Balanced, unbalanced, high impedance, low???

[tucker97325]

Hi all, I'm new here, and this may be the wrong forum for this question, and who knows, maybe this question has been asked before. But here it goes.

I play guitar, and sing a little. I have recently decided to "Go electric", and start recording some stuff, but I know practically nothing about electronics. I've gotten some equipment that I'm afraid to hook up and use, because I don't want to ruin it all. Here's what I have/need to hook up.

Hardware:
Alesis 3630 compressor
Peavey Delta flex twin effects processor
Peavey PV-500 power amp
2 CGM stage monitors
Fender MX5216 mixing console
M-Audio Delta1010 Digit recording system(I/O to my PC)

Software: (This is installed and working)
Vegas Pro
Acid
Sound Forge

My question is, how do I link all these together? I have to admit, I'm a little intimidated by all the T/S, T/R/S, XLR, RCA, sysflex, phantom power, balanced, unbalanced, high impedance, low impedance, line input, insert, and mic input stuff. I thought all I had to do was plug the guitar and mics in and go for it. I guess I was wrong.

The user manual for the mixer shows some sample setups, none of which look like the way I would do it, and for the guitar ins they include something called a "Direct box", whatever that is, being fed into the XLR mic inputs. Why can't I just plug the guitar into the line inputs? But then, do I run it through the effects processor and compressor first, or visa versa. (Which comes first, the chicken or the egg?)

I'm just totally lost here. Any useful information you care to throw my way will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Scottgman]

Wow! You really need some help!

With the equipment you've got, there are quite a few options.

Here's a basic setup that will get you recording and monitoring. I am assuming you will be using the preamps in the mixer to record with. Also, you didn't list any mics, but you would just plug those into the mixer (or you could plug the guitar into the mixer):

First you need to install the Delta in your computer.

Next, you need to hook up your CGM stage monitors to your power amp/mixer. I am assuming the CGM stage monitors are passive. If they are active (powered) then DO NOT connect them to the power amp. Just connect the straight to the mixer as described below.

Run two cables from the 'Monitor Out' or 'Main Out' in your mixer to the power amp. It doesn't matter... it's your choice which you use. It depends on your mixer and power amp if you can use TRS cables (you probably can use TRS). But TR will work fine.

Now run SPEAKER CABLE from the power amp to your CGM stage monitors.

Next run cables (TR or TRS) from 'Out 1 & 2' on your Delta and connect it to your mixer. If you mixer has a "2-track in" input, you can use that or you can just use a stereo channel. In your software, you will be able to specify which 'OUTS' on your Delta to send the audio. Obviously, you would select Delta Out 1 & 2.

You can then hook up your compressor and effects unit to an Aux buss on your mixer. If your mixer has two Aux busses, you can hook the compressor to one and the fx unit to the other. You can also use the compressor and fx unit as channel inserts, but you would need a special "Insert" cable for that task.

Now you need to be able to send signals to your Delta from the mixer. There are several options to do this. For instance, if your mixer has direct outs you can run 8 seperate channels into your Delta's 8 inputs. Or you could just send a stereo (or mono) signal from the mixer into inputs on the Delta. I'm not familiar with your mixer so you'll have to figure out that on your own (or maybe someone else will chime in). Your recording software will allow you to specify which Delta inputs you are going to be using.

That should get you up and running. There are lots of options to hooking this stuff up. It really depends on what you want to do.

I wouldn't worry to much about "ruining it all." The only issues you really need to worry about are amplified signals (anything coming after a power amp) and phantom power. Those two things can "ruin" equipment. Other than that, just start expermenting (and keep reading/researching).

Hope that helps!

 

[tucker97325]

Yes, thank you. I think I got most of that, and from your discription, I'm sure I can handle most of the output end of it. Mixer to power amp to speakers, mixer to delta to PC. Got it.

No, the mixer does not have direct outs, so that could be a problem when I get two or more people recording at the same time, since I would like to keep each instrument/voice within it's own discreet track. Is it possible to use the INSERT jacks for this pupose?

I'm happy to hear I only need to worry about where the power amp output goes. I've been concerned about all the high/low impedance and balanced/unbalanced stuff causing problems. I don't think I'll have a problem making sure the power only goes to the monitors.

One thing still bothers me though. As I said, I'm just dumb when it comes to this stuff. When you say "just plug those into the mixer", I have to ask you "into where?". The mixer has 3, what I would call, inputs for each of the 16 channels.

One labeled "INSERT", defined as "a 1/4" TRS stereo jack with a normally closed switch." I guess this one is considered and I/O jack.

A "LINE INPUT", defined as "a 1/4" input designed to accept balanced or unbalanced line-level siganls....., tip carries +, ring carries -, and sleeve is grounded."

and finally, a "Mic INPUT", defined as an XLR jack designed to accept balanced signals from mics, direct boxes, or other low-level gear. (this input also supplies phantom power through pins 2 and 3.

Now, the microphones use XLR at the mic end, and I have cables for them with either XLR or TS connectors at the output end. If I use the XLR out cables, then obviously they go into the XLR jacks on the mixer. If I use the TS end jacks for the mics, and oh by the way the guitars all use the TS type too and each has an onboard preamp/EQ system, am I hearing you say those go into the LINE INPUT jacks? and is there no problem running a TS plug into a TRS jack.

Also, and one of the reasons I've been concerned, the mixer manual shows some sample setups, but wherever there is a guitar connection, they are showing it going through something called a "Direct Box" into one of the Mic inputs. What is a direct box, and does this make a difference in any of your answers?

Sorry for all the stupid questions.

 

[Scottgman]

since I would like to keep each instrument/voice within it's own discreet track. Is it possible to use the INSERT jacks for this pupose?

One labeled "INSERT", defined as "a 1/4" TRS stereo jack with a normally closed switch." I guess this one is considered and I/O jack.

A "LINE INPUT", defined as "a 1/4" input designed to accept balanced or unbalanced line-level siganls....., tip carries +, ring carries -, and sleeve is grounded."

and finally, a "Mic INPUT", defined as an XLR jack designed to accept balanced signals from mics, direct boxes, or other low-level gear. (this input also supplies phantom power through pins 2 and 3.

Yes. You *should* (not all mixers do) be able to use the INSERTs as a direct out. Usually you just plug in a cable until the first click-- so the cable is only half-way plugged in.

An INSERT can also be used to run your compressor or fx processor on a single track rather than across an Aux buss-- but you would need an INSERT cable to do this.

A LINE Input is for things like Keyboards and Acoustic Guitars (with built-in preamps). You *could* plug an electric guitar straight into to a LINE input... but it probably won't sound very good. That's why you would use a direct box -- a POD type device or something like a Sansamp. But I never use Direct-ins for electric guitar. I prefer to put a couple mics on my guitar amp... that always sounds best to me.

The MIC inputs are obviously for mics or anything else that needs some extra gain. Some direct boxes have XLR outs-- so you would use an XLR cable to connect to the mixer. You only need to worry about phantom power if you are using condenser mics. If you don't have any condensers... then you don't need phantom power.

Hope that helps!