Bassists of the world, help me out!

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frank_1

frank_1

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I bought a DeArmond Piolet Plus 5 string bass and only have until the 16th of sept. to return it to Sam Ash. I am thinking of getting a Fender standard Jazz V bass for $300, but it would cost me $120 extra for the Fender.

What would you do?... Return the DeArmond or not. I don't think the DeArmond sounds all that good but it was only $159. The Fender, plus my SansAmp Bass Driver DI together will most likely make the Fender sound great.

I am asking all you to think for me. I know this is a personal decision but I can't decide.

I don't have a lot of money. I am a college student that doesn't have a well paying job. I mostly play Instrumental Rock, I am really a guitar player so my "jams" are geared toward the guitar.
 
Poor college student? Shit, I remember being there.

Sounds like more of a life decision moral dilemma than a technical question. My vote is to keep the bass you've got. Mainly because you're not a bass player. This played a big part in my vote. Part because I remember struggling to always want the best stuff when I couldn't always afford it. Mainly because you can then apply your saved cash towards your guitar or something more important, like your recording equipment.

Also, you may want to take into account all the reasons you bass doesn't sound great. You state "The Fender, plus my SansAmp Bass Driver DI together will most likely make the Fender sound great."...

"Most likely?"

That sounds like you haven't A/B'ed them. It seems you are not completely satisfied with your bass tone. The problem may be in the bass. However, the problem may be in your recording technique and how the bass sits in the mix.

Also, I am a guitarist that has a Ibanez 5 string bass on hand for recording. I'd prefer a Fender 4 string P-Bass and I make enough cash that I could easily afford one. The main reason I don't get one is because I'd be sacrificing other more important equipment to get it. For example, I'm contemplating a TriAxis, a PRS, a better wireless setup, better effects, etc.

Point being, I'd asses what I'd be giving up to get a "most likely" better bass.

Disclaimer: most of this post was IMHO from someone who should be in bed...


Matt
 
I though my avatar made a statement... Wait, did I say statement, I ment I thought it was cool.
 
These are a few mp3's comparing my Fender MusicMaster Bass with a SansAmp Bass Driver Di. This is NOT the Fender bass I was refering too above. Compared with the DeArmond. The "jam" is not good, don't comment on the jam, I know it sucks.

Remember the NEW Fender I am looking at will be $120 more.

Pick either mp3 as your favorite, and post it...

Test1

Test 2
 
I know a couple of bassists and one still does lots of session work and they both own basses that cost thousands of dollars. Yet, when they record they tend to use Fender P-Bass and Jazz basses almost exclusively. There is some debate in the bass playing community why this is the trend. Is it because those particular guitars have a tendency to sit in a mix really well or is it because they have been used so much that producers prefer the sound ? It's probably a little bit of both reasons, but it definitely influenced my decision to buy a Fender Jazz bass.

I've never heard the DeArmond so I can't comment on it. I really feel that some of Fender basses are one of the great bargains in the music world. The intonation is consistent and they are solidly constructed. I would put the Yamaha basses in that group too.

Bottom line- if you're not happy with the sound of the DeArmond then buy something else. Follow your instincts even if it costs you some money. I should get my tax refund check anyday now.......let's just say they know me on a first-name basis at Guitar Center. :eek:
 
Don't return the DeArmond to SamAsh. You'll take a $30 hit or so on shipping, unless it's defective. That's dumb on a bass this cheap.

Though I am not familiar with your specific Pilot (I have a Pilot DeLuxe), I think you can doink around with a DeArmond until you get a decent sound. If it's too twangy, go flatwounds. They don't sound like a Fender, but a MIM Fender doesn't cut it in my book anyway.

If you can't get the sound you want out of it after some more doiking and really don't like the DeArmond, you can probably sell it at a decent profit on EBay, especially if it's currently out of stock. Everyone's nuts about these things.

This beats taking a $30 hit in the neck, and you'll probably have more money to work with after you're done.

People use Fender basses (real ones) for the same reason they use Strats: Everyone else does.

That said, I prefer the US P-Bass, though I consider it a pretty limited instrument in terms of range. I like my new '01 American "Hot Rodded" P-Bass ($499 at GC on sale), but I think the P & J pickups are sort of a gimmick more than anything else (the graphite neck and the through-body strings are nice, though) I prefer my '70 P-Bass for sound, but that may just be because it has roundwounds.
 
bongolation , why would I take a $30 hit. I didn't order it, it came from the store's stock room. To they charge $30 for restocking fee or something? I have owned it less then 15 days.

What does "MIM" mean?
 
Oh! I thought you got it from SamAsh.Com!

Sorry! That's different. To return to SamAsh.Com, you have to pay the shipping, which is about $30.

MIM=Made in Mexico.
 
MIM

Made in Mexico...

I agree with the others that for the cost, and its most likely use, you've got a working bass, keep it. Tweak with the sound, add the sans-amp (or other options) in your signal path. As that outboard gear will continue to serve you. If, over time, you gravitate more to the bass, hopefully your finances will find you in a better spot to move into the next level of gear. A MIM fender would still be asking to be replaced at the same point in your progress. I agree with Bongolation, you will probably hold value with the DeArmond better, as they are so discounted right now to begin with.

I'm a Fender guy (except my upright, and acoustic). But I've owned or played just about everything out there at least once. Including a $150 Epiphone Accubass/Rockbass, that as a 13 punk (we're talking a few months allowance and birthday $), I carried home with pride, and learned more about bass in the next 4 years on that, than I probably have in the years since my first upgrade. Was your first guitar a PRS? Or your first car a vette? You just got a honda civic for the price of a hyundai... drive the hell out of it.
 
No, my first guitar was a Menphis, then a Fender strat, then an Ibanez, then at 14 years old I got my PRS Custom, and I'm 20 now. Lucky I guess.

--Keep in mind that the DeArmond can not be used with the SansAmp, I tried it with horrible results. The active pickup on the DeArmond effects the SansAmp in a very bad way. The Fender which I used on the mp3 I posted above, well I kinda want to sell that bass because it is a Short scale bass, it was made in 1979, the pick-up is not that good. The Fender is a MusicMaster bass, if I didn't mention that before.
A Fender made in Mexico is OK, because the DeArmond is made in Korea or indonesia (around that hemisphere).
 
# A Fender made in Mexico is OK, because the DeArmond is made
# in Korea or indonesia (around that hemisphere).

I can't follow this logic at all.:confused:

But I'll bust it up like this: The problem with MIM Fenders is that they are "sabotaged" by Fender with inferior parts and materials so they'll NEVER be as good as a domestic ("MIA") Fender. If the MIM Fenders had a level playing field and the same materials, they'd be as good or probably better than the MIA instruments, but they don't and therefore they're not.

The DeArmonds, on the other hand (like many imports) are not burdened by that kind of millstone around their metaphorical neck. This is my main beef with MIM Fenders.

The other beef is that they never seem to be on sale, so I can get a MIA Fender for only a few bucks more if I keep my eyes open. Got a new '00 American Standard natural ash Telecaster w/hard case for $429 in March and a new '01 American Series "Hot Rodded" P-Bass in trans orange ash for $499 on Labor Day.

When imports aren't intentionally kept funky with cheap materials, their superior workmanship really shines. The Gretsch "Historic Series" acoustics are just incredibly beautiful guitars and usually sound fantastic. My Gretsch Historic "Hawaiian" is not only magnificently beautiful and playable, but has fantastic voice. My DeArmond M-77T is just a superb guitar at _any_ price...but I got each of these for a mere $199 at GC "List" sales (though list was $600 and $999, respectively).

The high-end Korean makers make higher quality production guitars than any American maker. You have to go "custom shop" with Fender or Gibson to match the workmanship of a $400 Korean. It's ridiculous.

Another thought: I think you are just overloading your outboard gear with the DeArmond actives. Start with everything in "1" position and work up. There's no reason why an active shouldn't work well with any high-impedance input. Also check your battery; if you're in the habit of leaving your bass plugged in, it could be low/dead and therefore giving a weird output.
 
Thanks for the input...

Your saying that MIM guitars are defaultly, I guess. I know there will not be as good as American Fenders, but they can't be all that bad; can they? From what you typed I think I know your response.

It's just that Fender basses sit in the mix perfectly, perfectly! The DeArmond does not.
 
tone

I'm new to this forum, but I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents.

I just started trying to record stuff this summer, so I'm not to hip to that aspect of the bass tone. But I've been playing bass for about 4 years. The tone you get out your bass also has alot to do with how you play it. When I first started playing it took me a while to really develop the tone I was looking for. With a little instruction and alot of practice I eventually got there.

So anyway I'm rambling... If I go to a store and pick up a bass I can get the tone I want to come out of it, unless it's real fucked up or something. So basically I'm suggesting working on the way you play with your right hand, and maybe you can get a more desirable tone. Different strings help as well.

by the way, what kinda tone are you going for here?
 
-bongolation, I just ran into a Squire 5-string J-bass. I can NOT return the DeArmond for a full refund, but I can trade it in. What are your thoughts on Squire basses? Are all Squires MIM?

I played it, and the neck was more compfortable then the DeArmond. I haven't gotten a chance to heard how it sounds yet.
 
mexican fenders

i have played alot of guitars...i still have the 1st fender strat i ever bought (a 1966 model). Its tru that fender uses cheaper parts on the mexican guitars, along with a cheaper paint job...but...the necks and bodies are made in the usa on the american and the standard series of guitars. the neck and body is the heart of a guitar. look at the differance in the price 800 bucks for an american strat....320 bucks for a mexican strat. you can put a set of texas special pickups on for about 150 bucks, it already has a vintage bridge and saddles (just like my '66) so i wouldn't change that, the electrics seem to be fine, the keys on the mex strats stay in tune real well and have a high gear ratio...so why change them? bottom line is: you can put fenders top of the line pick-ups in a mex strat for 200 bucks or less and have a great guitar...so why spend 500.00 more on the american?
the reason im saying this is because i went guitar shopping a couple of months ago...planning on buying an american strat and played 20 guitars over a 4 hour period (which included a '57 reissue, a roadhouse strt and other american strats...and the botom line was: the best playing and sounding strat in the whole damn bunch was a mexican made maple fretboard strat. I bought that guitar and have been playing it every weekend and am 100% satisfied.....and all i've played for the last 25 years is a vintage strat and a vintage les paul. thats my 2 cents worth
 
mex strat

im finishing up a blues song (in the mixing stage) that i used this mexican strat on...played it thru a $289 pevey studio pro transtube amp and got a tone that will blow you away (i can't say enough about the new line of pevey amps....they kick ass).....oh, and i left the stock pickups in the strat cause they sound pretty damn good to me..so why change. let me see....319 for the strat...289 for the amp...thats 608 bucks, hell, i can add a mic pre-amp and still have less invested than just buying the american strat by itself.
 
frank_1 said:
What are your thoughts on Squire basses? Are all Squires MIM?
Click to expand...
The Squiers are made in China (though I understand some models are now made in Indonesia). They're a step down from even a MIM Fender, an entry-level beginner's instrument

If you swap a DeArmond for a Squier, you've definitely taken a bad hit.
 
My take on the MIM Fenders - one that is widely shared - is that by the time you've fixed them up, you've nearly reached the price of a MIA instrument on sale, and it's still a MIM Fender.

Further, based on my experience buying, selling and playing fine instruments for over forty years, I _never_ modify, "customize" or "improve" an instrument beyond the limits of good setup or 100% reversable parts substitutions that can be undone without evidence. It's a chump shot, as you'll never get your money back out of the modifications come selling time, at least not from a knowledgeable buyer. This is especially true of modified low-end stuff. It's good money after bad.

On the other hand, if the instrument is a valuable one in original condition, you've destroyed its resale value utterly.

Everyone hates to hear this and usually I get hysterical flaming for bringing this up, but take it from a former pro dealer, them's the facts, Jack.

Is the instrument "better" after doing a $150 pickup upgrade on a $300 guitar? Maybe, but it's a chump shot from a business standpoint, and you can probably have gotten the real thing for that much.

Are some individual MIM Fenders good-sounding instruments? Sure, I don't doubt it. But they are not the same as MIA Fenders. They use cheaper parts and materials and don't retain the resale value (or appreciate) the way that MIAs do.

I just see MIM Fenders as false economy. They never seem to be on sale and the MIAs are. When I was looking for a Tele this year, the best deal I could find on a MIM was over $300 for some cheap thing in a gig bag. I watched for a good sale and got a new 521 natural ash MIA American Standard in a hard case for $429.
 
your right

everything you said is right about MIM fenders.....if your business is buying and selling guitars. I play them....and the american strats i played didn't impress me, the MIM strat played better.....and there was very little difference in the sound
so.....there ya go
and as far as retaining its value.....you can buy one for 320 bucks and wear it slap out and still get 200 for it
i can live with that
a used american sure don't bring 800 (look at the deal you got)
 
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