scott

 

[Dr ZEE]

... I'm not really going to be trying to attract clients in any way other than word of mouth through friends and such...

I would refuse to refer musicians, who would ask me to record/produce for them in my basement studio via word of mouth through friends and such, as clients, whether or not it was done for a buck or two or just for another nice pair of words of mouth. I would call them The guys, I've made records for (like in Julio and Willie 's duet - To All The Girls I've Loved Before - ) Also such "business" success is all about "who you are" and has very little to do with what you have. It's no 'clearly' business, really imho...
Also, in regards to gear/setup and making decision on what gear/brand to buy, there is big difference between setting up personal home recording studio and professional (or say semi-professional) recording studio, simply because the goals are DIFFERENT.
Personal (private, home) recording studio's goal is - to independently self-produce your own tracks/records/audio-material.
Personal (private) home-studio also gets a privilege of HAVING NO goal (or, say, no mission) what so ever, if the owner chooses it to be that way .
By its own definition, Pro(semi-pro) studio's goal is hard and clear, which is - to maintain sufficiency and profitability. One may say also: "Customer satisfaction is The Goal". I'd say: Customer satisfaction is not the goal, really, but rather is a 'proven method', used in achieving and maintaining the desireble level of profitability (That's why, for example, a leather couch is a common component of a pro-studio set-up. It's there not just for a look. It's there for a purpose )

/respects

 

[earworm]

""a kid using a pirated version of protools ""

ehm...so i assume that also his hardware is warezd?

now, instead of dissing behringer any further i'll say something positive too,
i managed to impress people with only TALK !
there's a few bands that came over here or sent me their mixes only cause we talked, they just asked me "hey dude, you can record stuff"? and i gave them real Long explanations on how i work, what equipment i use, i tell them stories about how the recording with previous bands went,
and they emediately notice that i'm not a total amateur,
and when they walk in my bedroom they have no idea what it will look like, they just trust me cause they know that i know what i'm talking about...
and then i show them my mixers, first the big studiomaster and i tell them:
this one is pretty old, i use it as a backup but it doesn't sound FAR as good as this tiny soundcraft,
and people go like "whooo, cool, such a tiny mixer sounds better than the one thats twice as big? amaaaazing!"

and in the end....the music will end up on a cd, fans won't see pictures of the equipment, the only thing they'll say is:
sounds good or sounds bad (or they'll say its OK if they don't wanna hurt you )

oh, and i record 10 inputs at a time, so actually a 48 channel mixer isn't necesarry for me... so thats what i'd suggest for you,
a 16 channel mixer, even less channels might do, hehe, and make sure you got a cable (i prefer snakes) connected to EVERY single in and output of the mixer, plug everything to your patchbays, show that to the musicians, they'll look at it like: "WOW MAN, all those cables, you know where they're going?"

and you say:


yeah

 

[Dr ZEE]

i find this sad,... DUDE, after a few years the faders will start falling off, channels WILL stop working, gains will stop working, PPM meters will die, buttons will crack and break in two

non of this BS is going to start happenning. BS that is. Sorry, dude... you've made it up...but it's alright... Made up 'stories' aren't so uncommon.

why do i say this? i've been using a 9000 for a while (not in my studio!!) and well, the sound quality is nice, but hell i WILL ALWAYS REFUSE TO BUY this thing !!!)

so have you actually experienced falling off faders, non-working channels, non-working gain knobs, deal meters, cracked buttons?
Have you?
I don't think you have. But you can say what ever. It will not do a thing to me personally, cos I know what the deal with Behringer console ( 9+ years in use and still going well).
The problem is, that guys who have no experience with specific gear, may need and DO need advice or practical information from guys who happened to have and have experience with that specific gear. But instead they may end up reading made-up stories or flat out baseless yet extremely passionate opinions. And such "opinion" then being taken as truth. And That's what really IS sad.
I see this kind of stuff happening all the time. Pissing me off from time to time.
arghhh, anyway.

btw,

and people go like "whooo, cool, such a tiny mixer sounds better than the one thats twice as big? amaaaazing!"

Do they really? I mean do these people really go like that? Is that how they get "amaaaaazed"?
OKEY, man, I mean, dude, - if this sh*t really did happen (or does happen from time to time) between you and your "clients" in your badroom (meaning if you did not make this one up), I'll tell Ya' - this IS funny ... I'm laughing, here I go : HA HA HAH HA HAH HA.... , not with you thou...but at you, actually more specifically - at your "clients" ..., ok?
Yeah, I mean, you've got SOME clients there
ok

/respects

 

[earworm]

ok guy,
i'm gonn take pictures of it and prove it,
the console i'm talking about is only a few years old and its used 10 hours a day, 6 days a week,
the things i described actually happened, its no bullshit, might be hard to believe, but its a FACT, in that same studio there's a bunch of compressors, the only ones that DONT work anymore are the behringer units,
maybe its typically me, every behringer unit i meet has SEVERE errors (exept my little mx602 i used to have)
the sonic quality of behringer is OK untill the buttons start making noise, even if you don't touch them, and after that the buttons/channels/functions will stop working,

ok, i admit one thing, "the faders that fall off", i mean, thats not something extreme, its just the plastic "buttons" on the faders that come off after a while, but all the other things i described are exactly as i said


hehe, and i find your reply funny, cause i think i stepped on your toes there, but i'm not exagerating, i DO have clients, most of them are pretty stupid beginners but hell, they play music so thats great, and yeah, some of them do say WHOAAA and stuff, but not in english, they say it in flemmish, sounds like

WRHAAAAOEE

and ehm...i don't know what your problem is, you're kinda saying that all i'm saying is made up bs... and thats like a personal attack...tssss,
can i help it that all the equipment i used works fine EXEPT the behringer stuff? and eventhough i'm a young guy i do have years of experience in recording and live pa, i don't make up stories just to diss behringer, i say what i see and hear

 

[Dr ZEE]

i don't know what your problem is, you're kinda saying that all i'm saying is made up bs... and thats like a personal attack...tssss,

Personal attack? give me a break.
I am quoting you. Nothing to do with you personally. It's all about what you are saying and how you are saying it:

...DUDE, after a few years the faders will start falling off, channels WILL stop working, gains will stop working, PPM meters will die, buttons will crack and break in two...

I could take it simply as a sort of 'joke', or satiric way of expressing yourself in regard to Mr. mx9000 ...then it's fine

What my problem is? I've said what my problem is:

The problem is, that guys who have no experience with specific gear, may need and DO need advice or practical information from guys who happened to have and have experience with that specific gear. But instead they may end up reading made-up stories or flat out baseless yet extremely passionate opinions. And such "opinion" then being taken as truth. And That's what really IS sad.
I see this kind of stuff happening all the time. Pissing me off from time to time.

Your statement (which I quote above), IS an expression of baseless yet extremely passionate opinion
I asked you a question:

have you actually experienced falling off faders, non-working channels, non-working gain knobs, dead meters, cracked buttons?

So? Have you?
You've said:

ok, i admit one thing, "the faders that fall off", i mean, thats not something extreme, its just the plastic "buttons" on the faders that come off after a while, but all the other things i described are exactly as i said

So I take it as:
The mx9000 console, which you happened to work with for some time at some studio, had some non-working channels, some non-working gain knobs, some dead meters and some cracked buttons (also as I'd understand, those buttons have just cracked ...like , let's say, you pushed the button and ..ooops, it just cracked under your finger...right?).
I am asking this again to make it clear, what exactly your experience is (was).

/respects

 

[earworm]

well i was working on this 24 channel mix and i couldn't turn up the gain of channel 22, the gain button didn't react to any movement,
annoying thing is that the leds of the ppm meter of subgroup 1 started to "fall out", and after a while there were no lights in it anymore,
the cracked buttons, thats not one, but several (and sadly each month a few more) routing buttons to send the signal to the busses, they just crack in two, first you see a little crack in the middle of the button, and after a while you can stick your finger nail in it, and even later you can move the "left and right part" of it... and that sucks, its not one button, i'm affraid that in the end all te routing buttons will end up like this, and there's a bad contact in sub 2, which sometimes goes away if you move the fader alot, so mostly i don't use that one or i gotto be lucky that it really works,
these things just happened, its not that someone threw the mixer on the ground or something (its built in a very big desc), its just month after month that we start noticing more failures and i really don't like that,
about the berrie composers in that studio, one of the units: left channel started making noise if you don't even touch the buttons (schshcfiehhwerrrssh) , and the right channel just totally stopped working, for no reason actually, just one day./..dead

and sorry if some of the stuff i wrote sounded offensive, guess i got a little temper

 

[Dr ZEE]

well i was working on this 24 channel mix and i couldn't turn up the gain of channel 22, the gain button didn't react to any movement,
annoying thing is that the leds of the ppm meter of subgroup 1 started to "fall out", and after a while there were no lights in it anymore,
the cracked buttons, thats not one, but several (and sadly each month a few more) routing buttons to send the signal to the busses, they just crack in two, first you see a little crack in the middle of the button, and after a while you can stick your finger nail in it, and even later you can move the "left and right part" of it... and that sucks, its not one button, i'm affraid that in the end all te routing buttons will end up like this, and there's a bad contact in sub 2, which sometimes goes away if you move the fader alot, so mostly i don't use that one or i gotto be lucky that it really works,
these things just happened, its not that someone threw the mixer on the ground or something (its built in a very big desc), its just month after month that we start noticing more failures and i really don't like that,
about the berrie composers in that studio, one of the units: left channel started making noise if you don't even touch the buttons (schshcfiehhwerrrssh) , and the right channel just totally stopped working, for no reason actually, just one day./..dead

and sorry if some of the stuff i wrote sounded offensive, guess i got a little temper

From my experience I can 'report' that pot failure is not so uncommon for Behringer mixers. I never had any completely 'dead channel', but yes, sometimes you'd need to tweak back/forward a pot to 'make it work'. I also am talking here about occurrences of such events during the exploitation of the mixer after about five years or so since it was purchased new. That's why I can conclude that Behringer's components ARE NOT top quality. But as I've noted from the very begining - it does justify the price tag.
I also had Mackie VLZ mixers (I had two different - one small 12chnl and one rack-mounted for keyboards/synth submixing) , and I can tell that, the componets on Mackies DO feel like much better quality , yes, I mean you actually 'feel it' as you move/tweak , but both mixers after few years WERE NOT 'scratchy sound free' as you tweak on-the-fly.
So what I am saying here is: you can reasonably devote some 'problems' that may occur specifically to the Brand, and then identify them (and present, if you wish) as Behringer's native failures .... REASONABLY! - that is, you see....

I never experienced meter failure of any kind on any mixer I've ever had... so can't say a thing about it.

Now, as for 'cracked in two buttons' ... geeeeeeee, no way - I don't buy it, unless I actually SEE IT happening. This just does not seem possible.

okey, later,
/respects

 

[Treeline]

First figure out if you really need an 8-buss mixer. Ask yourself what you HAVE to do that you can't do with a 4-buss unit. If you can't answer that question, then drop the 8-buss thing for now and your options just opened up a lot - including into the Yamaha MG series, which isn't too shabby for the price range. You could manage an okay mixer for this kind of money.

The other thing, it seems, is to play devil's advocate about how many tracks you really need flying at once. Is it necessary to have 24 or 32 faders? Or is that simply what you want? It took me a long time to get past that one. The answer is going to be in how creative you can get with submixes and multitracking. The fewer tracks you have cutting at once, the more quality you can get for a given dollar.

 

[MISTERQCUE]

I'm not set on behringer, in fact I would never buy anything behringer exept I read nothing but great reviews on these 2 particular products.
I'll check out the carvin! Thanks
Scott

Can you most kindly provide links to these "GREAT REVIEWS" of the 2 pieces of sh#t from Behringer?

I am interested as to whom would tout these horrid products!

 

[Dr ZEE]

Can you most kindly provide links to these "GREAT REVIEWS" of the 2 pieces of sh#t from Behringer?

I am interested as to whom would tout these horrid products!

My guess MISTERQCUE was refering to some reviews which you can find at on-line retailers (like www.musiciansfrind.com ) ... you can read 'user reviews of the product there and post your own.
harmony-central has couple mx9000 reviews... there may be some otheres somwhere.
What do these or any other 'reviews' mean? Hard to say really. If you see allots of reviews one way or the other ...that sure may make you think about whether the product is good or bad.... but you really never know, based on 'user reviews' imho.

 

[MISTERQCUE]

My guess MISTERQCUE was refering to some reviews which you can find at on-line retailers (like www.musiciansfrind.com ) ... you can read 'user reviews of the product there and post your own.
harmony-central has couple mx9000 reviews... there may be some otheres somwhere.
What do these or any other 'reviews' mean? Hard to say really. If you see allots of reviews one way or the other ...that sure may make you think about whether the product is good or bad.... but you really never know, based on 'user reviews' imho.

I base my anti-behringer statements via actual use and being highly disappointed!


Yo' Zee, I like your site!

Pretty cool!

 

[Treeline]

Behringer-bashing is a bit of a hobby on the board, but QQ speaks from experience, having bought a lot of the gear. I've had mixed results myself, but I do use a little B mixer as a patchbay and it has turned out to be a decent signal splitter for a couple of subwoofers. The thing is, it cost me about fifty bucks. What can you expect for the price?

Where Behringer makes enemies is in people who believe what they want to believe. So the gear looks great and specs out well. When it sounds harsh or breaks after two years, they get pissed, forgetting that it was the lowest priced unit in the market when they bought it. And worse is the feeling of a guy who blows a whole bunch of money on B gear and gets discouraged because the mixes still sound tinny. Sometimes the problem IS the gear.

I'm convinced that if Behringer promised less, people would be drooling over their products. They meet a definite need - but the gear tends to be disposable. Just make sure your expectations are in line with the product.

 

[joel77]

Scott,

I've got a used Carvin C2444, 24 channel mixer I'm looking to sell. If you're interested, let me know.

Joel

 

[joel77]

Actually Scott, there's a Carvin mixer presently on eBay that may better fit your needs. It's their 24/8 mixer with a meter bridge. I'd post a link, but can't seem to figure out how to do that on this forum. Do a search on eBay. Look for Carvin 24/8 in the title.

Joel

PS. I've used both Behringer and Carvin mixers and in my opinion, Carvin has a much better sound!

 

[Renascent]

Hey guys
I'm a complete loser. I've decided to go with a Presonus firepod. It makes more sense to me for right now. Why the complete change in heart? Well, 3 days of agonizing over the whole descision on the mixer and that seemed to fit me best. You guys are right. I'm probably not going to record much more than 8 channels at once. I don't need an analog mixer because I'm recording to comp.. eventually I will go analog because my heart is analog ( ha!) and because i'd like to eventually (money permitting) be able to use reels and tapes and such.
The other nice thing is, I can bring my mac and rack with my compressors/firepod/any other rackmounted stuff to wherever and record if it fits the bill. I am.. the king of randomness. I appriciate your time and help, minus the word-fight in the middle. Thanks for your time guys
Scott