Always

[TAE]

Ok based on the comments and suggestions of the last song I posted "A song for you" ...trying to pull off live recordings of just me and my piano... I went from a sm57 to a ADK A 51ST condenser mic...that of course introduced me to the problem of a good mic picking up EVERYTHING including the flourescent lights, the crickets, the pounding of the keys, the squeak of my chair and the sustain pedal...Shit!

Put a piece of glass over the keys to defuse the noise they make ( I reach under to play) , oiled the chair and pedal..killed the crickets, got some candles that create a nice ambiance and and allowed me turn of the flourecent lights and then made a little isolation box for the mic...I am now able to get a decent live recording of me playing the keys and singing at the same time...now playing and singing flawlessly is pretty much impossible..but anyway it will just take several takes to bang these tunes out...but I am on the path.

I was encouraged to bring the vocals out... "Always" is an oldy written by Irving Berlin that was my Mom's favorite so I've wanted to record it in her memory for a while... This is a first shot and I think in this case I think the vocals are too out front...
Below are a few other ones I want to try and do well..sucks I can't play and sing perfect all the way through a dang song...Ill get there dang it.. Anyway I just went out and banged these out this morning to give it a try...I hope to do a real nice version of these as I progress in facing the monster of digital audio reproduction...

Opinions, suggestions and encouragement are appreciated.


Irving Berlins "Always"
Rhianna's Stay
The Hollies "He aint heavy"

 

[dobro]

Beautiful take on this one, man - I really like it.

There's some extraneous background noise behind the vocal. Probably you moving on the bench, but I'm not sure. For example, check the 1.34 mark where you're singing 'not for a year'. There's some kind of pulse trailing after the vocal. It sounds like distant crows or something. How big are those crickets you mentioned?

The vocal in the mix: turn it down a notch cuz it's too loud vis a vis the piano. And cut the verb on it. I think you're getting some proximity effect as well cuz you cozied up to the mic, so try to cut that a bit with the EQ.

You're good at this stuff. Hey did you overdub, or do everything at the same time? Reason I ask is cuz it's easier removing unwanted noise from overdubs.

 

[TAE]

Too funny...good ear Dobro.... had the door open and there was a frickin crow.. I definitely need to learn how to be QUIET with that dang condenser mic...what a freekin difference in the pick up of noise...

No fiddling with the audio, what you are hearing here is absolute raw from the output...running the mic through a UX8 / pod farm effects to the digital in of the piano and the piano to an Onkyo stereo...Right now I'm ying off the rca's coming from the piano to the stereo amp into the little Sony stereo recorder...definitely sounds different from the output of the amps headphone out..I am going to try Y-ing off the headphone jack on the next attempt...

Thanks for the encouragement and advice.

 

[SOUND DIAGNOSIS]

Up close and personal here! I felt your stubble! Agree with Dobro about pulling back the vocals in the mix, but I also think the natural sounds in between phrases that are ducked out NEED to be in there to preserve the natural feel of the expressive nature of the material presented. I do like the proximity effect here but taming it and the overall dynamic spread with gentle compression may be worthwhile trying. Very cool cover! Enjoyed!!! Crickets, clocks, air conditioners......yeah.....tell me about it!!!!!

 

[robgreen]

Wow, nice capture of the sound. The piano sounds very rich and full with a nice sustain. I listened to the Rihanna cover. It brought Antony & the Johnsons to mind a little in the piano tone and the torch song feel.

I'd never heard the original, so I looked it up on youtube. Really didn't like it very much at all, but I do like your version.

I'd love to hear the difference that the new mic is making for you. Do you have anything uploaded with a similar setup, but using the SM57? If it's a hassle to do so then no bother, but it would be interesting to hear.

 

[TAE]

Thanks Sound Diagnosis interesting feedback on "keeping it real"

This is an exercise in exactly that... just trying to get that magical balance where once I press record..what gets laid down is what you get...no fiddling with it. Keep in mind the current set up is being recorded in already mixed stereo in one shot into a little sony IC recorder..I can export the tracks into audacity and mess with the sound but I am really trying to get it where what is recorded is what I put out..like these...the mix just isn't quite there yet... As I was typing this I realized I could send the vocals into the left, the piano into the right and then mix them after the fact...but then that defeats the purpose of this exercise and there I am fiddling again

I have a lot of tunes and what has been holding me back is wanting to attain a Phil Spector wall of sound dream production of each tune... walking away from all other instruments back to bare bones "me n my piano" sure streamlines things.

I'm feeling a whole lot more confident that I can make this simple system work..

Thanks!

 

[TAE]

Wow, nice capture of the sound. The piano sounds very rich and full with a nice sustain. I listened to the Rihanna cover. It brought Antony & the Johnsons to mind a little in the piano tone and the torch song feel.

I'd never heard the original, so I looked it up on youtube. Really didn't like it very much at all, but I do like your version.

I'd love to hear the difference that the new mic is making for you. Do you have anything uploaded with a similar setup, but using the SM57? If it's a hassle to do so then no bother, but it would be interesting to hear.

Hey Rob...Thank you for the kind words... That you like my version better than Rhianna's is humbling....I really like her vocal version a hell of a lot better than mine but I definitely like what I did with the piano over the very basic piano in her version...

Here is A SONG FOR YOU it's the first recording that I posted here in the clinic and same set up but using an SM57.. Embarrassingly the ADK has been sitting in the back room since 2005 and has never been used, waiting for that magical day when "I got my home studio built" so glad I was advised to try a better mic...really makes it a LOT easier to sing without having to scream...the vocal nuances are so easy to express with a good mic...had no idea what a difference it made on the performing side.

BTW the piano is a Yamaha MOX8 using a sustain pedal directly out into the stereo...no mixing or extra effects...factory sound..actually the first one on the buttons "Grand Piano"..the keyboard has a ton of sounds that can get me lost for hours...need to stay on track..

Kind of try and stay in the loop on music but sadly I had never heard of Anthony and Johnsons... checked out his stuff on Youtube...yeah he's got a cool schtick going on...not a fan of the tremolo vocal thing but really awesome interpretations of various covers. I definitely see where we are on similar wave lengths..

 

[TripleM]

I listened to Always. I thought the vocal clarity was outstanding. A bit brittle and lacking some warmth. But very clear.

I thought the piano was a bit far back. It was dominated by the vocal.

I'd dry up things just a bit.

The clarity on the piano didn't seem as good as that of the vocal. But that could be because it was softer.

I'm hearing a periodic clicking or tapping going on. Not sure what's causing it. It's not a digital pop. But I'm not sure what it is.

Something strange going on starting at 1:33. Between 1:33 and 1:36 I seem to be hearing a second recording going on in the background. Happens again in the 1:50's and again around 2:03.

 

[dobro]

I'm hearing a periodic clicking or tapping going on. Not sure what's causing it. It's not a digital pop. But I'm not sure what it is.

It's crows. Some studios have ground loops, and some studios have crows.

 

[rayc]

Ground loop crows.
Did you adjust the mic for proximity effect? Some have an adjustment (bass roll off).
there's bit of hiss or rattle around your voice - kind of like the rattle of a snare drum when the bass guitar is doing a solo.
Nice voice, playing & performance - as ALWAYS!

 

[TripleM]

It's crows. Some studios have ground loops, and some studios have crows.

Suddenly there was a tapping. As if someone gently rapping... and so on.

That "second recording" I was hearing must have been the "crow" saying, "Nevermore."

 

[TAE]

Yo Ray...I did not flip the switch to the -10 db...I'll experiment and see.... It has a tri polar pattern and a roll off switch ..Here's a pic I found on the net of the not so infamous ADK A 51st bad boy...
I am stoked by the difference it makes in voice capture..but thrown into the world of noise killing which though I sure can't hear these nuances as well as others here but it makes for an interesting quest in this recording exercise..

 

[TAE]

Suddenly there was a tapping. As if someone gently rapping... and so on.

That "second recording" I was hearing must have been the "crow" saying, "Nevermore."

Man tough crowd

Your guys ears are way better than mine...sad...ears are kind of important when recording......I mean I can hear but all those ear ringing concerts I went to in the 70's combined with a lot of construction work ear damage from demo hammers and wet saws cutting tile etc..sure took their share of the toll.

I'm thinking the gentle rapping may be some of the key click of the piano as I'm singing / playing... I placed a dual pane piece of clace from an old sliding glass door over the MOX8 and canitilevered it about 6" out past the keys...then reach under to play....a little cumbersome..

The mic iso box is set back a few inches so I can see the keys...but is probably still catching a little bit of it...

 

[TripleM]

Check out 1:33 on Always - which was one time I marked in my first post in the thread. It happened before then and after then. But I remember it happened at 1:33.

 

[robgreen]

Hey Rob...Thank you for the kind words... That you like my version better than Rhianna's is humbling....I really like her vocal version a hell of a lot better than mine but I definitely like what I did with the piano over the very basic piano in her version...

Here is A SONG FOR YOU it's the first recording that I posted here in the clinic and same set up but using an SM57.. Embarrassingly the ADK has been sitting in the back room since 2005 and has never been used, waiting for that magical day when "I got my home studio built" so glad I was advised to try a better mic...really makes it a LOT easier to sing without having to scream...the vocal nuances are so easy to express with a good mic...had no idea what a difference it made on the performing side.

BTW the piano is a Yamaha MOX8 using a sustain pedal directly out into the stereo...no mixing or extra effects...factory sound..actually the first one on the buttons "Grand Piano"..the keyboard has a ton of sounds that can get me lost for hours...need to stay on track..

Kind of try and stay in the loop on music but sadly I had never heard of Anthony and Johnsons... checked out his stuff on Youtube...yeah he's got a cool schtick going on...not a fan of the tremolo vocal thing but really awesome interpretations of various covers. I definitely see where we are on similar wave lengths..

Yeah, the piano on your version definitely sounds fuller and I much prefer it. Rihanna's overall sound just doesn't do anything for me, but yours sounds good.

Thanks for posting an earlier song with the SM57. The new ones do sound better, but whether that's partly down to different presets on your keys or not, I don't know. I used an sm58 for pretty much everything, so it's interesting to hear the difference another mic makes.

I did pick up on some background noise each time you sang on Stay - like a gate that cut out signals between phrases. I don't know whether this is a manual cut that you've made each time or if it's some kind of noise gate on the mic itself. This may be what Sound Diagnosis was alluding to, but I thought I'd mention it in case he means something different.

Kind of try and stay in the loop on music but sadly I had never heard of Anthony and Johnsons... checked out his stuff on Youtube...yeah he's got a cool schtick going on...not a fan of the tremolo vocal thing but really awesome interpretations of various covers. I definitely see where we are on similar wave lengths..

Yeah, he can go into warble overdrive sometimes and I think his voice can be something of an acquired taste, but it's usually kept more in check on the records than live recordings from what I've heard.

 

[TAE]

Yeah, the piano on your version definitely sounds fuller and I much prefer it. Rihanna's overall sound just doesn't do anything for me, but yours sounds good.

Gracias Compradre..

Thanks for posting an earlier song with the SM57. The new ones do sound better, but whether that's partly down to different presets on your keys or not, I don't know.

Same presets just volume adjustments between the keys and the mic.

I used an sm58 for pretty much everything, so it's interesting to hear the difference another mic makes.

I was blown away at the difference..and the added issue of noise ...in the past I never gave a second thought to the banging of the keys or the squeak of my sustain pedal..hell I had to change the chair I was sitting in because it had a slight squeak, think about what I was wearing ( a jacket that made noise when I moved my arms).......with this new powered mic yikes...SENSITIVE...........but the clarity...night and day..I know a lot of songs have been recorded live with sm57 and 58's and they work as did mine...and for live concerts you can't use a powered condenser mic because of all the exterior noise... but in my room I can control it enough to pull off live recordings of me playing the keys and singing at the same time. REALLY happy I pulled it out and am learning how to use it...a BIG difference.

I did pick up on some background noise each time you sang on Stay - like a gate that cut out signals between phrases.

Trying to figure that out I'm thinking it might actually be my headphones they have a hinge that does make a little noise..incredible..

I don't know whether this is a manual cut that you've made each time or if it's some kind of noise gate on the mic itself.

No...what you are hearing is the original take untouched afterwards.... I mean direct into a little sony stereo recorder then saved on the computer via it's usb drive. I did use the Audacity "normalize" effect on the last few tunes I've recorded but the whole idea here is to catch it live and that's that.