Amp Modeler or New Amp?

Amp Modeler or New Amp?

  • Amp Modeler

    Votes: 11 50.0%

  • New Amp

    Votes: 11 50.0%
  • Total voters
    22
V

valacirca

New member
I was looking for a room amp that will be used exclusively for recording but someone suggested that I should look into a Line 6 POD XT Live instead due to my setup.

My place is a studio-type apartment that's 30sqm big and I have neighbors in the adjacent units. Although the walls are soundproofed pretty well, I'd still prefer to work at "bedroomish" volume-levels. Or if possible, do some silent recording.

What would you suggest considering my setup? A new amp to mic or an amp modeler for silent recording instead?

Recording Gear:
Behringer DI100 DI Box
Wharfedale 16x2 EZ-M Mixer
Behringer UCA202 Audio Interface
a cheap Audio-Technica mic (but I plan to upgrade to either a Sennheiser e609 or Shure SM57 if I continue recording via a mic'ed amp)

Guitar:
Squier Strat (planning to upgrade to a Fender Jaguar down the line, but not in the near future)

Current Amp:
Marshall MG30DFX

Pedals:
Memory Boy
Cathedral
Big Muff /w Tone Wicker
Metal Muff
Soul Preacher
(all EHX. yeah I know... I'm a fanboi for now)

Music of Choice: Post-Rock, Drone, Ambient, Doom Metal, Sludge Metal, Stoner Metal, Folk Metal, Heavy Psych, Shoegaze, Slowcore (mostly music with a lot of dynamics and atmosphere)

Tone of Choice: a smooth, warm & fat tone

Budget: Hopefully not more than $500
 
Depending on how much computing power you have, software modelling just keeps getting better (guitar rig 4, amplitude 3 for example). Lots of outboard gear available as well that can go into computer via usb, firewire or analog into your interface(s).

My opinion is amp if you live gig, or jam and need the portability/loudness etc. For straight recording, modelling or outboard gear.

I use a VG-99 into computer and can crank my monitors when I'm just noodling around and get a very decent volume in my room.

Many modelers have demos you can try to see what you think.
 
Is this like a trick question??? :laughings:

AMP!!! :cool:

You can get low wattage amps and/or attenuators for them...
...and then stick the amp in a full closet.

You will be able to run the amp fairly hot...but without annoying anyone.
Then, when the situation allows it...you can play loud, and you will also have a cool new amp to take to jams/gigs.
You don't wanna show up with a... "YUK"... modeler do you? :D

Oh...and get a REAL tube amp...forget all that on-board DSP crap!
You'll be happy you did.
 
A real amp in a good space well mic'd with the right mic(s) will sound better generally speaking

However.......

-Amp sims take a bad room out of the equation
-Give you the option of potentially multiple varieties of Amp heads and Cabs, Multiple mic types and positions, multiple different room IRs
-if you take the time to set up beyond just presets you can get quite an individual sound from them
-usually have a free trial period so you can experiment and see if it works for your situation
-can be played through headphones any time, day or night, without worrying neighbors

So as well as the neighbor considerations, which althoug poilte, doesn't effect recorded sound (unless you catch the sound of them yelling at you to be quiet or banging on the ceiling) ask yourself:

Do I have a good/great recording room
Do I have the right mics
Am I confident in my ability to capture the sound I want, in the room I am stuck with, with the mics I have
Do I need more than one option of amp/Cab to get what I need
I tried some free demos of amp sims and I like/don't Like how they sound on my material

Then go ahead and pick the cool aid you want to drink because of what works and doesn't work for you in your recording situation and not because it's what some guy said on the internet
 
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A guitar player does not need 40 different tones.
A guitar player does need 1 or 2 killer tones.

An amp sim will not get you a killer tone. It will give you 40 useable tones.

Get a great amp/cabinet.
 
Chibi Nappa said:
A guitar player does not need 40 different tones.
A guitar player does need 1 or 2 killer tones.

An amp sim will not get you a killer tone. It will give you 40 useable tones.

Get a great amp/cabinet.
Click to expand...

I agree completely.

Having said that if you intend to record other people with various styles, simulators can be usable and useful, but may not sound as good. I've used Line6 stuff more than any other sim, and a few of the tones were easy to work with but a lot of them required a lot of work to make them sound good.
 
Bristol Posse said:
-Amp sims take a bad room out of the equation
-Give you the option of potentially multiple varieties of Amp heads and Cabs, Multiple mic types and positions, multiple different room IRs
-if you take the time to set up beyond just presets you can get quite an individual sound from them
-usually have a free trial period so you can experiment and see if it works for your situation
-can be played through headphones any time, day or night, without worrying neighbors.

So as well as the neighbor considerations, which althoug poilte, doesn't effect recorded sound (unless you catch the sound of them yelling at you to be quiet or banging on the ceiling) ask yourself:

Do I have a good/great recording room
Do I have the right mics
Am I confident in my ability to capture the sound I want, in the room I am stuck with, with the mics I have
Do I need more than one option of amp/Cab to get what I need
I tried some free demos of amp sims and I like/don't Like how they sound on my material
Click to expand...


I get what you are saying…but think too much is made of the "room" in the whole equation.
Sure...if you want a lot of room sound in your mic, then it helps to have the *right* room sound...which isn't always the right sound even if you have one great room.
Since I don't have even a single "world class" room....I always take the room out of the equation (about 95% out) with much of my tracking...and I still use real amps, cabs and mics.
I just make a "tent" over the amp/cab/mic area using some basic blankets/quilts. I then add my room ambience during mixdown.

Also, you don't need a lot of mics or very expensive mics.
I have a bunch of mics and some expensive ones...but I've been doing a most of my guitar tracks with one or two sub-$200 mics. And while I do have several great amps and cabs in my studio...sometimes I just do all my tracks with a single amp/cab/mic...and all I do to get different tones is switch guitars and/or change the settings on amp and/or guitar.

AFA having "multiple varieties of Amp heads and Cabs" in a sim...well , that is its own form of Kool Aid.
They are just mathematical equations some programmer strung together...they are NOT the amps/cabs/mics their preset names claim to be. ;)

It's nice to have many types of anything on hand...but not a necessity.
Like how many dramatically different guitar tones are really needed???
I just don't get why anyone needs 40 amp/cab presets in order to be able to get decent tracks.
Most times all that is needed are just subtle Volume/Tone adjustments you can do off of one amp.

Some guys that play live and do all kinds of covers from soup to nuts...yeah, maybe they "need" (?) 40 different guitar tones, but even in those situations, if you have 3-4 great tones...you can play anything with them...and it really doesn't have to sound like the record “to-a-T”, but I can understand that some guys just have to have it. :D
 
Im a real fan of recording real amp, although if you cant turn the volume up to get the tubes (If it is a tube amp) working good i would absolutly go for a amp simulator.

I will suggest you looking into Softubes Vintage Amproom - Metal Amproom. Both deliver the best amp simulatet tones ive ever heard, no doubt. I wasent a real fan of amp sims, till i heard Softubes plugins.
They are very simple, you got you amp eq, and you crunch level (On the vintage amproom you got a few more for vibes and stuff) and then you got you mic placement. For the vintage Amproom you got one mic and three cabs (Which is A mashall stackish amp, a Fenderish amp, and a Voxish amp. On the Metal amproom you got too 4x12 cabs, and too mics for placement.

Ive gotton very pleasent tones with them both.

They also made a great Bass Amp Room which sounds very cool too.

Look for them at www.softube.se
 
miroslav said:
I get what you are saying…but think too much is made of the "room" in the whole equation.
Sure...if you want a lot of room sound in your mic, then it helps to have the *right* room sound...which isn't always the right sound even if you have one great room.
Since I don't have even a single "world class" room....I always take the room out of the equation (about 95% out) with much of my tracking...and I still use real amps, cabs and mics.
I just make a "tent" over the amp/cab/mic area using some basic blankets/quilts. I then add my room ambience during mixdown.

Also, you don't need a lot of mics or very expensive mics.
I have a bunch of mics and some expensive ones...but I've been doing a most of my guitar tracks with one or two sub-$200 mics. And while I do have several great amps and cabs in my studio...sometimes I just do all my tracks with a single amp/cab/mic...and all I do to get different tones is switch guitars and/or change the settings on amp and/or guitar.

AFA having "multiple varieties of Amp heads and Cabs" in a sim...well , that is its own form of Kool Aid.
They are just mathematical equations some programmer strung together...they are NOT the amps/cabs/mics their preset names claim to be. ;)

It's nice to have many types of anything on hand...but not a necessity.
Like how many dramatically different guitar tones are really needed???
I just don't get why anyone needs 40 amp/cab presets in order to be able to get decent tracks.
Most times all that is needed are just subtle Volume/Tone adjustments you can do off of one amp.

Some guys that play live and do all kinds of covers from soup to nuts...yeah, maybe they "need" (?) 40 different guitar tones, but even in those situations, if you have 3-4 great tones...you can play anything with them...and it really doesn't have to sound like the record “to-a-T”, but I can understand that some guys just have to have it. :D
Click to expand...

I'm not condoning one over the other. I know which I like and that works for me in my setup in my recording/mixing environment. but since the OP is not me with my gear, in my room (unless there is some late night breaking and entering going on), with my own playing quirks and individual taste, working with my material, what I personally like is largely irrelevant. So I'm simply presenting the suggestion he ask himself a couple of questions and try a couple of demos first because they are free and then he will know for sure that in his specific situation (which should be the one that matters to him), not mine, not yours, not anyone elses, either it works or it doesn't and that should really be what matters to the OP.

I'm becoming increasingly fascinated by the trust people are prepared to put into the advice of uncredentialed, annonymous strangers on the internet as to how they should spend their hard earned cash. And how they will spend hours debating and fighting the issue on forums rather than spending ten minutes actually trying something on their own setup to see how it works for them. there is some kind of weird need for validation because people think their own istincts couldn't possibly be right or something going on.

I'm trying to reflect that in my posts
 
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Bristol Posse said:
I'm becoming increasingly fascinated by the trust people are prepared to put into the advice of uncredentialed, annonymous strangers on the internet as to how they should spend their hard earned cash. And how they will spend hours debating and fighting the issue on forums rather than spending ten minutes actually trying something on their own setup to see how it works for them. there is some kind of weird need for validation because people think their own istincts couldn't possibly be right or something going on.

I'm trying to reflect that in my posts
Click to expand...

I agree whole heartedly. I lurked on forums trying to learn stuff. Now, I try to answer questions when I have a relatively informed response and opinion. Sometimes I even find I have developed an opinion from reading posts. Gonna have to stop doing that.

Now, I found $20 in a jacket today. What's the best guitar/amp/DAW/VST/effects/mic/preamp/ out there today. Gonna spend some doe ray meeeee!
 
I'm not talking about software amp modelers btw guys... I mean something like this:

POD_XT_Live.jpg
 
I'm not talking about software amp modelers btw guys... I mean something like this:
Click to expand...

Well it's still software handling the modelling just in a separate box from the computer which makes the demo aspect a little trickier

Ask your local music store or online vendor what their return policy is so you can try both a POD and a new amp and return if you don't like.
If someone you know specifically recomended this POD can you borrow it from them to see how you like it

you'll get a million different answers on the forums as to which option is "Best" all based on the respondants personal preference and with no knowledge of what you want to get out of your gear, how it will be used etc etc. You are the best judge of what is best for your situation
 
There are numerous free amp sims online.
Of the ones I've tried, the Acme Bar Gig stuff (http://www.acmebargig.com/) seems very cool and useful...and it's free. I like free.

I have a Line 6 Pod XT Live. It sounds great when I use it to record. I haven't A-B'd it against the amp sims, but I intend to soon.

I also picked up a Johnson J-Station recently. I can record my guitar and bass through that. Makes life easier.

Whatever you do, have fun!
 
I have the Acme Bar Gig stuff and I find it very unusable... I don't like the tone and quality, tbh.

If using a Line 6 POD produces anywhere near the same tone and quality, I'm definitely getting a new amp instead.
 
WavePro said:
Im a real fan of recording real amp, although if you cant turn the volume up to get the tubes (If it is a tube amp) working good...
Click to expand...

An attenuator solves that easy enough.


Bristol Posse said:
I'm becoming increasingly fascinated by the trust people are prepared to put into the advice of uncredentialed, annonymous strangers on the internet as to how they should spend their hard earned cash. And how they will spend hours debating and fighting the issue on forums rather than spending ten minutes actually trying something on their own setup to see how it works for them. there is some kind of weird need for validation because people think their own istincts couldn't possibly be right or something going on.

I'm trying to reflect that in my posts
Click to expand...

"uncredentialed"...? :D

It's a forum...people ask for opinions about amps, mics, guitars...etc.
They’re not life changing "how should I treat this brain tumor" kind of questions. ;)

Does the sales guy at the music store have credentials...or the guy playing at a bar gig...or the guy you jammed with last week...etc?

Look, I wasn't specifically debating your points, so don’t take it so personally...I was just using them to give the OP another take on the question at hand since he did come here specifically asking for opinions one way or the other.
Sure....you can just give equal pros/cons for both views, which is fine...but it just happens that my opinion about the OP's question is more specific and distinct and it’s based on my own experiences…
…and that’s all the credentials anyone needs to take part in this forum process. :)
 
valacirca said:
I have the Acme Bar Gig stuff and I find it very unusable... I don't like the tone and quality, tbh.

If using a Line 6 POD produces anywhere near the same tone and quality, I'm definitely getting a new amp instead.
Click to expand...

Get the new amp....and while I don't know your budget, I will say, get the best amp you can.
You will feel better and play better...and that amp will be around long after the sims get tired and boring.
 
Bristol Posse said:
I'm becoming increasingly fascinated by the trust people are prepared to put into the advice of uncredentialed, annonymous strangers on the internet as to how they should spend their hard earned cash. And how they will spend hours debating and fighting the issue on forums rather than spending ten minutes actually trying something on their own setup to see how it works for them. there is some kind of weird need for validation because people think their own istincts couldn't possibly be right or something going on.

I'm trying to reflect that in my posts
Click to expand...
Washburn100 said:
I agree whole heartedly. I lurked on forums trying to learn stuff. Now, I try to answer questions when I have a relatively informed response and opinion. Sometimes I even find I have developed an opinion from reading posts. Gonna have to stop doing that.

Now, I found $20 in a jacket today. What's the best guitar/amp/DAW/VST/effects/mic/preamp/ out there today. Gonna spend some doe ray meeeee!
Click to expand...
What you guys have to understand though is not everyone has the luxury of trying out stuff primarily due to availability. If I wanted to try out say, a Bugera V22, I wouldn't know how because there aren't any music stores that carry that where I live and no one I know owns one. This applies to A LOT of other gear - the Line 6 POD included.

I doubt if every tom, dick and harry that asks advice is out to build their professional-sounding studio rig. Most I feel just want a useable setup that can faithfully reproduce their sound. That's why people value input from people here who might have given similar advice or went through the same thing in the past. And it's not like I'm asking on a sports forum... this is a home recording forum, so I assume there are a handful of people here that know what they're talking about.

At the end of the day, I realize one will ultimately have to collate all this advice, try to weed out the bad ones from the good, couple it with supplementary research and make a personal decision on what to buy... But the input coming from "uncredentialed, annonymous strangers on the internet" is still important, imho.
 
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