Alesis 12R insert question

[justwantyou2kno]

I'm looking to get a front end for my delta 1010 and was looking at the Alesis 12R mixer, but I just read in its manual that instead of plugging the cables in half way (like in Mackie mixers) they are saying to use a stereo splitter cable and plug the stereo end in the 12R insert and the two mono ends to the input and output of the channel. I use each of my outputs to make different headphone mixes while tracking. So it seems like if I have all my outputs going into the 12R it'll be impossible to do that, right? I know the 12R has a headphone out, but that doesn't give me that much flexibility in making different mixes for everybody in the band. And when you're using iserts as direct out, doesn't that bypass the EQ on the mixer??? Is anyone using a 12R? What do you guys do when tracking if all your outputs are being sent to the 12R? I'd love to hear your exact set-up of how you have the 12R while tracking. Thanks for any help.

Nick

 

[justwantyou2kno]

Anyone?

 

[skippy]

Well, I have a 12R in my E-Drum rack. However, I wasn't able to tell what you were trying to do with it- it's not clear what you need. It's just a small board, like any other small board. It doesn't have that many output _busses_, so you aren't going to be able to make a lot of differing mixes with it. The question about the insert steal- direct outs seems unrelated to what you are trying to do, since you don't talk about having other mixers to send the output _to_.

So let's get back to basics. How many inputs to the 12R are active, how many separate mixes do you need to come out of the 12R, how _exactly_ are you patching the 1010 to the 12R? It's not clear whether you are using the line ins, or whether you are trying to inject the signal via the insert point returns (bypassing the preamps and eq in the process).

I've read your original post several times, and I still don't have a clue what you're trying to do. Help us out, and maybe we can help you out. One thing's for sure- the 12R isn't that much mixer, so if you are trying to do really sophisticated things with it, you'll run out of oof pretty quickly...

 

[justwantyou2kno]

I want to use the mixer for the eight preamps, for eight different channles on my 1010. Can I use a normal mono cable and plug one side into insert 1 on the mixer and the other side into channel 1 of my recorder? I want to use each insert as a direct out, just like one would do with some of the mackie mixers that don't have direct outs. The inserts shouldn't bypass the preamp, just the EQ I think.

In the manual it tells you to use Y cables and plug the stereo side into the insert, and then plug the two mono sides of the cord into the input and output of your recorder. When you do this your recorder will get the signal, and the signal will be sent back to the mixer. Then you can listen to what your recording while your recording it, using the headphone output.

I want to send drums to the recorder, but not back to the mixer because I don't want to hear the drums in the headphone output. So I figure I'll use a Y cable for guitar and bass, and a normal mono cable for drums. I think when I do that, only guitar and bass will be heard through the headphone output.

I think that makes sense now.

 

[skippy]

Ahh! The light goes on. Yes, you should be able to do that- the insert points will allow you to split the channel right down the middle, and use the preamps and the mix busses entirely separately.

By using an insert cable (a Y cable, 1/4" TRS-to-2x1/4" TS), you can hook the output side of the insert cable to the inputs on your soundcard, and the return side of the insert to the outputs on your sound card. The tip on the TRS plug will be the send to the soundcard, and the ring will be the return from the soundcard.

The preamps and gain trim controls will be on the send side, and will act on the mic signals going out the send and into your soundcard inputs. The EQ, faders, and aux bus sends will be on the return side, and will act on the signals coming _out_ of the soundcard. That'll let you get 4 busses worth of mixing: one stereo pair and the two mono auxes. So realistically you can get 3 somewhat independent monitor mixes out of the unit. You only get _somewhat_ independent mixes, because the Aux2 send is post-fader: so changes to the mix on the main stereo pair will affect it.

The bad news here is that there is no zero-latency bypass path created by the mixer when you monitor this way (splitting the inserts entirely): all the outputs to your mix busses are by definition coming from the soundcard, which means that any latency inherent to those outputs will be present on your monitor mix. Now, I don't know a dadgum thing about the 1010: perhaps it has a zero-latency hardware monitoring path, in which case that last point is moot. But if the gozintas have to go through the A/D and D/A conversion with a buffer or two in the middle before they get to the comesoutas, the outputs you'll get will be delayed, and you may find that latency to be a problem in monitoring.

If that happens, you'll need to do the good old single-click insert steal for your mic preamps to the soundcard inputs (so that you can monitor with zero latency), and then repatch the soundcard outputs to the insert or line ins to do a final mix with the 12R . The real question is "does the 1010 have a zero-latency hardware monitoring mode?". If the answer is yes, you're in fat city...

Hope that helps.