Any suggestions on this mix?

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basstone

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I'm reworking some recordings done last summer. Here's a rough mix of one, but there are some considerations. Anything I do has to be done with the existing tape. The bassist is gone, and there is a second guitar now. The group will be coming up for a week or two to record again, so I'm mixing the old tracks to get ready and get a feel.

Here's a sample mp3:



Other than mastering (which probably isn't going to be done on this batch), any suggestions?

Thanks,

d...
 
Hope they're coming back with better sounding guitar amps.
 
Yes, the guitarist used his own (a Crate.. blechhh) on the last one. I'm putting him through one of the tube amps next time. Also, there is a reason the band added a second guitar...
 
Easy-E does metal!

This is so bad sounding it should be legendary.

Crates sound bad, but they don't sound *THAT* bad without some help.

Everything on this needs work. In those situations it's just better to start over. This is not salvagable IMHO.

Plus this should be posted in the Mp3 Clinic.
 
Wow... well, thanks for the input. I'll go eBay all my gear this weekend...
 
basstone said:
Wow... well, thanks for the input. I'll go eBay all my gear this weekend...
Click to expand...

This is just a really bad recording--EVERYTHING sounds bad... especially the guitar. It's obvious you're new to AE, so take it in stride. If you get a little bit better with each recording in a few years you'll be kicking butt.

What did you use to track this?
 
Well, let's see... the drums were miked with Peavey PVMs, the guitar with a SM57, the bass inline off an Eden 1510, and the vocals through an AKG C3000. That all ran to a Mackie 24-8, then down to to ADAT XTs. The mix came off the ADATs, to a Carvin MX1688, then to a Phillips CD recorder.

During the mixdown, I used a dbx266 and an ART Elite multieffects. The compressor was applied to the bass and drums, the reverb/effects to the guitar, vocals and cymbals.

The mp3 came off the disc using Express Rip. I was thinking about toying with the mix in either n-track or ProTools LE, but that was before it became legendary.. *smiles*

Actually, I guess it's not a bad thing. My first top-to-bottom mix, and I make some sort of history.

d...
 
Well.. after getting over my feelings of doubt and self-loathing (sniff) I went back and pulled the levels down at the board and raised the level at the recorder. It seems to have gotten rid of some nastiness and brought a little more definition.



Let me know if you can hear enough for some of this to become salvagable.

Cheers,

d...
 
Better, but that guitar is still ice-pick city. I don't think it's your fault though, it's obvious the guy sets his amp poorly.

Word of advice: don't be afraid to tell clients their sound isn't good. Granted, you have to do this diplomatically... tell them that the sound won't record well because of the mics, or "this is how the pro's do it" (why I always ask for reference CD's of bands they dig so I can research it a bit, or just BS, and say guitarist X sets his amp this way in the studio based on this article I read...) or that since this is a permanent recording you have to live with forever maybe working with the tone to make it equal to the song/band is a good idea.

I have ALL KINDS of little white lies to tell clients to trick them out of making bad choices. Honestly, it's our job to make them sound good so you use whatever tools are available.

Sometimes I'll tell them I'm adjusting microphones and while I'm in there will tweak a knob or two without telling them. Leave them in the control room for these types of maneuvers. Keep adjusting until you get it where they like it.
 
Funny you should mention that. That is how I got the bassist to go through the Eden. He wanted to use his guitar distortion pedal to get his "tone" instead of going through an ODB-3. I manged to sway him a little, but the guitarist just wouldn't switch.

I already warned him I don't want to see that Crate ever again.. or the Ibanez distortion he used with it.
 
Cloneboy makes a good point. When you're recording, you're capturing the band, first and foremost. When you're mixing live, you're reinforcing. The source in both situations is of the highest importance to the end result. Recording engineers and live sound techs are not magicians, and cannot make a shitty Crate combo sound anything like a good Mesa Boogie. It just doesn't happen.
 
peopleperson said:
Recording engineers and live sound techs are not magicians, and cannot make a shitty Crate combo sound anything like a good Mesa Boogie. It just doesn't happen.
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Sure we can, it's called REAMP. :)

But you gotta do it ahead of time and when the band isn't looking. Hehehehe.....
 
Haha. Oh how I've been tempted.

A live mixing buddy of mine is an entertainly evil bastard when it comes to this stuff. He'll go out to do sound, and just in case, he generally carries a drum module of some kind and will use the stage drum inputs to trigger way better sounding hits if the drummer doesn't have his stuff together, and of course won't say anything about it to anyone. Great stuff.

I think ethically it's kind of weird because when recording, your only job is to faithfully capture what's happening, unless of course you're being asked to do something else entirely, but it is sometimes entertaining to watch players realize just how bad their gear sounds or is dialed in only after they've heard it properly recorded. I dunno, I really don't care too much either way. If I'm gonna stamp my name on anything, it only means I did the job I was asked to do. At the end of the day, the only thing I truly care about is that everyone walks away happy, and I walk away paid in full. And besides, it's not my job to spend a bunch of my extra time attempting to make a band sound better than they actually sound.

I'm really not as purist as I may sound, I just only care when I really need to.
 
I don't 'faithfully capture'... to me recording is about enhancing and improving to meet the artist's vision. Sometimes faithful is their vision, most of the time it isn't. Especially in the non-pro world.
 
I know what you're saying and I agree that recording from that angle is equally as important and downright fun. Some bands sound better trying to make their Sgt. Pepper, and other bands sound better trying to make their Highway to hell.
 
HAHA.

Too bad they aren't making more Goat's, or Liar's, or Head's for that matter.
 
basstone said:
Well.. after getting over my feelings of doubt and self-loathing (sniff) I went back and pulled the levels down at the board and raised the level at the recorder. It seems to have gotten rid of some nastiness and brought a little more definition.



Let me know if you can hear enough for some of this to become salvagable.

Cheers,

d...
Click to expand...


I've heard the mix and the only thing that comes to mind is a visual image.

"You have a bar, people are drinking, and some band is playing on stage"
In other words, it sounds like someone just dropped a mic in front of the band, hit record and left to get a quick bite to eat.

Interesting stuff yet,

The guitars are definitely the main attraction on this one, since they have no definition whatsoever. The guitars could use better shaping, I think that would be a good start for a better recording. ;)


Lee
 
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