Aux channels and mixing vocals.

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mate112

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Hi all,

Question regarding the use of aux channels. When I send an aux effect through one of the busses to add to one of my tracks which volumes should I watch/worry about? The actual 'track mixer' volume (on aux) or the volume nob on the bus? I experiment with all 3 (voc/track nob, aux nob and the bus nob (one under 'send').
The mixes come out fine but they always sound kind muzzled when I compare them to other songs out there.

Also, how can anytime I upload a track (let's say an instrumental) and try to rerecord it to a different track it clips and the volume shows red?

Thanks,

Matt
 
I prefer to have my send faders near unity to make them easier to fine tune so I tend to trim the effect level on the output side. I start with whatever channel send is likely to be set highest and adjust the aux bus fader for a good balance, then bring in other channels as needed. You could trim it back in the plugin just as well.

Part of this is gain structure habit from analog. Driving the effect with level just short of clipping and trimming the output gives the effect better signal to work with and minimizes noise. Some emulating plugins may still benefit from this.
 
I do the same thing he does. But remember that you need to set the effect processor to 100% wet, that may be part of you muzzled problem.
 
mate112 said:
Also, how can anytime I upload a track (let's say an instrumental) and try to rerecord it to a different track it clips and the volume shows red?
Click to expand...

What is the pan law set to?
 
Farview said:
I do the same thing he does. But remember that you need to set the effect processor to 100% wet, that may be part of you muzzled problem.
Click to expand...

Could you elaborate on 100% wet please. ;p
 
mate112 said:
Could you elaborate on 100% wet please. ;p
Click to expand...

Pretty much all reverbs have a mix function that balances between the original "dry" unaltered signal and the reverb that gets added to it ("wet"). Whenever you use reverb on an aux bus there is already a dry signal getting to the mix via the original channel, so the plugin's mix setting should be 100% effect, a.k.a. 100% wet. Use the method outlined above to balance the reverb with the rest of the mix.

If you put a reverb plugin directly on the track you would need to use the mix function to balance the original dry signal with the added wet signal.
 
Good idea to use an aux bus for verb or delay. This lets you EQ the effect separately. In acoustic spaces the highs are naturally rolled off the reverbrations. This is also true for analog delay effect units and older "bucket brigade" delays, as opposed to modern digital delays. In addition to cutting back the high frequencies, its a good idea to also roll back the bass of the reverb or delay bus EQ to make the mix a little less muddy.

When you are adjusting the blend of the verb with the main vocal via the aux fader or knob, don't over-do it. If you are noticing the effect in the context of the full mix instead of paying attention to the vocal, its likely been applied a bit too much. Back it off a touch until its not drawing attention to itself and possibly distracting listeners from the vibe and emotion of the vocal delivery.

Unless that's the plan of your arrangement, to feature the effect that way. There are no hard and fast rules.
 
Tom Hicks said:
Good idea to use an aux bus for verb or delay. This lets you EQ the effect separately. In acoustic spaces the highs are naturally rolled off the reverbrations. This is also true for analog delay effect units and older "bucket brigade" delays, as opposed to modern digital delays. In addition to cutting back the high frequencies, its a good idea to also roll back the bass of the reverb or delay bus EQ to make the mix a little less muddy.

When you are adjusting the blend of the verb with the main vocal via the aux fader or knob, don't over-do it. If you are noticing the effect in the context of the full mix instead of paying attention to the vocal, its likely been applied a bit too much. Back it off a touch until its not drawing attention to itself and possibly distracting listeners from the vibe and emotion of the vocal delivery.

Unless that's the plan of your arrangement, to feature the effect that way. There are no hard and fast rules.
Click to expand...
Okay, I'll keep experimenting. I'm going along with a buddy of mine to a studio soon to observe the guy who mixes. Maybe I'll learn a thing or two.
Thanks.
 
bouldersoundguy said:
Pretty much all reverbs have a mix function that balances between the original "dry" unaltered signal and the reverb that gets added to it ("wet"). Whenever you use reverb on an aux bus there is already a dry signal getting to the mix via the original channel, so the plugin's mix setting should be 100% effect, a.k.a. 100% wet. Use the method outlined above to balance the reverb with the rest of the mix.

If you put a reverb plugin directly on the track you would need to use the mix function to balance the original dry signal with the added wet signal.
Click to expand...

Got it. Is there any 'rule' as to how much louder the bus signal should be as opposed to the aux channel?
 
mate112 said:
Just at 0dB. When I lower it it doesn't clip.
I read the link you provided, it explained a bit. So when you lower the dB to avoid clipping do you 'lose' some of the sound?
Click to expand...
You generally set the pan law in the preferences section of your DAW. It isn't a setting on the mixer that you generally mess with, it's something you set and forget.

It's kind of an esoteric thing, but that might be the goofy reason why it clips when you try to re-record something. Of course, you shouldn't be recording anything so hot that it comes anywhere near clipping in the first place.
 
mate112 said:
Got it. Is there any 'rule' as to how much louder the bus signal should be as opposed to the aux channel?
Click to expand...

I was using aux channel and bus interchangeably. A bus is any point where signals are combined into one, like an aux channel where you are sending multiple signals to one reverb.

DAWs all seem to have their own terminology for things that used to have one or two commonly understood names on mixing boards. Partly because they have blurred the definitions by adding more function, and partly because they want to make you think their software does things others don't.

What you're doing is essentially a parallel effects loop. The aux channel is in parallel with all the main channels. The main channels carry the dry signals to the main bus while the aux channel does the same with the wet signal. They combine at the mix bus.

An insert puts an effect in series with the dry signal. The only way the dry signal gets to the main bus is via the mix control in the effect, and in many cases no dry signal passes through. Compressors, gates and eq are examples of things generally used in series with no dry signal.

When you want to combine some signals together before they get to the main bus you assign them to a submix group bus (or subgroup or just bus). Then you can control their volume collectively, insert an effect on the submix, assign them to a different output than the main bus.

I guess that's the long way of saying I'm not sure what you mean by "bus signal" and "aux channel" in your question.
 
mate112 said:
Just at 0dB. When I lower it it doesn't clip.
I read the link you provided, it explained a bit. So when you lower the dB to avoid clipping do you 'lose' some of the sound?
Click to expand...

To my thinking it shouldn't, but on a hunch I asked the same question of someone else with the same problem, imported stereo files were clipping a little. Apparently changing the pan law setting fixed it somehow.
 
bouldersoundguy said:
I guess that's the long way of saying I'm not sure what you mean by "bus signal" and "aux channel" in your question.
Click to expand...


When you create a new aux channel is come with its own volume nob. When you insert a new bus for the aux to go through the insert has its own volume nob as well. That's what I meant. I'm not too familiar with terminology lol.
 
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