Beatles Sounding Recordings

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crawdad

crawdad

Dammit, Jim, Shut Up!
I am doing a corporate project which is supposed to emulate the sound of the Beatles in four different eras. Gasp. The songs are loosely based on I Wanna Hold Your Hand, Revolution (the single), Sgt Peppers Reprise and Come Together.

I will be going after guitar, bass vocal and drum sounds primarily. I will be recording a track at a time. I have been listening to the actual recordings for a long time, noticing that the defining character of most songs is in the midrange. Not really much high end. Since I don't own any of that vintage gear, does anybody have any sugestions as to how I might approach dialing in some of these sounds?

For mics, I have a V67, V93, AT 4033, Octava 219 and Octava 012. Also a Shure SM57. For pres, I have a Meek MQ3, Behringer VX2000 and a couple of ART Tube MPs. In the effects department, I have lots of verbs and delays, etc. I will be recording 16 bit into a computer DAW.

I think this will be fun and a learning experience. Any thoughts, opinions or ideas would be greatly appreciated.
 
Some ideas:

* Use the ART's whenever possible - particularly on guitars, which you should record very dry.

* Lots of shakers and tamborine panned hard left or right.

* Close mic drums with minimal mics in a very deadened accoustic space.

* Use slapback delay on vocals. Layer the harmonies.

* Use lots of hard-panning during mixdown.
 
I know you haven't asked for gear recommendations...
Still, let me point you to the telefunken V276 micpre.
It's the solid state heir of the famous V76 tube pres used extensively at abbey road.
Normally, you wouldn't have to pay more than around $ 200.00.

Besides that I have to second chessrocks advice on the room. Often, the importance of the acoustic environment is neglected.
So: Put those old carpets on the wall...

I'd be very curious to hear your results. IMHO, the seargent pepper recordings are among the best ever made...

Best of luck.


Michael
 
I'm not sure you need other mics than the ones you have, but maybe you'd want to check out the ADK A51sc (the small diaphragm one). I tried it on drums and the sound was surprisingly rich with not very much top end. I ended up not buying it since it wasn't what I was looking for at the time, but some day I will surely get it.

Otherwise, what I would try first when it comes to drums would be to just place one mic (one of the large diaphragm ones you have) in front of the drum kit in a deadened room.

Also, if the Meek's compressor is anything like their more expensive ones, I'd use it as much as possible, particularly on bass and acoustic guitar (if you're using one of those).

I'm far from an expert, but this it what comes to my mind.

Cheers
/Henrik
 
Check out from the library George Martin's book All You Need Is Ears.It has a wealth of technical details about how he produced the Beatles.I bet it would come in real handy on this project.
Tom
 
Lots of good suggestions...

I agree with Chessrock's list. What I would add to it is this: Paul's bass playing is very busy and stacatto. Almost like a lead instrument. He used a pick, too. I think it's a Huge part of the Beatle sound, especially the early years, and easy to overlook.
If anyone has ideas on the eq'ing, I'd like to hear it. To me it sounds much of the low is cut and maybe a lot of mid boost.
 
this is an easy question:

Mics- a couple of u47s, u67s
Pres- some telefunken v72s for the early stuff, and perhaps an emi tg console for abbey road, let it be.
outboard-fairchild compressor/limiter, emi tg limiter
dont forget the old tape delay machines...

contrary to popular belief, putting carpet on the walls wont give you abbey road studio 2. The room was originally designed for orchestral works, so build yourself a room big enough to hold an orchestra and then some. Of course you'll need to design it using the mindset and materials of the 1950s...and dont forget the wood floors.

oh and you'll need a george martin behind the controls...

post your results when your finished...I'd be very interested in hearing the beatles sound through a few art pres and some sub-300 dollar mics...
 
Pauls bass sounds varied through the years. Run down to the store and pick up an old hofner for the early stuff and abbey road, let it be. And you'll need a rickenbacker for revolver to magical mystery tour and some of the white album. Low-mids often dominated his bass and he had a very articulate attack since he played with a plectrum.

To get an approximation of Paul's bass try this eq setting:

boost at 80-100hz by 2-3db

cut 12-18hz by 6db using your hig-shelving eq

Or for a similiar sound with a little more warmth try:

a boost in the 80hz range by a few dbs

then boost 500hz by 6db or so

cut 300hz by 3db

cut 12hz by 6db

this will help
 
Scriabin said:
this is an easy question:

Mics- a couple of u47s, u67s
Pres- some telefunken v72s for the early stuff, and perhaps an emi tg console for abbey road, let it be.
outboard-fairchild compressor/limiter, emi tg limiter
dont forget the old tape delay machines...

contrary to popular belief, putting carpet on the walls wont give you abbey road studio 2. The room was originally designed for orchestral works, so build yourself a room big enough to hold an orchestra and then some. Of course you'll need to design it using the mindset and materials of the 1950s...and dont forget the wood floors.

oh and you'll need a george martin behind the controls...

post your results when your finished...I'd be very interested in hearing the beatles sound through a few art pres and some sub-300 dollar mics...
Click to expand...

Maybe he was asking what the best way would be given the equipment he has, or with minor investments?
 
Wow, what a thread!

The guitar distortion on "Revolution" was made by overloading the preamps at the board - they were recorded direct, without an amp. But I'm not sure quite how to mimic that with today's low-to-mid-range gear....

I second the use of plate reverb. John liked lots of reverb on his vox.

They also ran many of their guitars through a Leslie cab. Again, not sure that a digital simulation will get you there, but there it is....

I would LOVE to hear your results, and also any decisions you make as to production.

Fab
 
Henrik said:


Maybe he was asking what the best way would be given the equipment he has, or with minor investments?
Click to expand...

I realize that. I was being devilish and sarcastic;) Please forgive me but there is no way your going to get the beatles sound without their equipment. You could probably get a "beatley" sound if you invested in a soundelux e47 and a u99, a chandler emi tg pre and their emi tg limiter.
Set realistic goals, there's no way your going to actually approximate the "fidelity" of each record.

however, I do know of an inexpensive trick that george martin used on all the beatles vocals that gave them that great open sound and always cut through the mix...let me know if you want to know how it was achieved...it involves an old sony noise reduction unit and some slight modifications. Overall about $300 to get an absolutely amazing vocal processor and your vocals will sound great...
 
I read an article about abbey road reverb in which they were said to have used a narrow ceramic-tiled room with a plate reverb the size of a Buick in it for the vocal reverbs.
Tom
 
you need to do a lot of vocal doubling.

esp. to get that lennon vibe.

as mentioned play with hard panning - even with vocals at times.

and of course...that pattented 3 part harmony will take you a long way.

emulate british accent as well (no..really..hehe)
 
btw - check out some of the stuff Macle has done (he posts on this bbs) his website is

http://www.angelfire.com/rock2/3songs/

Check out "Joke" (kinda sgt. peppery) and "Fingerprints"

"So Long" (only in realplayer...what happened to the mp3s mac! hehe) is a great one also...and is fairly let it beish...

Another great example from him would be "Buzz is Over" - he doesn't have it online now..but I could hook you up if you are interested.

His stuff has kind of a "new" beatles sound....but I think you could probably benefit from a quick listen. His drums are way back in the mix like a lot of Beatles stuff. I think if you took some of the hi-fi out of these recordings...then you might be getting closer to something that would work for you.
 
Corporate copycats

c7sus said:
Hey, this is just what I was talking about in the Cave........ these "sound-alike" compositions commissioned by corporate types when they can't (or won't pay for) the rights to the music they want..................
Click to expand...


IMHO it's "won't" not "can't" pay for it... I used to work for a TV station owned by a giant corporation that was making record profits at the time.

They wanted a sound-alike of Ricky Martin's "Livin La Vida Loca" (the big hit of the day) for a promo presentation to the corporate types in NYC--sort of a "hey, look at how good we promote our cheesy newscasts, give us our revenue back" annual presentation. They hired local musicians to record the song with their customized promotions department lyrics. It was the only thing worse than the origianl track! I also had the misfortune of sitting near the edit booth that they synched it to video in...

Since it wasn't for release in any way, would they have even NEEDED the rights for it? They could have used a karaoke machine :D . Such a pointless waste of cash, spending money so your own corp will spend money on you.

The year before, they had used that Chumbawumba song :eek:
Good thing that crawdad's clients have better taste! The project sounds like much more fun than recreating the current month's hit flavor...


Fab: Cool info on "Revolution." I suspected that the guitar was direct. I actually kinda hate that tone in general, but it works for the song (it's a great song!). It's that sort of splattered, messy distortion that screams "I'm abusing my gear!!" :)
 
Scriabin said:
post your results when your finished...I'd be very interested in hearing the beatles sound through a few art pres and some sub-300 dollar mics...
Click to expand...

Whooooooeeee ! ! ! Alright, who slipped the grumpy-ass pills in Scriabin's all-bran this morning ? ? ? ! !

I was waiting for you to mention the need to hire the witchdoctor to resurect Lennon and Harrison from the dead. Forgive me, but I must have skipped over the part in Crawdad's thread where he asked: "How do I get an EXACT REPRODUCTION of the Beatles sound, right down to the minutest detail?"

But since he's only looking for a "fun imitation" of the Beatles sound, ala "The Rutles" or "The Monkeys," I wouldn't fly him out to Abbey Road or conjure any dead souls just yet.

Geez, you're cranky, Scriabin. :)
 
Excellent thread - nice one Scriabin! - Beautiful sarcasm!

For a 'modern' recreated Beatles - try "The Dukes of Stratosphere". (aka the guys from XTC). They faithfully recreated the sound of the era using ancient kit. - Psycadelic man!
I think I read about the making of the album '25 o'clock' in Sound-on-Sound once a few years back as well. - You might find this on their website.
Good Luck,
RevF.
 
I think the Rutles sounded more like the Beatles than the Beatles. :) ! !
 
A set of flatwounds on the bass is a must!!!
A little palm muting in spots as well.


Have fun and to hell with all who oppose you!


heylow
 
Wow...a lot to respond to here. First, thank you Chessrock, mig27, henrick, tom hicks, scriabin, fab, revf, wes480 and whoever I missed for the tips. And, yes, I realize I may not nail everything perfectly with what I have -still saving to buy abbey road :-) . I think George Martin retired, so I'm out of luck there too.

Anyway, the fun of this for me is simply to see how close I might come through trail and error to emulate some of these recordings. Hopefully I will gain some skill and insight in the process and become a bit better engineer.

I did work on the Revolution guitar part today, which was interesting. I ran my Telecaster into an overdrive pedal set very mild, boosting the output into the Tube MP with the input maxed. With some EQ afterward, I was getting it very much in the ballpark, though not exact. Lennon probably was playing his Casino, right? It was definitely direct into the board--no question about it.

Tom--Thanks for the tip on the book. I want to get that one. I have the Beatles Complete Sessions, and that is very interesting as well, though probably not as technical.

Mig27--Do you know where I'd even begin looking to find a Telefunken V267?

Scriabin--I will definitely give your bass EQ ideas a try. I know many of those bass tracks are the ol' Hofner or Rick, but I'm going for as close as I can get with what I have and your ideas look good on paper!

Last, I've been thinking about how great the Beatles recordings were--not only as songs, but as records. I can't begin to say how many times I've listened to them and had visions of how they were put together, or how many times I just enjoyed the way they could leap right out of a car radio. I always perceived that there was quality in the engineering, even when my attention was on the song and the performance. When the recording itself is inspirational, that says something.
 
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