Any Feedback on the APEX 460 Tube Mic?...

  • Thread starter Thread starter kidvybes
  • Start date Start date
kidvybes

kidvybes

New member
...I've been hearing some good stuff locally regarding the APEX 460 Tube mic...they go pretty cheap and are easily upgraded in the tube application...anybody else out there with any experience with APEX microphone product?...chime in please...
 
Sizzle. The top end on these things is weird (also the 450). My advice would be use the money to make a downpayment on a mic that will hold your interest longer. But that's just me :)
 
Here is another opinion.....this microphone kicks some serious ass!!!

We held a mic shootout here in Vancouver at the Factory Studios (formerly Little Mountain Sound.....Ozzy, Mettalica, Motley Crue etc) and put this mic head to head against some serious competition. In all but ONE case, in a blind test, this mic won. The chain was simple.....Mic --->Neve. Sources used were Male vocals, Female vocals and acoustic guitar. Now granted, it wont be perfect on all vocals or guitars but for the money?? We bought 4.

Another thing worth mentioning.....these mics come with a 12ax7 tube installed. You wanna control the top end "weirdness" and get a little more warmth??? Swap it out for a 12AU7 instead. Also, the mic comes with its own power supply and cable to connect it. I highly recommend you get this cable custom made using higher quality wire and ends.

Rating out of ten......(10 being best)

Out of the box......7
Modded...............9

Cheers!
 
IMO this mic sounds like crap out of the box. The high-end is indeed REALLY weird. I don't see how it could win any shootout unless people were only listening on headphones - which seems to control the extreme sibilance problems and fuziness.

All that said, it makes a decent candidate for mods.
Removing the inner mesh screen will improve the fuzz factor. Changing the tube to a lower-gain version will help control sibilance. Using a better/shorter cable could help some, but given the impedance is extremely low, I doubt it - the cable capacitance just isn't enough over any reasonble length to noticeably affect sound quality.

The biggest problems with this mic's design are:

1) Transformer
2) Grille
3) Capsule
4) Tube

It's basically an AKG C12 copy. The build quality is really good for the price - it even has a suspended rubber mount for the tube. Cool shockmount, decent PSU. The mic looks good and is built like a tank. The parts, unfortunately, are of terrible quality.
This makes it a good candidate for a complete retrofit, if you're into that sort of thing. Turning it into a G7 with a Peluso 251 capsule would be a great idea.

I wouldn't buy it to use as-is.


Of course now I have to admit that I used a borrowed, stock, 460 to cut some male vox the other day and they sound great - better than any other mic I had. But this is definitely the exception rather than the rule. And I'm still trying to deal with the sibilance problems it introduced. But it just happened to give this particular voice a more "open" quality than my other mics.
I still wouldn't buy it, because it's never been half as good on any other sources, including any other male voices.
 
Good post bleyrad. I've never been modder/retrofitter. To soup one of these guys up into a Peluso wannabe C12 what are you looking at in terms of cost?

Also the power supply on that thing is good? I'm assuming you took it apart (I didn't) - it sure looked and felt cheap as hell.
 
Compared to what?...

...I appreciate the input from you guys...in that same price range, how does the Apex compare to the ADK Generis GT2, Nady Tube mics, MXL tube mics?...
the MXLs seem to get the best reviews...I posted another thread on upgrading the tubes in these "bargain" tube mics, and I got negative input about using a 12AU7 in a mic (gain is too low), so I'm a bit skeptical about the use in an Apex...12AT7/ECC81 or 6072 seem to be the tubes of choice in a good tube mic application...
 
I just got a 460 - I have been working with a very limited gear budget recently and the 460 seemed to be the only tube mic in my price range (sub $250). The day I got it I swapped out the stock tube with a Groove Tubes 12AX7M (Mullard reissue - one of the best new production tubes) - but I guess I should also try out a 12AU7. I don't know if the principle works with tube mics, but with tube guitar amps they say that you have to break tubes in a bit (though hours and hours of use) before they really settle into their tone - I am hoping this will be the case with this tube/mic.

I definitely noticed the sizzle/sibilance problem on vocals right away, but I still like the mic - it's better than my AKG 3000B, for what it's worth, and also a step up from the Apex 415 (which I also own and have been using lately). I just need to tweak the EQ on my preamp a bit to get the right tone. So far the guitar tracks that I have recorded with the mic have had greater presence than those I recorded with my SM-57.

I am interested in modding this mic - how does one replace the capsule? How do you remove the inner mesh screen?

- Chris
 
indravayu said:
I am interested in modding this mic - how does one replace the capsule? How do you remove the inner mesh screen?

- Chris
Click to expand...



I don't meant to be a downer, but if you have to ask, don't do it. I'm serious. There are so many other factors that come into play that you really need to know what you're doing before attempting this type of thing.
Removing the screen, you could maybe do without modding experience, but I wouldn't go any further than that. Remember you will void your warranty and possibly ruin the mic (that kind of thing happens more often than you think). Basically you need to find your way into the inside of the grille and cut out the inside layer. That's all.

If you want to start learning, check out http://www.prodigy-pro.com/forum and spend a few months reading everything there.
 
bleyrad said:
I don't meant to be a downer, but if you have to ask, don't do it. I'm serious. There are so many other factors that come into play that you really need to know what you're doing before attempting this type of thing.
Removing the screen, you could maybe do without modding experience, but I wouldn't go any further than that. Remember you will void your warranty and possibly ruin the mic (that kind of thing happens more often than you think). Basically you need to find your way into the inside of the grille and cut out the inside layer. That's all.

If you want to start learning, check out http://www.prodigy-pro.com/forum and spend a few months reading everything there.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice and the link (I will check the site out right away) - I figured it would probably be something that's beyond my abilities, but thought I'd ask anyway.

Cheers,
Chris
 
bleyrad your in vancouver too!!

I guess everyone will have different opinions about everything all the time but you should go down to L&M and talk to Mark. He was the one who organized the shootout and maybe i worded it wrong above......but the mic was a solid candidate against everything we put it against. The test itself was done quickly with no tweaking and it was really surprising the results.

Worth looking into and inquiring about.

The components you listed in your post.....do you know where they can be had here?? At $250 a mic it is worth it for me to buy another and mod the hell out of it simply for experimentation.

Cheers!
 
Toy Room said:
bleyrad your in vancouver too!!

I guess everyone will have different opinions about everything all the time but you should go down to L&M and talk to Mark. He was the one who organized the shootout and maybe i worded it wrong above......but the mic was a solid candidate against everything we put it against. The test itself was done quickly with no tweaking and it was really surprising the results.
Click to expand...

I recently spent a few hours with one of Mark's henchmen in their Protools room, auditioning most of the vocal mics they had on hand, from a V67 to a Cad VSM1.
My experiences there with the Apex were the same as with the loaner I have on hand. Scooped sound, fizzly and sibilant high-end that pretty much makes it unusable on most vocals. This guy told me all about the shootout you're referring to, but my first-hand results simply don't jive with it. You have to remember that Apex is a Long and McQuade-owned brand, and though they're good guys I wouldn't necessarily put it past them to modify their test mic to sound better in the shootout.


The components you listed in your post.....do you know where they can be had here?? At $250 a mic it is worth it for me to buy another and mod the hell out of it simply for experimentation.
Click to expand...

You can get the Peluso cap for around $250 from Mr. Peluso himself, and most of the electronics components you need you can get from Digikey or even a local store if you want (RP Electronics in Burnaby is good).
 
Just an update on my Apex 460 - last night I exchanged the Groove Tubes 12AX7M (Mullard reissue), which I had originally used to replace the stock tube, with an NOS Mullard CV4024 / 12AT7WA and I am very impressed with the results. As others here suggested would happen, it's now a good deal less "gainy" - the high end sizzle was greatly reduced and the over all tone of the mic was warmed up/smoothed out quite a bit - I especially liked how it was sounding after about 2 hours of use.

I am sure that it's still not on par with any $1500+ mics, but for my purposes (and budget) it sounds great - much more alive than the AKG C3000B that I was previously using.

Just thought I'd share.

- Chris
 
Mullard 4024

That Mullard NOS 4024/12at7WA (military grade 12at7) is one of the real steals in the vintage tube market...I purchased on Ebay for $13.99 and used it in my MXL V69M in place of the stock MXL (Sovtek/Russian) tube...definately smoothed out the upper register...for $14. how can you go wrong...Mullards are stock in many of the elite high-end tube mics...here's the link to that seller on Ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=64629&item=5748555820&rd=1


PS...the 12au7 you mentioned, in your earlier posting above, wouldn't do justice to the mic since the gain factor in those tubes is much lower than the 12at7 series (been there, tried that!)...
 
Thanks for the link on the Mullard 12at7's, I've ordered a couple.... I want to try one in my VTB-1 preamp too :) Have any of you tried that?
Back to the Apex mic. L. & M. are having a big nationwide sale this coming wk.-end... Any word on whether or not these mics will be on sale ?
 
about the VTB1...

I'd really like to hear how you make out on that tube swap in the VTB-1...please be sure to post or send me a message about the results...
As far as the Apex goes, I'd recommend considering the deal on the new MXL 960 Tube Mogami Edition...$179.99 on sale...I got mine, upgraded the tube and it sounds real nice (too nice to be under $200.!!!)...worth a look...

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=rec/search/detail/base_pid/273101/
 
another interested Vancouverite here

OK, just for the record (another Vancouverite here), I own a few Apex mics (435 and a couple of pencil cardoids with switchable pattern head elements) and I actually really love them. Now that being said, I spent like $200 CDN on the whole pack, so compared to the competition these are just better for the money. That's like $68 CDN ($50 US) for a large diaphram condensor mic with switchable 100 Hz rolloff. And Personally I kind of like the brightness, especially for female ballads. It's so nice with a really good reverb. Sizzle can be a selling factor. And while the transformer could be replaced with something nicer, as long as you're a good engineer you can make these mics shine. I couldn't make a beta 58 sound like this when I tried in a recording.

But I'm saving up for a nice main mic now and we'll just have to see what's available. Thanks for all the good tips I've read here, I'll have to drop by L&M and see what the truth is myself about the higher end APEX mics and their competition. I certainly find that the build quality inside the APEX mics is very very good.
 
good for the money points 9
hi end sounds like crap points 10

net result

-1
 
good stuff and appropriate to the latest controversy.
 
...just as an update to this thread, we now know that the Apex 460, Nady TCM1150, the Carvin CTM100, and the newest member of the family, the Telefunken R-F-T M16 all share the same pedigree (or lack of, if you prefer)...all price points, from $159. to $1400. are also covered...take your pick...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top