Bass compression..

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kranky

kranky

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Just curious to know what a good average compression ratio and threshold is for recording a bass stack. And also, should I compress the bass track during mixdown also? If it helps, I'm using a Sennheiser 421 to mic all my guitar and bass guitar cabnets.
 
there is no single answer. or if there is, it's "it depends".

how much compression do you want? how much do you need? are you using it as a limiter or to color the sound?

my personal taste lies towards not compressing at all during tracking and only limiting when you need to. that way you can then apply compression later if you need/want it, and you're not married to a compressed track from the gitgo.

i run bass direct and use a symetrix 425 on bass and kick as a limiter for tracking, and it does ok. it does color the sound, but it also helps it punch through (sit in) the mix a little better. i usually end up with the ratio around 2:1 or 3:1, with mild threshold so that it's only kicking in on the extreme peaks. that may or may not work for you.

YMWV

experiment and find something that works for you, your song and your mix!


wade
 
There's just no way anyone can tell you a 'good' setting, because it really does depend. I usually don't compress the signal when recording. I might compress the bass before it hits the mic though, as part of the sound. It's much more common to compress during mixdown, yes, but it really depends on how well the bass has been played, what kind of music you're playing etc., so no easy answers here, sorry. Try to get hold of some articles about compression, there are quite a few good ones, try to do a search here first, 'cause this topic has been discussed sooo many times.
Good luck,

David
 
i run bass direct and use a symetrix 425 on bass and kick as a limiter for tracking, and it does ok. it does color the sound, but it also helps it punch through (sit in) the mix a little better. i usually end up with the ratio around 2:1 or 3:1, with mild threshold so that it's only kicking in on the extreme peaks. that may or may not work for you.
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Ratio under 10:1 is compressing. You are basicly doing mild compression with low ratio.

I would say get used to working with compressors so you are not afraid to track with them. A bass player will give a better performance if he or she is monitoring a comp'd track. If the player likes it and it feels good while tracking use it. Go sparingly and comp or limit again at mixdown. If your track requires heavy compressing it will be better done in two passes usually anyway.

Kirk
 
Strange how people generally seem to talk a lot more about ratios than the threshold (and even less about attack times). Might be worth experimenting with a low threshold so that the signal is being compressed virtually all the time, but with a very gentle (<2:1) ratio, and a slow attack time. For me it seems to smooth it out without being obvious, but I'm only a beginner here and YMMV.
 
this is my typical compression scheme

conklin 5-string --> sansamp --> RNP --> sound card

the above is my chain for bass recording. i don't compress during recording unless i'm playing funk (slappin'), which i rarely do.

my attack is program dependent based on the BPM of the song. I use AnalogX's delay calculator. Put in the BPMs and use either the 8th, 16th, or 32nd notes as the attack. Then i use either the whole (slow songs), half (mostly), or quarter note (rarely) time as the release. This depends on what type of bass style i'm playing.

for the threshold i generally set it about halfway between the average RMS level and the average peak level for songs where the bass has got to lay still in the groove. i set it to the average peak level for songs where the bass has more room to breath.

for the compression ratio i usually start at about 5:1 and play around with more or less compression till i get what i'm looking for in regards to dynamics control.

BTW, Gary Sharp those <2:1 ratios. I usually use lighter ratios with low threshold settings for overall mix compression.
 
kirk--you're right....my use of the term "limiter" was incorrect there.

i'm plenty comfortable enough with compressors to track with them when needed (or wanted, depending the sound i'm seeking).......i just don't find the need for seriously compressing bass on tracking....or at least not for this particular band and sound. this bass player's pretty smooth as it is and the mild compression just tames the occasional peak and that's pretty much all i need for him. his parts almost always sit in the mix fine on their own. a little HPF and it's usually solid enough.

and FWIW, i'm a firm believer in (generally speaking of course) tracking with as little compression as possible. if i need more compression, i'd rather add it at mixing rather than being married to something that sounded good at tracking but possibly not the morning after......


wade
 
Cool. You are lucky to work with a smooth player. I don't often get that lucky. I do find that even with the best players and vocalists they perform there best when they are monitoring something as close to the final mix as possible. Then again I am the type of AE that likes to have the mix just about done at the end of the last dub. I like to commit and move on. There are no hard and fast rules.

I still feel there is a tendancy here to advise people to cut there tracks dry. In my opinion that is doing a diservice.

Kirk
 
I still feel there is a tendancy here to advise people to cut there tracks dry. In my opinion that is doing a diservice.
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i disagree. if you record it wet or processed (as the case maybe), you limit your ability to change your mind. if you record it dry and monitor it wet, you can change your mind about the sound you are looking for and re-mix.2 weeks later and re-mix.
 
crosstudio said:
i disagree. if you record it wet or processed (as the case maybe), you limit your ability to change your mind.
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I agree.

Like you said nwsoundman, just have them play to the effect/compression, but record dry.
 
i think it really depends....

if i have a certain sound in mind, and i know i'm married to that sound when tracking and i'm happy with that fact, then i'll have no problems at all tracking it wet. a lot of times that comes from working with someone over time and knowing what their (and your) goals are ahead of time. and of course, that means you have to live with it come hell or high water, or lay down another track.

on the other hand, if i don't have a sound in mind or i want maximum sonic flexibility with the track at the mixing stage, then i'll track it as dry as possible and add everything in afterwards. if i've not worked with someone much (or if this is the first time), this is what i usually err towards, unless something immediately jumps out at me.

....so i do both and would say that it entirely depends on what your goals are.


wade
 
Re: this is my typical compression scheme

crosstudio said:
my attack is program dependent based on the BPM of the song. I use AnalogX's delay calculator. Put in the BPMs and use either the 8th, 16th, or 32nd notes as the attack. Then i use either the whole (slow songs), half (mostly), or quarter note (rarely) time as the release. This depends on what type of bass style i'm playing.
Click to expand...

I've never heared of timing the attack and release to bpm.How common is this technique?
 
Garry Sharp said:
Strange how people generally seem to talk a lot more about ratios than the threshold (and even less about attack times). Might be worth experimenting with a low threshold so that the signal is being compressed virtually all the time, but with a very gentle (<2:1) ratio, and a slow attack time. For me it seems to smooth it out without being obvious, but I'm only a beginner here and YMMV.
Click to expand...

Good points. And attack time is a huge factor, especially up in the faster end.
Wayne
 
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