ART MP or Joemeek VC3Q?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Leeking
  • Start date Start date
hmmm...

These both look good, I'm kind'ov undecided.
Can anyone tell me what you actually use the preamp for?
I'm only going to be using it for vocals, so out of the two, is one of them gonna suit me more. Also is there a preamp made that's more dedicated to the vocal area and not instruments?
This would be really helpfull...thanks!
 
Just to be controversial - I think they both suck.

Tube pre's are a bit off all the rage at the moment, but I'd rather have a good solid state pre than a bad tube one.
Good tube pre's starts at about 1000 bucks and up.
 
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What aabout the Presonus MP20 and the HHB stuff. Anyone have hands on with these? God, if it were only illegal to make bad gear the world would be much better off...
Sjoko... for the price, what do you think of the Art MP? They are cheap, for sure. Plug one in and give us a fresh call... I was thinking about buying a rack of em, lol...
Harvey... what about you, Bud? Tube MP? Yea or nay?

I am really truly thinking bout the dbx 586 and the 3, umm, 376? Anyone else have a word on these also?
Paul
 
I heard everyone going on about ART here, so I got one of their pre's and a converter to try.
You really wanna know what I think of them?
I have used the DBX586 once, I think it was pretty good

I'm a bad one to ask, I'm a spoiled rotten bastard.
 
hmmm

Damn man, I can get EIGHT Mp's for the price of ONE 586! The dbx blew em away, huh? Funny thing is, I just got a new catalog today, and not only is dbx coming out with a $100 tube preamp like the ART, but Bellari also has one now and guess how much? $100. I almost want to think that the Bellari would be a good one to check out. We can only hope this RNMP is deserving of its name. Well, if you need a place to send the ART, I'll pay shipping! ;)
Anyone use HHB stuff?
Paul
 
Yeah..is there a reason we dont hear a peep about HHB when it comes to pres?

Thats not rhetorical question.
 
A word of comparison...

Tubedude, I saw in the Aark thread you have a DirectPro. Part of what led be to a separate pre was my experience with the Direct Pro. I was having trouble getting a good signal from the card when using compression, due the the card's lack of a makup gain on the compressor and the fact that I record @16 bits. To add hardware compression with no inserts, I also needed to bypass the pre on the card.

So to compare the direct pro's preamps to the 586: There is no comparison! Even though the goal was to improve the compression flexibility, the thing I immediately noticed was how much better the sound was due to the pre amp.

The sound is much more open to begin with, and I have a great deal of flexibility to tailor the sound if I desire.

I'm not claiming that these units (I have the 566 as well) are "high end" but I do think they ae competent and compare well to others in their price range. I may add better stuff in the future, but I also think that these will have a place in my rack for some time to come.
 
I think Cyan is buying a good second hand pre from ebay -- ask him how he's getting on with it
 
To all members,

Maybe I can help clear up some issues here.

There are three rev's of the VC3. Then it was switched to the VC3Q about a year and a half ago. The first VC3's had big problems with the RODE NT1. The reason for it was the RODE while claiming it was a 200 ohm load mic, was really tested at about 15 ohms under load. There really was no real fix for this problem except do not use a RODE NT1 with the early versions of Meek.

One of the other problems was the metering. The Brits (no offense) like to have a high level of overload margin, so when the red light came on, we Americans thought that meant it was clipping, when there was really an additional 26db of gain left before it was 3db down from clipping. So to really get a good sound from an older VC3, you had to crank the piss out of it and use you ears. If you heard some distortion, then you would back it down a bit. I know this is not the way to design gear, but Joemeek designer Ted Fletcher has his own ways of doing things, yet he does them well.

As for the enhancer, I think the issue with it was too many people use it wrong. Most of the time people would try to track with it, and that is not what anyone should do with it. The enhancer is a creative tool to fix tracks after they are recorded. So if you have a vocal track that has no life, (female singers have this problem), if you remixed the track and added a little enhancement, it works great. Same thing on acoustic guitar tracks with bad strings. It just adds a sweepable 2nd order harmonic that sparkles up the dead sounding tracks, but should never be tracked with, because once its on the track, you can't get it off.

Another problem with the earlier VC3's was there was a distortion when using it with the fast attack button, so you actually heard a distortion sound happening. It would go away when you switched the button to the slow attack. The good news is there is a fix for that, so if any of you have this problem, we will fix it under the warranty. Last, some very early VC3's were -10 unbalanced, and there is nothing I can do about that.

The mic pre on the VC3, and VC3Q is the SSM/PMI2017 chip. The same one used by DBX, Focusrite and others. It really is good and very quiet. It is the photo-optical compressor that adds that Joemeek tube like sound by also generating a 2nd order harmonic from the opto light source. This sound is something you either like, or do not. Obviously there are several situations like that on this group.

The Joemeek compressor, especially the VC3 is not easy to use and takes a good amount of time to get right. In addition, I would never try to use it for everything. It is great for vocals, guitars, basses, and drums.

The ART is a different animal. It is only a mic pre. Now I am sure it is good, but I have no practical experience with it, and since my friend Phil works at ART, my only comment is Hi Phil.

The VC3Q has really solved all of the problems I mentioned, but interfacing a unit to a room is not as easy as it seems. Floating RF, ground loops, bad cables, bad singers can all be issues you have to deal with to be sure the unit is working correctly. For what it is worth, the VC1Q is the box to have. Yes it is more, about $599.00, but I am not trying to sell it to you. It is just that is the best Joemeek box in my opinion.

As for Joemeek himself, there is no proof he killed anyone. That is just a theory by the police. The other is he was murdered by an extortionist because he was gay, and when the landlord heard the shot and walked in, she was shot by the one who shot Joe. So there are two sides, which one is true, we will never know, but if you go to the Joemeek appreciation society, you can read all about his life and contributions, He was a recording genius!

I hope I helped on this matter, and I am always available for any questions you may have.

Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group
Joemeek Studio Projects Trident-MTA
www.pmiaudio.com
 
Thanks for that Alan. I think the meeks are a great piece of prewear to have. The reason the art is generally more common is that its harder to screw up with. The meeks need tweaking to make them happen ... the compressor can destroy a vocal track very easily (as any compressor can) whereas the arttube doesnt have that issue. IMHO, there is a real dirth of creative niche gear that has a particular sound that isnt overused. Especially in the midrange pricepoint.
 
I'm out'a'line again! I have not yet heard one singly Meek pre which I thought did sound good.
I never even understood why people buy them.
 
Re: hmmm

tubedude said:
Bellari also has one now and guess how much? $100. I almost want to think that the Bellari would be a good one to check out.

I dunno which Bellari you're talking about, but the Bellari MP105 - which I believe was discontinued - was selling for $79.99 at GC a couple of months ago. List was supposedly $199.99...

I was going to buy one of these, but I didn't like that it wasn't rackmount and it just didn't inspire confidence, somehow.

There were a number of very disful comments about Bellari in some other threads, so...

Just to tell you how crazy I am, in the meantime while I'm waiting to buy more stuff, I'm considering scratch-building one of Fred Nachbaur's pure-tube preamp designs just as a goof.
 
sjoko2,

Your not out of line here, you just don't like them. No one manufacturer will ever please everyone. All ears are different, and in this case, this is what your hear. Who can argue with that?

However, there is a link below by Shakestheclown who offers up a five track recording using a Joemeek that is really awesome, and gives a real insight of what a Joemeek sounds like. Again, the meek is not for all, but for a box that sells for only $199.00, it offers more than most, and sounds good while doing it.

I will not go into all the artists and engineer users, as that has no place here, but a lot of hits are done on Joemeek, and you find them in all the major studios. Remember, it is a flavor, but one I think you need, as long as you can make it work for you. Listen to the MP3 below.



Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group
Torrance, CA
www.pmiaudio.com
 
Sjoko is saying that once you taste a steak, shit just doesnt taste the same.......
 
well...........even then, some people love shit just the same:)

DamnGidge! you bastard LOL Here is me making a big effort to be polite...................:D
 
I gotta agree with the Meek stuff sjoko2. I just don't get what people hear in them.

But, I have to disagree with the ART slam you put up....:)

I use them all the time, and a lot of time over a Drawmer 1960, and a Focusrite Red, and a TL Audio Classic. Certainly over a whacked out sounding Mackie!!!! :)

Have never heard a dbx pre I liked either. For me, in the same catagory at the Meek stuff.

I guess to each their own. The ART Pro MP has worked extremely well for me when tracking, and I ALWAYS run my mixes through a Dual MP into the computer.

Ed
 
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Man... I've used a Focusrite Red series, and I have to admit that it sounded, well... my jaw was on the floor. The sound coming through the monitors was delicious. I've NEVER heard anything sound like that did while tracking, and to be honest, in 24 bit mode I've never really heard a better sounding vocal track on a 16 bit CD. Ever. I'll not insert my foot too far here, cause I've never messed with an MP, really, but I have to say... it is hard to beleive that the MP could top the Focusrite. Really hard to beleive. I was literally jizzing all over myself. I'll see pretty soon though, they have a used MP down the road for $50 I'm gonna pick up.
I'll trade ya a used MP for a used Focusrite Red! I'll even through in an assortment of cables, a studio projects C1 and a new pair of socks.
 
I'll even through in an assortment of cables, a studio projects C1 and a new pair of socks.

I think the socks are gonna make this deal happen!

P.S. Do they have the two stripes at the top?
 
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3 stripes, 2 wide red ones, and a thin one in the middle. They are knee highs, very nice, barely used.
Check out my post to Priz in his RME post. I couldnt help it. My luck, it'll be the one time he listens to some advice and thrashes his new sound card. ;)
Peace,
Paul
 
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